# Old Hollywood, family research, fashion, lost inheritances, & picking Eve's brain **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 18, 2006, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943 "2006-03-18T23:27:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2006, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/1 "2006-03-18T23:27:31Z")
Welcome to my little side project. In the past I’ve posted about my paternal grandfather, who was a stuntman for Warner Bros. in the 30’s and 40’s, including some recognizable scenes in _The Adventures of Robin Hood_ with Errol Flynn. Prompted by stumbling upon an IMDB entry under his name for some uncredited cavalry rider roles he’d played, I’m attempting to document his life and his work and flesh out his IMDB site as best I can. Some family history… My grandfather and grandmother parted ways when my father was very young, with my grandfather moving from Chicago to Southern California. My father was raised in Chicago by my grandmother and her sisters, and didn’t see his father very much during his life. Aside from a short visit now and then, if my father was willing to take a trip to California, they didn’t have a very close relationship. My grandfather eventually married another woman whom he met during his years of working in Hollywood. She was a successful fashion and costume designer, and they spent the rest of their lives together. She had children from a previous marriage, and though my father visited and got along well with his father’s new family, my father continued to keep his distance, preferring to remain largely isolated from any of his surviving family, even on his mother’s side, for the majority of his life. Even though they didn’t have the closest of relationships, my father was very proud of my grandfather and his work. One of the things that was passed from father to son was a love for stunt-fighting, swordfighting and fencing, riding horses, and collecting medieval weaponry and armor. My grandfather passed away when my older brother was very young, and before I was born. While my father wasn’t much for writing things down to remember later, his was rich with oral tradition, and my brother and I were raised with stories that incorporated the few details that could be remembered about my grandfather’s stuntwork. Sadly, my father and I never did get around to documenting those details prior to his death in 2002. It is also in honor of my father’s memory that I continue my amatuer research endeavors. Interestingly, my father’s habit of falling off the face of the planet with respect to his family, indirectly resulted in a modest inheritance going to a Southern California charity instead of to our family. The daughter of my grandfather’s second wife had left my father $200,000 out of the family estate (money that I assume was a result of the fashion and costume design company), but there was a stipulation in the will that if my father passed before his sister-in-law, that the money would go to a charity instead. My mother found all of this out when she received a letter explaining the charity contribution. My mother never really understood my father’s desire of keeping his distance from his family, but she respected it. My father’s passing was sudden, but his health had been deteriorating for about 6 months. She is still kicking herself for not getting in touch with my father’s sister-in-law while he was sick or after his death, while his sister-in-law was still alive. My mother is convinced that she would’ve changed the will if she’d known that my father had a family. I just think it makes for an interesting story. Easy come, easy go. Who would’ve thought I’d ever be in any way connected to Hollywood fashion money? Getting to the point… What I have to work with are a couple of scrapbooks full of action shots involving my grandfather in various states of falling off of rearing and bucking horses, pet trained horses, illegible scribbles of alleged film titles that don’t return IMDB results, and the (admitedly awful) collective memories of myself, my brother, and my mom. One long-held family belief involving my grandfather’s work in _The Adventures of Robin Hood_ experienced a bit of a reality check earlier today. My copy of the 2 disc special edition DVD arrived in this morning’s mail. I quickly skipped to the Rudy Behlmer commentary for the scenes that (I thought) included my grandfather. The first, a short view of my grandfather as a castle guard taking an arrow to the chest, went by with no direct commentary. The second, a rather impressive stunt that involved holding onto the end of the cut castle gate rope and being lifted to the top of the castle gate, received direct commentary attributing the stunt to two stuntment, neither of which were my grandfather. I was simultaneously saddened and encouraged. While I had spent my life up to about an hour ago believing that that was my grandfather holding onto that rope, only to discover my family was apparently mistaken, I was eager to find out exactly how Rudy Behlmer knew so much about the stunt work, and even more eager to find out if I could gain access to that information as well. And even though some of my grandfather’s stunts might not have been as I was raised to believe, the arrow shot scene remains undeniably him. His face (the spitting image of my brother) is clearly visible, and with the wonder of DVD, I was also able to find another related scene where he is visible. I’ve spent the day Googling, and even signed up for the IMDB Pro access, only to find that Rudy Behlmer has listed no contact information, nor does he have an agent listed. I’ve sent a couple of Hail Mary emails to publishers who are distributing some of his books, but I don’t know how successful they’re going to be at putting me in touch with him or someone who might help me. So…Eve…I’m hoping I might tap into some of your expertise and networking skills to dig up some leads for this little personal research project of mine. I would’ve emailed you, but since you don’t have that option in your profile, I’ve opted for a long-winded public appeal instead. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/2 "2006-03-19T00:04:11Z")
Hmmm . . . I’m not quite sure what to tell you (though I think I have heard of your grandfather and probably have his obit in my filing cabinet–what was his name?). What info specifically are you looking for? Books on Errol Flynn, or on stuntmen? **Walloon** can give you a lot more help with genaology than I can. Most of Flynn’s films were Warner Brothers–maybe find out if the studio keeps any records (not likely)? Placing a letter of inquiry in [Classic Images](http://classicimages.com/) might provide some info. ---
**Author:** ![Eve](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/9e8a1a/32.png) [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/3 "2006-03-19T00:08:12Z")
P.S. I Googled Rudy Behlmer, too, and unfortunately he hasn’t published with my company, and I’ve never met him. I’d send a letter to him via his most recent publisher–they really are pretty good at forwarding mail. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/4 "2006-03-19T00:25:04Z")
> [@Eve](#): > > Hmmm . . . I’m not quite sure what to tell you (though I think I have heard of your grandfather and probably have his obit in my filing cabinet–what was his name?). > > What info specifically are you looking for? Books on Errol Flynn, or on stuntmen? **Walloon** can give you a lot more help with genaology than I can. Most of Flynn’s films were Warner Brothers–maybe find out if the studio keeps any records (not likely)? > > Placing a letter of inquiry in [Classic Images](http://classicimages.com/) might provide some info. [Chad Trower](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0873865/) was his name. If you have his obit, I’m going to swallow my gum. The IMDB complied with an update request of mine, and linked his page to the Robin Hood page as an uncredited stunt double. Some of the other credited stuntman on Robin Hood have extensive IMDB entries, and I suppose that is where my first question lies. Does this mean that they were on the stuntman A list, and that even back in those days, the were credited at some level? Was my grandfather likely not on the A list? Did those guys have family members like me, but with amazingly more resources and time on their hands, who fleshed out their family members’ filmographies? My grandfather’s peers are no longer alive. Even the children of his peers may no longer be with us. If I can’t find a maven or two with obscure historical information about stuntfolk, or access to records of some kind, I’m going to be out of luck. If I can’t track down the descendants of my grandfather’s second family, I’m going to be pretty much out of luck. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/5 "2006-03-19T02:23:19Z")
I just sent you an email about an article from 1942 I found. You may already know the info. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/6 "2006-03-19T02:51:52Z")
Did you know his actual name was “Chadwick?” ---
**Author:** ![scotandrsn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a4c791/32.png) [@scotandrsn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scotandrsn)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/7 "2006-03-19T03:55:28Z")
You might see if the [Stuntmen’s Association](http://www.stuntmen.com/internal.html) can help. They weren’t founded until the early sixties, but their [history](http://www.stuntmen.com/about/history.shtml) page lists some names from around the time your grandfather was active, so maybe they know of a place to get such old information. The [Stunt Player’s Directory](http://www.stuntplayers.com/) site has a message forum much like the dope. Perhaps you could register there and see if there are any stunt history buffs around. ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/8 "2006-03-19T04:20:31Z")
> [@](#): > > **honeydewgrrl** : I was simultaneously saddened and encouraged. While I had spent my life up to about an hour ago believing that that was my grandfather holding onto that rope, only to discover my family was apparently mistaken, I was eager to find out exactly how Rudy Behlmer knew so much about the stunt work, and even more eager to find out if I could gain access to that information as well. I would not discount the family version at all. It is possible that Rudy Behlmer is relying on someone else’s faulty recollection of what someone else said or notes that he read long ago. Those details would not have been as important to him or the person that he got the information from as they would have been to your family who has taken so much pride in your grandfather’s work. I’m betting on your version. He would have to have a really sound source to top your authority if I were writing the book. _Certainly_ I would include your family’s notes. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/9 "2006-03-19T04:25:56Z")
Warner Bros.’ production records and legal papers from 1918 to 1968 are now at the [Warner Bros. Archives](http://www-cntv.usc.edu/resources/resources-wbarchive.cfm) at the University of Southern California. You can contact the curator at wbarchives@cinema.usc.edu. That is probably where Rudy Behlmer got a lot of the details for his commentary track on the _Robin Hood_ DVD. You may find confirmation of your grandfather’s participation in _The Adventures of Robin Hood_ in the Warner Bros. personnel/payroll files, or in the production records of the film itself. I’ve used both types at the Warner Bros. Archives, with much success. Now for some genealogy fun. Do you have your grandfather’s listing in the 1930 U.S. Census? Chadwick G. Trower, 27, was living in Happy Camp township in Siskiyou County, California, where he worked as an automobile machinist. Chad died on 14 January 1971 in Riverside County, California. He was residing in Parker Dam, San Bernardino County, California at the time. According to the Social Security Death Index, he was born on 22 February 1900 (which means the 1930 census was off by a few years). Chad is mentioned in a front page article in _The Van Nuys News_ (Van Nuys, California) on 7 September 1950: > [@](#): > > **Major Oil Firms Press Search for Valley ‘Black Gold’ > Standard Petitions Right to Drill on Rinaldi St. Parcel** > > Set for a hearing next Thursday before a Planning Commission examiner in the Van Nuys American Legion clubhouse is an application by Standard Oil Co. for a zone change to permit oil well drilling on a 69-acre in-Valley tract . . . . > > The well in the vicinity of Calabasas was sunk to a depth of 1800 feet near the head of Stokes Canyon on the Alfred Tyrer property by Chadwick Trower of Malibu, who has some 300 acres under lease for oil exploration. > > Trower said today that he has expended $50,000 thus far in his search for oil, and that he plans more drilling, with at least one well going down on the Harrison Kent ranch. The 300 acres held by Trower extends northerly from Stokes Canyon to the top of the ridge overlooking Calabasas. $50,000 then would be about $388,000 today. Here is what I suggest you do: Order from the Social Security Administration an itemized statement of earnings of your grandfather (S.S. #567-18-3089). It will list from 1937 onward the name and address of every employer, and the amount he earned from that employer, itemed by the quarter year (e.g., Jan-Mar 1937, Apr-Jun 1937). The Social Security Administration will probably want proof of your relationship to Chad, which you can supply by sending copies of your father’s birth certificate and your own (the SSA will return them to you). The order form, “Request for Social Security Earnings Information” (PDF file), can be downloaded [here](http://www.ssa.gov/online/ssa-7050.pdf). The cost for 45 years (1937-1971) is $85.00. And in my opinion, well worth it. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2006, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/10 "2006-03-19T04:31:39Z")
From notes on _The Adventures of Robin Hood_ in _The American Film Institute Catalog of Motion Pictures_: > [@](#): > > Belgian fencing master Fred Cavens and his son Albert tutored the cast in sword and quarterstaff routines. Archery expert Howard Hill did the actual trick shooting. The studio paid stunt men and bit players $150 per shot for letting Hill hit them with arrows. Flynn did most of his own stunts except for a leap with his hands tied behind his back, another leap unto the back of a horse, his swing up the Nottingham gate and his drop to the other side. ---
**Author:** ![Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/a9a28c/32.png) [@Oslo\_Ostragoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oslo_Ostragoth)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/11 "2006-03-20T01:28:26Z")
What an interesting thread. Thank you, SDMB. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/12 "2006-03-20T02:46:15Z")
Wow! This is like Christmas… Thank you everyone! 😃 First, I want to share some newspaper articles that samclem was kind enough to look up for me. The more information I have the more colorful and real the details of his life become. He sounds like he and his friends were quite the characters. These details also ring bells in my and my mother’s memory. I include some snippets of emails that received from her today as well. > [@](#): > > From the L.A.Times, Oct 8, 1939: > > _Donkeys New Stars of Film-Players’ Sport_ > > “One of the more recent filmland schemes for amusement originated in the brains of [Guinn(Big Boy) Williams](http://imdb.com/name/nm0930711/) and Chadwick Trower, film stunt man. They are promoting the playing of one of their favorite games, “donkey baseball,” for the benefit of some motion-picture charity. > The game is just like indoor baseball save that it is played on burros. All the players except pitcher, batter and catcher are mounted, and if the batter makes a safe hit he must mount his burro before he can run. Filders may dismount to field a ball but must remount before throwing it. > The Newhall ranch of Harry Carey is the scene of one of these games almost every weekend. Famous feature is Williams’ behavior when his mount becomes stubborn. He tosses it across his shoulders and carries it.” > [@](#): > > A 1942 L.A.Times article: > > “The 5000-acre W.C.Anderson ranch near Susanville,Cal., has been bought by Mr. and Mrs. Chad Trower of North Hollywood for $55,000. The sale was conducted by R.W. Diddock, Los Angeles real estate broker, who reported the transaction.” > [@hondewgrrl's Mom](#): > > I knew that he and Pat (second wife) were around Auburn, where they ran a place called Coursegold - a dude ranch-type place. When I went to a school training thing near there, there was a Trower Road. Your dad spoke of helping Chad on summer vacations drill for oil, but probably didn’t have the info you found…and I had no idea that he’d lived in Happy Camp…must have been right before he met Ronnie (my grandmother), as your dad was born in 1934 in L.A., where Chad worked as a mechanic while trying to get into the movies…and then they divorced and Ronnie and your dad moved back to Chicago to live with her relatives. > > … > > Your dad spoke of Guinn Williams, and the chariott driver in Ben Hur named [Joe Yrigoyen](http://imdb.com/name/nm0950408/), a Basque, I believe. Chad also knew [Slim Pickens](http://imdb.com/name/nm0001620/). I did know that his full name was Chadwick, and I meant to include that in last night’s post. I also knew about the friends performing stunts and bit parts in _Ben Hur_, and the friendship with Slim Pickens. Of course there is also a false urban legend ([on snopes](http://www.snopes.com/movies/films/benhur.htm)) about a stuntman dying during that famous chariot race, and the footage including his death was used in the film, just to make all of these memories more interesting to sort out. There is also some sort of connection between my grandfather and the film [Jesse James (1939)](http://imdb.com/title/tt0031507/), which has an interesting first entry on its IMDB _Trivia_ page: > [@](#): > > A scene in which a horse falls to its death from a cliff, and the subsequent public outcry, led to the American Humane Association (AHA) overseeing filmmaking through its new Film and TV Unit. Eventually they introduced the now-familiar AHA certification, “No animals were harmed in the making of this motion picture.” The outcry was(to the best of my recollection) due to the fact that the studio kept the footage that lead to the horse’s death (a huge mounted rider leap off of the edge of a cliff into the water) and the stuntman riding the horse was also seriously injured. My mom, brother and I can’t remember more than that, which makes me doubt that it was one of Chad’s stunts, but probably a friend’s. I also apparently had a few of my details wrong, like where my grandparents met, (Southern California vs Chicago) and who moved where when. No one in my family was aware that Chad had lived in Happy Camp prior to meeting my grandmother. I find that particular information very interesting. You see, my parents met in Southern California and they honeymooned in a little town way way up north on the California coast, called Shelter Cove. They fell in love with the area and ended buying some property, sight unseen, and moving the family up there when I was 3. Happy Camp is in the same general area of Northern California as Shelter Cove, about 200 miles northeast of where my parents (thank god) settled us in the middle of the backwoods. Seems that the rugged beauty of the northern mountains may have been speaking to members of my family for longer than I’d thought. I also didn’t realize that Chad had worked as a mechanic while he tried to get his foot in the door with movies. 10 guesses for what my older brother’s vocation is… > [@Zoe](#): > > I would not discount the family version at all. It is possible that Rudy Behlmer is relying on someone else’s faulty recollection of what someone else said or notes that he read long ago. Those details would not have been as important to him or the person that he got the information from as they would have been to your family who has taken so much pride in your grandfather’s work. I’m betting on your version. He would have to have a really sound source to top your authority if I were writing the book. Certainly I would include your family’s notes. Well, I’ll still hold onto a little hope. Perhaps I can find something of use in those WB archives that Walloon pointed out. Rudy Behlmer’s commentary is quite detailed though, including an apparent ankle injury to the stuntman who dropped from the castle gate rope to the ground at the end of the stunt. With the last entry that Walloon posted, since the big stunts involving doubles were not numerous in the film, perhaps the scene was pointed out to my father when he was younger, but the signifigance may have been misremembered. This is so cool! A fashion/costume design estate…5000 acre dude ranches…oil prospecting…Donkey Baseball. Fascinating stuff! I can’t express how much I appreciate all of this, everyone. 😃😃 ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/13 "2006-03-20T03:49:03Z")
Hmm, the plot thickens, **honeydewgrrl**. Chad’s listing in the 1930 U.S. census gives his marital status as divorced (I just rechecked). Meaning that Chad had already been married and divorced before he married your grandmother circa 1930-1934. So who was wife #1? If you think Chad was married in California, the [California Office of Vital Records](http://marriagedatabase.com/california/marriage-records.htm) has statewide marriage indexes from 1905 onward. But they take _months_, like six months, to process a search request if you don’t have an exact date and place. They will search up to five years in the indexes, so I would ask first for a 1926-1930 search, and if nothing is found, then a 1921-1925 search. Of course, he may have been married in [Illinois](http://marriagedatabase.com/illinois/marriage-records.htm), where you say he lived before California. Did Chad always have the last name Trower? I can’t find him in the 1920 U.S. census, looking for any Chad— born in Missouri within 2 years of 1900. (There were only 106 records for a Chad— born in any state within 2 years of 1900.) I’ll bet [Harry Carey Jr.](http://us.imdb.com/name/nm0001013/) remembers those donkey baseball games on his family’s ranch. He was 18 at the time of that 1939 article — he no doubt played in them. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 4:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/14 "2006-03-20T04:03:55Z")
In the U.S. Census taken on 1 June 1900, there is a Chad G. Smith, two months old (thus, born between March 2 and April 1), born in Missouri, residing in Benton, Missouri. Mother, Carrie Smith; father, J— (illegible write-over) W. Smith. Older brother Paul, born in 1897. In the index to the 1900 U.S. census, Chad G. Smith is the only Chad— born in Missouri within 2 years of 1900. Your grandfather was Chadwick G. Trower, born on 22 February 1900, in Missouri. Same person? ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/15 "2006-03-20T04:41:05Z")
> [@honeydewgrrl](#): > > What I have to work with are a couple of scrapbooks full of action shots involving my grandfather in various states of falling off of rearing and bucking horses, pet trained horses, illegible scribbles of alleged film titles that don’t return IMDB results, and the (admitedly awful) collective memories of myself, my brother, and my mom. Could you list some of those “alleged film titles” which don’t show up on IMDB. I can search some papers from the period. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/16 "2006-03-20T15:45:57Z")
I can only think of one offhand. The few pictures I do have are at home, and the scrapbooks and other boxes of stuff relating to my grandfather are back in my hometown with my mom. I have a few newsprint photographs that are glued to a scrapbook page. One is of Chad dressed in a cavalry uniform mounted on a rearing horse in battle. My best effort of deciphering my father’s writing on the image is “Bugles at dawn”. There are many photographs of a trained white horse of my grandfathers, named Cargo. One image is of Cargo and an elk “fighting”. My memory of my father’s story about the elk is that the elk and the horse were raised and trained together, and that they would play. When the cameras were on, the elk had rubber horns attached to its head and the resulting footage was passed off as a horse battling a wild elk out in the wilderness. I’ll hopefully have more once I get home and take another look. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/17 "2006-03-20T15:55:32Z")
There is the U.S. Cavalry movie _[Bugles in the Afternoon](http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0044456/)_. But that was released in 1952, which sounds later than your grandfather’s movie career. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2006, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/18 "2006-03-20T15:55:53Z")
Walloon… I was not aware of a marriage prior to my grandmother, but that doesn’t mean it won’t remind Mom or my brother of something. I’m not aware of much of anything about my grandfather’s years prior to his meeting my grandmother, if he had any siblings, where he was raised etc. I was incorrect in thinking that Chad had lived in Chicago. It is possible that he never lived in Illinois. I certainly need to go through Mom’s boxes and document as much detail as I can between our collective memories. Excellent catch with Harry Carey Jr. too! I’d certainly remember a bunch of Hollywood stuntmen congregating at my house to play donkey baseball. ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2006, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/19 "2006-03-21T01:08:18Z")
Ok, according to what I have on-hand… The horse’s “full name” was White Cargo. I have three pictures of him with the year included. Two from 1932 and one from 1933. No titles are included. The “Bugles at dawn” picture also has the date 1936 written on it. I have a second picture of him on a rearing horse. This one appears to be in the middle of the desert, and he’s hanging off of the horse’s neck, dressed like a cowboy, no sadle. The horse has a lasso around its neck which is being held by someone off camera. In the lower left corner it has the date 1934 on it, and right below that I believe it says “Fox”, and below that three words are written. I assume that it is a title, but I really can’t read it, aside from the third word being “how”…maybe. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2006, 7:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943/20 "2006-03-21T07:11:18Z")
Unfortunately, no Fox features from the 1930s have the word “how” in them (yes, I checked). The nearest matches are, Show Them No Mercy! (1935) Straight Place and Show (1938) The latter movie is a Ritz Brothers comedy about horse races and jockeys, but it was filmed in 1938, not 1934. The location scenes were shot at the Santa Anita Racetrack in Arcadia, California. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-hollywood-family-research-fashion-lost-inheritances-picking-eves-brain/348943.md?page=2)