# Okay, now it's time to put antifa in the same class as racists **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [August 28, 2017, 10:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922 "2017-08-28T10:38:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 9
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/161 "2017-08-30T14:56:03Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > Do bear that in mind if you encounter a bunch of hate-group marchers who express to your wife the idea that they hope she “gets raped by a nigger”. Despising them is the appropriate response to that. Saying that to her has not harmed her, so any further response would be excessive, no matter how tempting it may be. > [@](#): > > I still maintain that punching somebody in the face, even for using disgusting racist insults, is worse **behavior** (at least in the sense of being more illegal) than the actual expression of the insults. But I would be very, very hesitant to conclude that the puncher in that case must be a worse **person** than the insulter. I would agree with you there. One unacceptable action under provocation doesn’t make someone a bad person, whereas using that sort of insult pretty much means someone’s a dick, or seriously mentally ill. It’s my opinion that the consequences for being a dick (outside of work) should be social, not legal or professional, where that dickery doesn’t directly harm someone. There’s a practical advantage to allowing people with despicable views to express them - it means we know who those people are, so if they do progress to harming people it will be easier to find them. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/162 "2017-08-30T14:56:32Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No, advocating for _any_ position harms no-one. Bullshit. Advocating that the Jews should be exterminated increases the likelihood that others might decide that this is a good idea, thus greatly increasing the chances of massive harm to Jews. > [@](#): > > Those things are actions, not speech. They are fundamentally different. And those things are only worse than punching someone in degree, not kind. Trying to suppress speech is different in kind, and I consider worse. Speech is a kind of action. That doesn’t mean it should be treated the same by law – it shouldn’t. Advocacy for hateful ideas must remain legal. But it’s still incredibly morally wrong. I’ll note again that the only disagreement here is about morality, not about law. > [@](#): > > Punching someone in the face _to silence them_ is worse than either. No it’s not. That’s a trivial moral sin compared to advocating for genocide or slavery. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/163 "2017-08-30T15:02:23Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > It’s good to know that I can get away with threatening people with death as long as I don’t name them personally and don’t ask anyone in particular to carry it out. And as a bonus I can indirectly threaten their entire family with death at the same time. Winning! No, you can’t threaten them, that’s the point. Saying “all gays should be killed”, for example, is not a threat to me. Saying “I’m going to kill that dirty bottomist **Steophan** ” is a threat, and saying to **ThirdParty** “go kill some gentlemen of the lavender persuasion” would be incitement. In short, people have the right to express support for Nazi values, and I value that right despite the fact that I would probably have been in the camps (for 2 or 3 reasons, depending on how you count). ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/164 "2017-08-30T15:05:11Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No, you can’t threaten them, that’s the point. Saying “all gays should be killed”, for example, is not a threat to me. Saying “I’m going to kill that dirty bottomist **Steophan** ” is a threat, and saying to **ThirdParty** “go kill some gentlemen of the lavender persuasion” would be incitement. > > In short, people have the right to express support for Nazi values, and I value that right despite the fact that I would probably have been in the camps (for 2 or 3 reasons, depending on how you count). I also value that right – my high value on the right to free speech doesn’t conflict in any way with my extreme moral disapproval of advocacy for white supremacism. ---
**Author:** ![Steophan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steophan/32/9595_2.png) [@Steophan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steophan)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/165 "2017-08-30T15:06:06Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Bullshit. Advocating that the Jews should be exterminated increases the likelihood that others might decide that this is a good idea, thus greatly increasing the chances of massive harm to Jews. Increasing the chance of a third party harming someone is not harming someone, and should not be treated the same. > [@](#): > > No it’s not. That’s a trivial moral sin compared to advocating for genocide or slavery. That is ultimately a matter of opinion, I guess. I believe that violently silencing people is about the most harmful thing that can be done to a society, in the long run. I’ve formed that belief by looking at the societies that violently suppress speech - fascist, communist, theocratic - and comparing them to democratic, open societies that value speech. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/166 "2017-08-30T15:18:30Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No, you can’t threaten them, that’s the point. Saying “all gays should be killed”, for example, is not a threat to me. Saying “I’m going to kill that dirty bottomist **Steophan** ” is a threat, and saying to **ThirdParty** “go kill some gentlemen of the lavender persuasion” would be incitement. Saying “gays should be killed” while marching past gay people isn’t a threat? It isn’t deliberately intended to intimidate and frighten gay people regardless of whether the marchers know whether a given individual is gay or not? It isn’t an expression of what the marchers would like to do - indeed, might do, given superior numbers and an absence of law enforcement - if they found out an individual were gay? > [@](#): > > In short, people have the right to express support for Nazi values, and I value that right despite the fact that I would probably have been in the camps (for 2 or 3 reasons, depending on how you count). People do have the right to express support for Nazi values. People have the right to express objection to Nazi values. People do not have the right to punch people expressing dissenting views. But nonetheless there exist times - extreme times, to be sure - when violent resistance becomes necessary. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/167 "2017-08-30T15:29:23Z")
Bike locks are cars. Wine bottles are bullets. Antifa are the same as white supremacists. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/168 "2017-08-30T15:36:22Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > Increasing the chance of a third party harming someone is not harming someone, and should not be treated the same. I agree it shouldn’t be treated the same – free speech must remain legal. But morally speaking, I judge them on how much harm they cause, and in my judgment, advocacy for genocide clearly causes a lot more harm than punching someone. > [@](#): > > That is ultimately a matter of opinion, I guess. I believe that violently silencing people is about the most harmful thing that can be done to a society, in the long run. I’ve formed that belief by looking at the societies that violently suppress speech - fascist, communist, theocratic - and comparing them to democratic, open societies that value speech. But we’re talking about individuals, not societies. As far as societies, white supremacist societies are as bad as they come, when taken to the extreme – certainly as bad as the worst fascist (which obviously overlapped), communist, and theocratic societies, which can all be just as bad. But for individuals, I judge advocacy for white supremacism as far worse than an individual trying to use non-lethal violence to suppress white supremacist speech, even if I also morally oppose such use of violence. ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/169 "2017-08-30T15:50:06Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I agree it shouldn’t be treated the same – free speech must remain legal. > > But morally speaking, I judge them on how much harm they cause, and in my judgment, advocacy for genocide clearly causes a lot more harm than punching someone. > > But we’re talking about individuals, not societies. As far as societies, white supremacist societies are as bad as they come, when taken to the extreme – certainly as bad as the worst fascist (which obviously overlapped), communist, and theocratic societies, which can all be just as bad. > > But for individuals, I judge advocacy for white supremacism as far worse than an individual trying to use non-lethal violence to suppress white supremacist speech, even if I also morally oppose such use of violence. To say the Confederacy was worse than Nazi Germany, the USSR, Khmer Rouge Cambodia; even Caliphite ISISLand is ludicrous. I know you have your unique fetishes but reality must shine through. While slavery was a great evil the purpose of the South was not to exterminate the Slaves. How are the Africans that sold their countrymen into slavery any better than WS? How are the Arabic slavers who slaved far longer than whites any better? The Khan Mongels? The sins of our species are owned by all of us regardless of race. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/170 "2017-08-30T15:56:50Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > To say the Confederacy was worse than Nazi Germany, the USSR, Khmer Rouge Cambodia; even Caliphite ISISLand is ludicrous. Then it’s a good thing I didn’t say this! > [@](#): > > I know you have your unique fetishes but reality must shine through. While slavery was a great evil the purpose of the South was not to exterminate the Slaves. I’ll argue that American slavery, as a whole, was as bad (but not worse – we’re talking as bad as humans can possibly get for things like American slavery, the Holocaust, Holodomor, Khmer genocide, etc.) as any other atrocity in the last few centuries of human history. Slavery resulted in the brutalization, rape, and murder of millions. When someone is raped and brutalized all their lives, and dies in their 20s or 30s due to long mistreatment and lack of care, I think it’s entirely reasonable to place that on the same moral plane as murder. > [@](#): > > How are the Africans that sold their countrymen into slavery any better than WS? How are the Arabic slavers who slaved far longer than whites any better? The Khan Mongels? They’re not. Where do you get the impression I thought any differently? ---
**Author:** ![madsircool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madsircool/32/3432_2.png) [@madsircool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madsircool)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/171 "2017-08-30T16:05:09Z")
Extermination will always be morally worse than slavery. Had we a Nazi Confederacy, how many Black people would be alive today? Just because its not the worst that humanity is capable of doesn’t mean it wasn’t a great evil. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/172 "2017-08-30T16:05:38Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > The sins of our species are owned by all of us regardless of race. That’s a weaselly pant-load and a convenient way to imply that nobody can be held responsible for anything because everybody is complicit in some way or another at some point through human history. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/173 "2017-08-30T16:06:41Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Also they tend to show up to protest in opposition to white supremacist/neo-nazi/KKK rallies, while the racists scum gather to boost their own moral. Right or wrong, they see themselves as a defensive measure. Looking at some of the so called alt-right’s actions and views, that is not completely unreasonable. Also, looking at the serious lack of timely and adequate response by Charlottesvile police to right wing violence, it MAY be justified. > **[Charlottesville Cops Refused to Protect Synagogue](https://www.newsweek.com/charlottesville-police-refused-protect-synagogue-nazis-so-it-hired-armed-651260)** > > President of town's synagogue says armed supremacists stood across the street shouting "Sieg Heil!" > [@](#): > > Charlottesville **Police Refused to Protect Synagogue From Nazis** , so Jewish Community Hired Armed Security for First Time > The Jewish community in Charlottesville hired armed security to protect its synagogue for the first time after local police declined to provide a guard for the site despite hundreds of white supremacists congregating on the town over the weekend for a rally that resulted in the murder of counter-protester Heather Heyer. > > Alan Zimmerman, president of the Congregation Beth Israel in the Virginia town, wrote a blog post published on Monday evening following the violent scenes on Saturday that resulted in a car-ramming attack that took place just 200 feet from the place of worship. > > He described the fear he felt in the presence of white supremacists, who rallied around anti-Semitic slogans, as 40 members of the community prayed in the synagogue, without support from the local authorities. > > “For half an hour, three men dressed in fatigues and armed with semi-automatic rifles stood across the street from the temple,” he wrote. “Had they tried to enter, I don’t know what I could have done to stop them, but I couldn’t take my eyes off them, either.” > > Not only did armed protesters stand across from the synagogue, but neo-Nazis paraded past the building, shouting anti-Semitic slogans, a horrible reminder of Nazi Germany’s persecution and mass slaughter of European Jews. > > “Several times, parades of Nazis passed our building, shouting, ‘There’s the synagogue!’ followed by chants of ‘Sieg Heil’ and other anti-Semitic language. Some carried flags with swastikas and other Nazi symbols,” Zimmerman wrote. > > This was before James Alex Fields Jr. plowed his car into protesters in the town, leaving a scene of carnage that has sparked outrage across the United States, and the wider western world. > **[Police in Charlottesville criticized for slow response to violent demonstrations](https://www.chicagotribune.com/2017/08/12/police-in-charlottesville-criticized-for-slow-response-to-violent-demonstrations/)** > > Police in Charlottesville, Virginia, came under criticism for failing to keep apart warring white nationalists and counter-protesters who battled it out in the city streets on Saturday amid what at… > [@](#): > > Police in Charlottesville criticized for slow response to violent demonstrations > > Anger over the how police responded came from all directions and intensified after the deaths of a woman struck by a car that plowed into a group of counter protesters. Experts said police appeared outnumbered, ill-prepared and inexperienced. > “The worst part is that people got hurt and the police stood by and didn’t do a godd---- thing,” said David Copper, 70, of Staunton, Va., after an initial morning melee at a park that when unchecked by police for several minutes. > > Fourteen people were injured in clashes; nine others were hurt in the car crash. Later, two Virginia State Police troopers were killed when their helicopter smashed into trees at the edge of town and burst into flames. The loss of police officers only compounded the calamity on a day that pushed police, city officials and residents to their limits … Complicating the dynamics was the fact that several dozen groups of armed militia – men in full camouflage toting assault-style weapons – were in the middle of the crowds. Some claimed that they were there to keep the peace, although none were seen trying to stop the skirmishes. > > Cornel West, the Princeton professor and writer who attended a morning church service at First Baptist Church in Charlottesville with a large group of clergy members, said “the police didn’t do anything in terms of protecting the people of the community, the clergy.” West said that “if it hadn’t been for the anti fascists protecting us from the neo-fascists, we would have been crushed like cockroaches.” > **[Video Shows Man Shooting At Crowd During Charlottesville Rally, With No...](https://www.huffpost.com/entry/richard-preston-arrested-shooting-gun-charlottesville-rally_n_59a20a39e4b06d67e3380e37)** > > The ACLU documented the incident two weeks ago, and the man has now been arrested in connection with it. > [@](#): > > Video Shows **Man Shooting At Crowd** During Charlottesville Rally, **With No Police Response** > > The ACLU documented the incident two weeks ago, and the man has now been arrested in connection with it. > [https://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/59a22eed1e00003c00a74553.png?ops=scalefit\_720\_noupscale](https://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/59a22eed1e00003c00a74553.png?ops=scalefit_720_noupscale) > A man attending the white supremacist rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, earlier this month fired his gun in the direction of a black counterprotester who was holding a torch, and police in their vicinity did not seem to respond. > Those events appear in a video filmed two weeks ago by a volunteer with the American Civil Liberties Union of Virginia and published by the civil rights group on Saturday. > As seen in the footage below, a man in a blue sleeveless shirt, a green vest and a bandana on his head pulls out a gun and aims it at a counterprotester, who is off camera and appears to be holding a makeshift lit torch. The first man appears to yell a racial slur at the black man, then fires the gun toward the ground in the direction of the counterprotesters. > The shooter then leaves the scene by joining a line of white supremacist protesters and walking past law enforcement officers, who were standing behind metal barricades about 10 feet away. … Rosia Parker, a Charlottesville activist who was there when the man fired his gun, told the New York Times that police did nothing when the shooting occurred. > > “We all heard it and ran ― I know damn well they heard it,” Parker told the Times, referencing the police who were standing behind the barricades. “They never moved.” > … Only eight people were arrested on the day that violence broke out between white supremacists, fringe groups and anti-racism protesters in Charlottesville, according to the Times. Among those arrested was James Fields, a 20-year-old white supremacist who killed 32-year-old Heather Heyer and injured dozens of others when he rammed his car into a group of counterprotesters. > Two other arrests were made in connection with another violent crime caught on video that took place during the rally. Police arrested Daniel Patrick Borden, 18, and Alex Michael Ramos, 33, in connection with the beating of Deandre Harris, a black 20-year-old who was protesting the white supremacy rally. > > A mob of white supremacists beat Harris with metal poles in a parking lot **near police headquarters** during the rally, leaving Harris bloodied, with a broken wrist, deep gashes to the head and a chipped tooth. The assault on Harris was filmed and shared widely on social media. ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/174 "2017-08-30T16:09:05Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > They’re not. Where do you get the impression I thought any differently? Because you are not telling these africans and arabs and mongols that have been dead for centuries that they should also change their ways. You are asking white people to change their ways, and white people do not need to change their ways as long as there was someone in the past that was worse. So, if you want to blame anyone, you need to blame these people that are dead and gone, and convince them to become more socially acceptable. Once you’ve done that, then you have permission to criticize modern society. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/175 "2017-08-30T16:10:15Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Extermination will always be morally worse than slavery. Had we a Nazi Confederacy, how many Black people would be alive today? > > Just because its not the worst that humanity is capable of doesn’t mean it wasn’t a great evil. If I punch you in the nose for advocating for slavery or genocide, or intimidate you when you express these views, am I a worse person than you for having prevented/discouraged you from pursuing such policies? ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/176 "2017-08-30T16:11:52Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > To say the Confederacy was worse than Nazi Germany, the USSR, Khmer Rouge Cambodia; even Caliphite ISISLand is ludicrous. I know you have your unique fetishes but reality must shine through. While slavery was a great evil the purpose of the South was not to exterminate the Slaves. > > How are the Africans that sold their countrymen into slavery any better than WS? How are the Arabic slavers who slaved far longer than whites any better? The Khan Mongels? > > The sins of our species are owned by all of us regardless of race. So then everything is morally relative and no one has the duty to oppose evil? I hope that is not what you are saying. ---
**Author:** ![raventhief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/raventhief/32/4_2.png) [@raventhief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raventhief)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/177 "2017-08-30T16:17:43Z")
> [@Steophan](#): > > No, you can’t threaten them, that’s the point. Saying “all gays should be killed”, for example, is not a threat to me. Saying “I’m going to kill that dirty bottomist **Steophan** ” is a threat, and saying to **ThirdParty** “go kill some gentlemen of the lavender persuasion” would be incitement. > > In short, people have the right to express support for Nazi values, and I value that right despite the fact that I would probably have been in the camps (for 2 or 3 reasons, depending on how you count). A bunch of people carrying weapons and torches marching around your house, chanting “kill the gays” isn’t any kind of threat to you? \*assuming you are gay, I have no idea. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/178 "2017-08-30T16:19:04Z")
> [@madsircool](#): > > Extermination will always be morally worse than slavery. I think slavery has a better outcome than genocide, but I still don’t think locking up someone in your basement and raping and brutalizing them for 30 years until they die is any less evil than killing them on day 1. But opinions on morality can differ, quite obviously. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/179 "2017-08-30T16:22:32Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I think slavery has a better outcome than genocide, but I still don’t think locking up someone in your basement and raping and brutalizing them for 30 years until they die is any less evil than killing them on day 1. > > But opinions on morality can differ, quite obviously. I can’t believe we’re even having this fucking conversation. :mad: ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 2017, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922/180 "2017-08-30T16:40:48Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > I can’t believe we’re even having this fucking conversation. :mad: This is how low shit has gone. At one time there would have been no question or discussion about it. Welcome to the so called “normalization”. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922.md?page=8) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/okay-now-its-time-to-put-antifa-in-the-same-class-as-racists/794922.md?page=10)