# Okay, it's time to get this straight (Watchmen) \[Open Spoilers\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 14, 2008, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924 "2008-08-14T01:20:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 13\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/41 "2008-08-15T15:50:34Z")
[QUOTE=Rocketeer] I dug out my issues of Watchmen and did a quick scan-through. I was confusing the earlier scene in which Adrian is attacked in the building lobby, which I’m pretty darned sure was a fake … [/QUOTE] It was real. It was a genuine hitman, armed with a real gun, actually trying to kill Adrian, The only thing about it was that Adrian set it up. He knew there would be a hit coming, but not exactly where when or how. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/42 "2008-08-15T15:53:36Z")
[QUOTE=Peter Morris] It was real. It was a genuine hitman, armed with a real gun, actually trying to kill Adrian, The only thing about it was that Adrian set it up. He knew there would be a hit coming, but not exactly where when or how. [/QUOTE] I pretty much agree. Adrian Veidt is pretty much Batman, or Chuck Norris: so much physically superior to a norm that a frontal assault using only a handgun is suicide. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/43 "2008-08-15T16:03:59Z")
[QUOTE=Rocketeer] I dug out my issues of Watchmen and did a quick scan-through. I was confusing the earlier scene in which Adrian is attacked in the building lobby, which I’m pretty darned sure was a fake, with the scene at the end where Laurie shoots him. [/quote] The lobby hit was a “fake” in the sense that Veidt set it up to draw suspicion away from him. He basically told one of his employees “I need this person killed. Here’s the name in a sealed envelope. Hire a hitter, but to protect yourself, don’t read the name.” Then that employee passed the envelope to another employee (the deliveryman) who hired Roy Chess, who opened the envelope and read the target was Veidt himself, though Chess didn’t know the connection between the guy who hired him and Veidt. Possibly there was other information in the envelope describing the time and place of the hit, so Veidt wouldn’t be completely surprised by it, but in any case I see no reason to think Roy Chess wasn’t making a sincere effort to whack Veidt. > [@](#): > > Could we postulate that Veidt gave his guards guns filled with reduced-power rounds? After all, Veidt anticipated that a group would come to try to stop him, and an obvious thing for that group to do, especially Rorschach, would be to appropriate a guard’s weapon. It would be an obvious precaution to incapacitate any weapons that could be used against him. And what the heck, a guard would just be window dressing anyway, useless against Manhattan. Laurie didn’t take the gun from one of Veidt’s guards - she took it from the corpse of a New York detective: chapter 12, page 8. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/44 "2008-08-15T16:29:14Z")
> [@Rocketeer](#): > > But what happened to all that kinetic energy? Handgun bullets, especially at close range, aren’t going to be stopped by flesh and , no matter how skilled at martial arts the target is. Yes, in the real world no human could catch a bullet. Fortunately for Veidt, he was catching the bullet in a comic book, where real world rules don’t apply. _Watchmen_ defies physics and common sense on almost every page. The character of Dr. Manhattan alone is one great physical impossibility, from his disintegration/reintegration to his godlike omnipotence. What was the engergy source for his anti-thermodynamic miracles? How did every other superhero fight crime? How does an out of shape guy and a skinny girl beat off six young gang members? How come someone just didn’t beat the crap out of a little guy like Rorschach? I’m really confused how you can swallow everything else in the book and this one scene is the one you strain at. ---
**Author:** ![lawoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/35a633/32.png) [@lawoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawoot)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/45 "2008-08-15T16:39:10Z")
So even the greatest martial artists can’t catch a bullet. So what? They also can’t fly, or run on top of bamboo forests, or make themselves invisible, yet these are all commonly accepted norms of the genre (at least in the movies). It’s called _entertainment_ and shouldn’t be taken so seriously. ---
**Author:** ![WordMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e8c25b/32.png) [@WordMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WordMan)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/46 "2008-08-15T16:42:30Z")
[Hijack] As I asked in the thread about the trailer - do you pronounce it “Veet” “Vate” or “Vight”? It was all over the place in the last thread… [/hijack] ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/47 "2008-08-15T16:43:33Z")
[QUOTE=Skald the Rhymer] …Veidt isn’t a Republic serial villain, after all… [/QUOTE] Heh. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/48 "2008-08-15T17:14:18Z")
[QUOTE=Larry Borgia] The character of Dr. Manhattan alone is one great physical impossibility, from his disintegration/reintegration to his godlike omnipotence. [/QUOTE] I like how this is sort of acknowledged by other characters’ reactions to him. Instead of being amazed at delighted at what he can do, people are horrified, shocked, even sickened, as if their brains can’t accept what’s in front of them. (And when his “uniform” had shrunk to the point where it was just a black thong – that was more disturbing than just being naked.) ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/49 "2008-08-15T17:23:36Z")
[QUOTE=Larry Borgia] How come someone just didn’t beat the crap out of a little guy like Rorschach? [/QUOTE] _Hurm. Joking, of course._ ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ea5d25/32.png) [@Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Scrappy_Hero_Pup)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/50 "2008-08-15T18:12:38Z")
[QUOTE= Larry Borgia] How does an out of shape guy and a skinny girl beat off six young gang members? [/QUOTE] This is perhaps a question better suited for GD. [sub]…of a porn site…[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![tim314](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tim314/32/3468_2.png) [@tim314](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tim314)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/51 "2008-08-15T19:02:34Z")
[QUOTE=Larry Borgia] Yes, in the real world no human could catch a bullet. Fortunately for Veidt, he was catching the bullet in a comic book, where real world rules don’t apply. _Watchmen_ defies physics and common sense on almost every page. The character of Dr. Manhattan alone is one great physical impossibility, from his disintegration/reintegration to his godlike omnipotence. What was the engergy source for his anti-thermodynamic miracles? How did every other superhero fight crime? How does an out of shape guy and a skinny girl beat off six young gang members? How come someone just didn’t beat the crap out of a little guy like Rorschach? [/QUOTE] I get the point you’re trying to make, but I don’t really think the example of Dr. Manhattan is relevant. In sci-fi or fantasy there are elements that are clearly not supposed to follow real world rules, and other elements that ostensibly are supposed to follow real world rules. E.g., if I’m watching Star Trek, I can suspend disbelief over the fact that they have transporters and warp drive, or even over the god-like powers of aliens like Q – but if Captain Picard starts flying around the bridge by flapping his arms, I’m going to object. Likewise, we’re clearly supposed to accept that Dr. Manhattan is less subject to real world physical laws than the other characters. That said, I agree that even “normal” humans in comic books, like in martial arts and action movies, tend to be portrayed as somewhat superhuman. And I do think we’re meant to understand that Veidt really caught the bullet with his own abilities. Personally, I can accept this as a convention of the genre. I’m just saying it’s a _different_ convention than the “magic – or futuristic science indistinguishable from magic – exists” convention that applies to Dr. Manhattan. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/52 "2008-08-15T20:22:09Z")
**Tim314** that’s a good point about the difference between Dr. M and Ozymandias. However, it’s also true, as you note, that it’s a convention in comics that an ordinary non-powered human can train themselves to do things no real human can do, including catching bullets. If you question Ozymandias’s bullet catching abilities that opens the gate (IMO) to questioning all the implausibilities of _Watchmen_ and of any other comic/SF/Fantasy/action movie/etc. **HSHP** , most amusing. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2008, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924/53 "2008-08-15T20:48:28Z")
There _was_ blood, though, wasn’t there? So he must have done _something_ to it… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-its-time-to-get-this-straight-watchmen-open-spoilers/459924.md?page=2)