Hyperinflated Ego … check
More interested in getting a laugh than debate… check
Misrepresentations … check
Constant demonization of anyone who disagrees … check
Has problems going longer than 15 minutes without mentioning Clinton or Kennedy… check
Full of sound and fury signifying nothing … check
Disinfotainer … check
Glosses over, without refutation, arguments of opponents … check
Unwavering support for the Republican party… check
Uncanny ability to “take the high road” … check
Meglomanical … check
Amusing, but worthless in an actual debate … check
You know Scylla, you gain a few pounds, develop an Oxycontin habit, and get a few more brainless sycophants and I see great things in your future!!
For those still interested in the issue, it appears that both Bell South and Verizon are denying that they turned over telephone records to the NSA. What credibility USA Today had could take a serious hit.
And I look forward to this administration’s newfound openness, especially with Hayden’s upcoming confirmation hearings.
Funny how it took them several days to issue the denials. While it’s always possible that it simply took several days for the head honchos at Verizon and BellSouth to ascertain that no hanky-panky was happening, another possibility is that the lag time was about getting the lawyers and the technicians together to craft the denials with the proper care, so that they’d look like they were denying making information about billions of calls available to the NSA, while leaving some loophole that would apply to their actual conduct.
I notice that Verizon’s denial was couched in terms of language about ‘providing data’ to NSA. If Verizon simply provided the NSA with access to their lines, couldn’t the NSA just scoop up the data on its own - and wouldn’t Verizon’s statement then be technically true?
And I look forward to being seduced by Catherine Zeta-Jones. We all have our fantasies.
Ignoring the facts … check
Ignoring the law (FISA, 4th Amendment, etc) … check
Ignoring documented lies and evasions from Der Chimper … check
Dipping into the “you’re all partisan” after always accusing the Dems and liberals … check
Depending on a drugged up lying radio scumbag for info … check
Insulting posters and then expecting respect in return … LOL ROLMAO
They’re telling the truth and USA Today, Qwest, and AT&T are lying. Why would they lie about something like that? Why, to embarass Bush, of course, because that’s what evil libruls do, because they hate America and love terrorists.
The “denials” are in fact non-denial denials crafted by lawyers and techs to simply make a headline that says “Verizon denies handing over information to NSA”. That way, the people who get all their news via headline will say “Oh, it’s all OK then.” They’ve probably been getting some pretty angry calls from their subscribers and are trying to cover their asses. They could also face criminal and civil liability on this issue and are preparing for litigation.
The phone companies recived National Security Letters instructing them to hand over the data. If those NSLs are worded like the ones libraries have been recieving, they have gag orders included which procludes them from telling the people whose records have been pulled that they are under investigation.
This whole story was a piece of disinformation deliberately planted with USA Today in order to discredit the paper and to undermine the credibility of Bush critics and all non-Bush-machine approved media. See also: National Guard, Dan Rather.
You will note that in one of my much maligned (yet curiously ignored) cites it says that in 1994 (IIRC,) under Bill Clinton [sub]blowjob, Lewinsky, rape, perjury[/sub] 500 million dollars was spent to install equiptment to provide the government with access to the information they might request by warrant or other lawful means.
As an old telephone person, I can say that if you want this information from a modern switch, you can no longer go to a central office and listen to the clicks. If there was a legitimate (with warrant) need to collect this information in a timely fashion, it would be impossible if the monitoring equipment were not pre-installed. So, doing this is actually necessary if you want to do things, like, for instance, catch terrorists before they blow anything up. Given that there was a law defining when these records could be collected, sounds reasonable.
Unless of course I were a paranoid right winger, who decides that for sure if the equipment existed the government would surely misuse it by collecting the information without a court order. But in 2001 my mind would be set at ease, because a Republican president would never do such a thing.
Oh, wait.
In other words, if you have a skeleton key for a hotel in order to be able to get into a room in case of suspected crime or emergency, it does not give you the right to wander into every room rummaging through the drawers.
That’s because you’ve made an error. I referred to and cited the Law Enforcement Act of 1994 in my post.
What you cite and refer to is the Foreign Intelligence and Surveillance Act of 1995.
Because they are two different acts referring to two different things they are a little different.
So, if someone has made a misrepresentation it is you. I assume that it was an honest mistake. However, I would ask that you be more careful in the future, as it fuels the likes of rjung, and he is stupid and ignorant and irresponsible enough in his statements without help.
We’re supposed to be fighting ignorance, not aiding it.
My integrity? Dude, you’ve leapt past silly into irrationality in 30 seconds flat, with a quick stop at Asshole for a fill-up. I apologize, and request we conduct an honest debate, and you say you weren’t offended, and go off on some ego trip that was, apparently, meant to be funny, all the while ignoring the actual debate. Now you’re back insulting my integrity. With every post, I question your sanity more and more. The one thing I no longer question is whether you’re a complete dick.
No. While I did try to be funny (you did say this was the pit and some snarkiness was to be expected, so I obliged, I seriously addressed your question about why it was important to discuss the motivations of Kennedy et al in their casting blame.
You have completely ignored that, and simply returned to insults. Check my last several posts. I’ve been debating the debate (except in our tiresome asides) you’ve been engaging in pure ad hominem attacks.
Yes. Seriously. I am. You started with this. You apologized for it. You immediately did it again. Grow the fuck up. If it’s wrong and you recognize it, then don’t do it.
If you recognize it, and you apologize for it, and you do it again immediately, then yes, I question the integrity of your apology. You’re responsible for your own actions. If you want to debate, than debate. If you want to cast insults, than cast insults. But don’t apologize, then do it again, and pretend like I’m making you do it, while wondering how can I doubt your integrity.
I see we have another conversation about a conversation on our hands; or possibly, another pissing contest about a pissing contest. Perhaps it would be best if I engage my fabled thread-killer application by repeating my post #174.
Oh, I see. I thought the debate was about the NSA and its newly revealed programs, and not about what Scylla thinks about Democrats. THAT was my mistake, forgetting that any thread that may reflect badly on this administration must be about what Scylla thinks about Democrats. I’m sorry I didn’t immediately bow to your redefintion of the “debate”, but here, I’ll help you out now that I understand, what the real debate is about:
I’ll tell you one telephone number the NSA will never get is Mary Jo Kopechne’s!!I’m surprised that Lewinski’s blowjob wasn’t caught on tape by the Echelon program!!! The one good thing is that Pelosi’s telephone calls aren’t even worth wiretapping!!!
Feel better?
Would you please decide whether you’re a poor wounded puppy or modern day Zeus, beyond the reach of us mere mortals. Cause I’m getting whiplash.
I honestly meant my apology, and your reaction, of hyperinflated importance and senselessness, was not the classy acceptance I had hoped for. And the comparison between you and Rush pretty much wrote itself, it was just too easy.
Debating and insults are not mutually exclusive, especially in the Pit. Acting the martyred, wilting flower, and then, in the next breath, the all-powerful warrior, and then, back to the wilting flower, in my opinion, is.
I’m definitely insulting you more than necessary in this thread. Nobody’s making me do it; I’m, on occasion, a right bastard, and, for whatever reason, you bring out the best of it. None of which has anything to do with my “integrity”.
Back in posts 135, 137, and others, you asked some questions. I spent a couple hours doing research into the answers to those questions, and presented my thoughts on the issues you raised. Those thoughts, and the questions I raised in them, were resounding ignored by you, instead you chose to lash out at the motives of anyone who questions the NSA’s behavior. Since those actions are, apparently, your definition of “debate”, I drew a comparison between you and Rush. You responded by questioning my “integrity.” And here we are, at the end (I hope) of a stupid pissing match that makes us both look like idiots. I am very sorry with how this thread turned out, in good part because of my own impatience with you and your “arguments”. But you are right that I have nobody to blame but myself. I can only hope the legions of Hamlet fans can look past this, and that we can continue to move forward together, for the good of the message board, nay, the country.
Thank you. You see, the real risk of what Bush is doing, and something that should concern people of all political persuasions, is that a record of abuse might make it harder to get any such system approved in the future. If a Republican president can claim that he is above the law, then a Democratic president can do the same thing.
Case in point - Nixon’s abuse of the intelligence system for political purposes was the cause of the law limiting cooperation between the FBI and CIA, which was certainly one of the many reasons the September 11 plot was not detected.
