# OK, ZPG: Let's get a room. I'm paying. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 21, 2016, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557 "2016-08-21T20:37:18Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 20
**Author:** ![pool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pool/32/4152_2.png) [@pool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pool)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/381 "2016-08-25T04:53:03Z")
If handshakes are off the table, am I to assume fisting is not an alternative? ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 4:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/382 "2016-08-25T04:54:46Z")
**jsgoddess** , thanks. Much appreciated. And, yes, holy fucksticks indeed. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 6:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/383 "2016-08-25T06:43:50Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I’m terrible at perceiving when people are trolls vs. sincere. It’s not her beliefs that I find so implausible, it’s her apparent perception that everyone other than Dopers thinks this is all perfectly normal and agrees with her 100%, and that we are the weird ones. That’s the part that I really find hard to believe. That these beliefs have somehow been tested among the general population and there has been zero pushback seems not only implausible, but impossible. If they have been tested within her cohort, then her cohort is most definitely screwed. The SDMB covers a whole data-group of folks from different ethnicities, genders, sexualities, educational and socio-economic levels AND countries in this world…and when EVERY ONE OF THEM reckons that ZPG is either a loon or a troll…well, the outcome is obvious really. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/384 "2016-08-25T07:06:16Z")
> [@jsgoddess](#): > > [Is Asking for Child Support Always the Best Thing To Do? - #43 by ZPG\_Zealot - In My Humble Opinion - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=13255741) > > [http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=13273352#post13273352](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=13273352#post13273352) These should be made into a sticky as well as her post about being cool with actually killing a baby herself. **Martian**. While I appreciate the results of your efforts and that she got enough rope to hang herself, I do have to agree with you that it should have been done differently. I do accept your apology. ---
**Author:** ![kambuckta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/53a042/32.png) [@kambuckta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kambuckta)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 7:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/385 "2016-08-25T07:47:18Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#): > > **Martian**. While I appreciate the results of your efforts and that she got enough rope to hang herself, I do have to agree with you that it should have been done differently. > > I do accept your apology. To be honest, I think you were finding offense in Martian’s posts where none was actually evident, let alone intended. IOW, I don’t think he owed you any apology, notwithstanding the loss of your child. And yes, I was here when Ian passed, and I cannot begin to imagine your pain. But to accuse posters of continuing to cause you pain because of their opinions or beliefs so long after seems somewhat crass to me. Martian was trying to backpedal big time. We’ve all done it, it’s part of being part of the SDMB. But when you chuck in such a clanger as you did Tokyo, there’s no dignified way out for the poster. And I think you know that. ---
**Author:** ![Channing\_Idaho\_Banks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/channing_idaho_banks/32/250_2.png) [@Channing\_Idaho\_Banks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Channing_Idaho_Banks)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 8:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/386 "2016-08-25T08:38:11Z")
What truly amazes me is just how outlandish virtually every single post is ZPGZ makes. I don’t think I could make such an outlandish post once in every thousand posts, however, here is this person who can basically up the weirdness factor every single time. She’s been doing this for years. There has to be a limit? Right? ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/387 "2016-08-25T10:53:21Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > It seems to me that, by this logic, if you had the chance to save either a baby or an adult from a fire, but not both, you should save the adult. That seems completely counterintuitive to me. An adult has a wider and deeper emotional web in society than an infant and will cause more pain to more people when they’re gone, e.g. parents and extended family they’ve known their whole life, lovers, friends, co-workers, possibly children of their own. Do you suppose a mother would be more devastated to lose her 22 year old or her infant? Pragmatically, society has invested a lot more resources into the adult as well, not only in dollars but man hours, e.g. doctors, teachers, coaches, and so on. People have a strong instinct to value and protect babies due to evolution, not this sort of analysis. A lot of people find such philosophical discussions by itself wrong somehow. Those intuitions can be leveraged to reach more compassionate positions, though. For example, infants are similarly or less cognitively capable than many animals we butcher and eat. Reflecting on this, some people decide it’s immoral to butcher animals, a position they may not have entertained otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Odds](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/d_odds/32/2882_2.png) [@D\_Odds](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Odds)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 1:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/388 "2016-08-25T13:01:36Z")
I didn’t at first make the connection, but **ZPGZ** is a female version of [Rat](http://www.gocomics.com/pearlsbeforeswine/2016/08/25). Or at least a version of Rat with all his good qualities removed. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/389 "2016-08-25T13:12:21Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > I’ve knocked up a woman and will be on the hook for child support. Killing only the child is off the table, for whatever reason. Let’s say the expectant mother is about to go into hiding, since she heard that you were in town, and after that I won’t be able to find her or the child. However, she won’t be doing it for the next couple of days. I ask your advice. Which of the following options should I choose? > > 1. Pay the child support. > 2. Kill the pregnant woman. > > And don’t go beating around the bush about the ideal society where blah blah should be allowed on this. Well, do that too, if you absolutely have to. But straight up answer first, please. It’s a very simple question. You have to way the risks if potentially defending yourself from a murder charge is less difficult for you than having to deal with paying child support for 18 years and decide based on that. But there are plenty of circumstances where the emotional stress bought on by an unwanted child’s birth and it’s subsequent effects on others lives are such that if I were sitting on the jury and a man killed his pregnant sex partner or spouse I would not be able to vote to him guilty of murder or manslaughter. I would find what he did a form of self-defense and justifiable. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 1:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/390 "2016-08-25T13:17:43Z")
> [@Channing\_Idaho\_Banks](#): > > What truly amazes me is just how outlandish virtually every single post is ZPGZ makes. I don’t think I could make such an outlandish post once in every thousand posts, however, here is this person who can basically up the weirdness factor every single time. She’s been doing this for years. There has to be a limit? Right? It truly amazes me how outlandish the idea that adults especially women have rights are to some people on the Straight Dope. Newsflash. Our wombs aren’t community property. ---
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/391 "2016-08-25T13:25:29Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > It truly amazes me how outlandish the idea that adults especially women have rights are to some people on the Straight Dope. Newsflash. Our wombs aren’t community property. Right. Women have rights unless the man does not want the baby. Then it’s ok to kill her. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/392 "2016-08-25T13:29:20Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > It truly amazes me how outlandish the idea that adults especially women have rights are to some people on the Straight Dope. Newsflash. Our wombs aren’t community property. Relax. In this market, nobody’s interested in a spacious fixer-upper. ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/393 "2016-08-25T14:32:55Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Besides you would probably get mad when I refused to shake your hands. The two of you could greet each other with a friendly headbutt instead? In all seriousness, I hope ZeePeeGee is just a very dedicated troll, cause if so, the worst she’s doing is riling up dopers. If, god forbid, she actually believes the warped views she’s shared with us, and is, as she claims, a “[wise woman](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11465229&postcount=60)” whose advice people seek in their moments of uncertainty and vulnerability, that is a very worrying thought. I knew a woman, “wise” she’d say, Who’d council those who’d lost their way; Whose words would make the children hush, And wisdom make the devil blush. My path had took an unseen turn; Blessed me with a precious bairn. And though a joy, the price was steep. “Pinch its nose and bury it deep.” I choked upon that grave advice, Regained my mind, then asked her twice. Her words echoed like an empty well. “Pinch its nose and bury it well.” Perhaps it were a joke, to goad. Or the words of one with a heavier load. But still that council haunts my sleep. “Pinch its nose and bury it deep.” ---
**Author:** ![Don\_t\_Panic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/don_t_panic/32/398_2.png) [@Don\_t\_Panic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_t_Panic)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/394 "2016-08-25T14:55:46Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > You have to way the risks if potentially defending yourself from a murder charge is less difficult for you than having to deal with paying child support for 18 years and decide based on that. But there are plenty of circumstances where the emotional stress bought on by an unwanted child’s birth and it’s subsequent effects on others lives are such that if I were sitting on the jury and a man killed his pregnant sex partner or spouse I would not be able to vote to him guilty of murder or manslaughter. I would find what he did a form of self-defense and justifiable. Look, you fucking loony toon. Did you even read my post? I know this is hilarious and all. But I asked you a straight-up question, I expect a straight-up answer. In this hypothetical, I’m a homicidal maniac, and your big and fancy sentences aren’t getting through to me. This is a “need answer fast” kind of situation. I have the woman right here. I have a gun pointed at her. I also have a gigantic budget to pay for my defense team, and we’ve cloned you a dozen times over to fill the jury with. So I’ll walk. Shoot her or not? Either follow your own shtick to the logical final step, or don’t and admit straight up that you’re a troll. A big, ugly, cowardly troll. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 2:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/395 "2016-08-25T14:57:23Z")
> [@Not\_Carlson](#): > > The two of you could greet each other with a friendly headbutt instead? > > In all seriousness, I hope ZeePeeGee is just a very dedicated troll, cause if so, the worst she’s doing is riling up dopers. > If, god forbid, she actually believes the warped views she’s shared with us, and is, as she claims, a “[wise woman](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=11465229&postcount=60)” whose advice people seek in their moments of uncertainty and vulnerability, that is a very worrying thought. > I knew a woman, “wise” she’d say, > Who’d council those who’d lost their way; > Whose words would make the children hush, > And wisdom make the devil blush. > > My path had took an unseen turn; > Blessed me with a precious bairn. > And though a joy, the price was steep. > “Pinch its nose and bury it deep.” > > I choked upon that grave advice, > Regained my mind, then asked her twice. > Her words echoed like an empty well. > “Pinch its nose and bury it well.” > > Perhaps it were a joke, to goad. > Or the words of one with a heavier load. > But still that council haunts my sleep. > “Pinch its nose and bury it deep.” Alright, you just made the thread worth it. Thank you! ---
**Author:** ![Not\_Carlson](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/bc79bd/32.png) [@Not\_Carlson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Not_Carlson)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/396 "2016-08-25T15:30:44Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > Alright, you just made the thread worth it. Thank you! Kind of you to say so. Troll or not, ZPG’s words were just so shockingly vile that they echoed around my skull until I felt compelled to don my beret and to put them into poetry. “Pinch its nose!” For fucks sake. I pray that I’m just a hand-wringing rube falling for a long-game trolling. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/397 "2016-08-25T15:46:04Z")
> [@enipla](#): > > Right. Women have rights unless the man does not want the baby. Then it’s ok to kill her. Neither party has the right to force the other to become a parent. If a man tries to prevent a woman from getting an abortion (by taking her hostage or preventing her from entering a clinic) I think she is well within her rights to kill her in order to get a safe abortion. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/398 "2016-08-25T15:50:58Z")
> [@Martian Bigfoot](#): > > Look, you fucking loony toon. Did you even read my post? I know this is hilarious and all. But I asked you a straight-up question, I expect a straight-up answer. In this hypothetical, I’m a homicidal maniac, and your big and fancy sentences aren’t getting through to me. This is a “need answer fast” kind of situation. I have the woman right here. I have a gun pointed at her. I also have a gigantic budget to pay for my defense team, and we’ve cloned you a dozen times over to fill the jury with. So I’ll walk. Shoot her or not? > > Either follow your own shtick to the logical final step, or don’t and admit straight up that you’re a troll. A big, ugly, cowardly troll. I’ve answered the question quite well. You seem to have problems with reading comprehension. Out of principle (and concern for legal entanglement) I do not give people orders to do things (unless they are teenagers living under my roof with unfinished chores). I only advise them what I would do in the circumstance (which would be kill the woman if necessary to avoid unwanted parenthood) and expect them as adults to make up their own minds. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/399 "2016-08-25T15:55:45Z")
> [@octopus](#): > > How about a hug? Chest to chest but with no sexual thoughts on the mind. Purely platonic? I don’t believe platonic is possible. I don’t touch men I am not married to or women I am not friends with, so no you don’t get a hug. Since I don’t think I would trust you in business deal without a written legal contract, you don’t get a gloved handshake either. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557/400 "2016-08-25T15:56:17Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > Neither party has the right to force the other to become a parent. If a man tries to prevent a woman from getting an abortion (by taking her hostage or preventing her from entering a clinic) I think she is well within her rights to kill her in order to get a safe abortion. What if he tries to force an abortion she doesn’t want? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557.md?page=19) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ok-zpg-lets-get-a-room-im-paying/763557.md?page=21)