# Old Navy toilets: a crude trough of flowing seawater? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [March 9, 2005, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605 "2005-03-09T01:16:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Snnipe\_70E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@Snnipe\_70E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snnipe_70E)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/41 "2013-09-26T00:52:48Z")
On ships where did the term “Head” come from. ---
**Author:** ![aNewLeaf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ac91a4/32.png) [@aNewLeaf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aNewLeaf)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/42 "2013-09-26T00:55:53Z")
> [@the\_diego](#): > > Why bother with running water? In the days of wooden ships, it was just a rickety bench right over the stern where people did “splat!” over the big blue sea. The area was appropriately called “jardines” (gardens). AKA the poop deck. ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/43 "2013-09-26T01:22:21Z")
> [@Snnipe\_70E](#): > > On ships where did the term “Head” come from. Back in the age of sail, the crappers were up at the bow- the head of the ship, so to speak, hence the term “head”. Or it might have to do with the figurehead being up there- I’m not sure. Anyway, they’d put them up there because they were more or less downwind of the rest of the ship. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/44 "2013-09-26T01:46:25Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Back in the age of sail, the crappers were up at the bow- the head of the ship, so to speak, hence the term “head”. Or it might have to do with the figurehead being up there- I’m not sure. > > Anyway, they’d put them up there because they were more or less downwind of the rest of the ship. I’m not a sailor, but unless you are sailing backwards, it sounds like the front (bow) would be UPwind of the rest of the ship. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 1:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/45 "2013-09-26T01:52:59Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > I’m not a sailor, but unless you are sailing backwards, it sounds like the front (bow) would be UPwind of the rest of the ship. If you’re at sail, the wind is at your back (more or less), blowing from the stern of the ship towards the bow. So, the bow of the ship would, indeed, be downwind from the rest of the ship. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/46 "2013-09-26T22:27:28Z")
While we’re talking naval oddities, I thought it strange that there were boatswains mates and pharmacists mates, but I never met that one guy _the_ boatswain or _the_ pharmacist. Especially since there was a _the_ coxswain, who operated the whale boat and captain’s gig after they were lifted off the ship and into the sea. Nice for him, could go around saying “Oh yes, I am _the_ coxsuw-ain!” ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/47 "2013-09-26T22:31:08Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > If you’re at sail, the wind is at your back (more or less), blowing from the stern of the ship towards the bow. So, the bow of the ship would, indeed, be downwind from the rest of the ship. I bow to your explanation. But I’m staying downwind from you, just in case. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Goob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c77e96/32.png) [@Mr.Goob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Goob)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/48 "2013-09-26T22:48:07Z")
I will 2nd what \*\*Kenobi \*\*said. The seats of ease were on the bow of the ship. If you ever see the movie Master and Commander there is a sweeping shot of the ship as it enters the frame, I noticed on one of multiple viewings that there is a man sitting there with his pants around his ankles. Blends in and is hard to see, but a nice touch of realism. ---
**Author:** ![tonyfop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/85f322/32.png) [@tonyfop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonyfop)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/49 "2013-09-26T23:04:48Z")
> [@Mr.Moto](#): > > That’s true, all the way around. > > For some strange reason, the CHT (contaminated holding and transfer - AKA sewage and food waste mixed with seawater) would often back up right into our berthing head and shower. Sometimes this would close it down for more than a day while the hull techs tried to unfuck the situation. When I was onboard the USS John F. Kennedy in 1993 or 1994 for NYC Fleet Week, we had a major CHT malfunction. Because we were in New York Harbor we couldn’t discharge CHT directly overboard. (I don’t know if anyone would have noticed if we did.) We had a barge come alongside to take on the CHT. They hooked up the barge, but when they opened the valves there was a back pressure from the barge back into the ship. Every toilet and shower and sink on that massive floating city exploded with shit. We had about 10,000 visitors lined up to come onboard, as well as all of ship’s company and a skeleton crew from the air wing, and no usable heads. The ship probably still smelled of shit when they scrapped her a couple of years ago… ---
**Author:** ![ouryL](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ouryl/32/6067_2.png) [@ouryL](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ouryL)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 11:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/50 "2013-09-26T23:05:04Z")
[https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS5RGIpSO1DOXQ8RJAkEag2M1-bcYVKSyn7Y7\_HWqOLCUEL\_3gyVg](https://encrypted-tbn3.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcS5RGIpSO1DOXQ8RJAkEag2M1-bcYVKSyn7Y7_HWqOLCUEL_3gyVg) :eek: ---
**Author:** ![tonyfop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/85f322/32.png) [@tonyfop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonyfop)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/51 "2013-09-26T23:06:35Z")
> [@Padeye](#): > > **Mr. Moto** , I remember that we would complain when our laundry and occasionally our showers smelled of JP5. I bow to you sir for giving me a new definition of fucked up. Ever get JP5 in the soda machines? ---
**Author:** ![tonyfop](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/85f322/32.png) [@tonyfop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tonyfop)\ **Post date:** [September 26, 2013, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/52 "2013-09-26T23:15:50Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > While we’re talking naval oddities, I thought it strange that there were boatswains mates and pharmacists mates, but I never met that one guy _the_ boatswain or _the_ pharmacist. Especially since there was a _the_ coxswain, who operated the whale boat and captain’s gig after they were lifted off the ship and into the sea. Nice for him, could go around saying “Oh yes, I am _the_ coxsuw-ain!” The boatswain (bos’n) Is the Deck Department Head. The pharmacist would have been the officer in charge of the dispensary (but that rate doesn’t exist anymore). Gunner’s Mates work for the Gunner, also known as the Weapons Department Head. I was an Aviation Maintenance Administrationman. Talk about a made up word! ---
**Author:** ![Carl\_Corey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Carl\_Corey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carl_Corey)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2013, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/53 "2013-09-29T01:00:11Z")
> [@minor7flat5](#): > > Wow, eight years! > > Not only do I not remember posting this, but _two_ of the posters in this thread have passed on. Three, actually. ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2013, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/54 "2013-09-29T02:08:28Z")
> [@Carl\_Corey](#): > > Three, actually. One of the more appropriate moments for a nitpick. Thanks for correcting this. For the record, **David Simmons** , **Padeye** , and **danceswithcats** are all deceased, so **tonyfop** probably won’t get an answer about the JP5 soda machines. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [September 29, 2013, 6:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/55 "2013-09-29T06:45:47Z")
> [@aNewLeaf](#): > > AKA the poop deck. Heh. No. In Latin, _puppis_ was the word for the stern deck of a ship long before it was a homonym for toilet functions. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Snnipe\_70E](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b5a626/32.png) [@Snnipe\_70E](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snnipe_70E)\ **Post date:** [October 1, 2013, 4:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605/56 "2013-10-01T04:28:02Z")
> [@tonyfop](#): > > Ever get JP5 in the soda machines? How about salt in the coffee, drinking water, cool aid, lemonade [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-navy-toilets-a-crude-trough-of-flowing-seawater/293605.md?page=2)