# Old people and "stuck" gas pedals as an excuse for runaway car accidents **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 9, 2003, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589 "2003-01-09T20:04:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/1 "2003-01-09T20:04:45Z")
“The pedal stuck” is is a fairly universal excuse used by older drivers (mostly 70 and 80 year olds) that plow into store fronts and crowds etc., to the point it’s almost become a joke on some “odd news of the day” sites. What exactly is going on in their heads that they think the gas pedal is the brake _and keep pressing it_ even though the car is racing. Is there a name for this kind of mental confusion? ---
**Author:** ![XJETGIRLX](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/9fc29f/32.png) [@XJETGIRLX](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XJETGIRLX)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/2 "2003-01-09T20:13:33Z")
Hoooboy. This reminds me of an incident from a few years ago. I worked at a video store, and the back of our store was right on the edge of the parking lot for the Krispy Kreme next door, which was in turn right next to a Whataburger. Around noon that day, as I’m in the office counting down a till, the entire store shakes as a lound crunch/boom/thud echoes through the store. I thought an earthquake had hit or a small plane had crashed into the building. I run out to the floor to see if what in the bloody hell had just happened. When I reach the back of the store, I find our new release wall had been snapped in half, the jagged edges shoved at an awkward angle towards the middle of the store, and right in between them, situated ass over end was the bed of a pickup truck. Right where the wall should be, a pickup truck! It seems some poor soul from out of town had stopped at Whataburger for lunch after he got off the interstate. That’s right folks, he was two doors down. Got in his car, shifted in reverse to back out of the parking lot and _kept on going_. Right through the bushes separating the Whataburger/Krispy Kreme parking lots. Right through the Krispy Kreme parking lot and smack dab into an employee’s car parked near our wall. Hit it hard enough that only the two front tires of the truck were on the ground, and the bed of the truck was embedded in our wall about 6 feet up in the air. Needless to say the elderly driver was a little shaken. My guess is he forgot to take his meds. Poor guy. I think he ended up having his license taken away and having to take a greyhound bus home. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/3 "2003-01-09T20:36:19Z")
_What exactly is going on in their heads that they think the gas pedal is the brake and keep pressing it even though the car is racing._ It only makes sense that if they think their foot is on the brake, they’re going to keep pressing it. In these situations, the person is startled and confronted with an emergency. Cool, rational evaluation gives way to panic response. The typical (very quick) thought is that the vehicle is malfunctioning. The drivers are always **absolutely certain** that their foot is on the brake. Of course, they’re also absolutely wrong. This phenomenon first got major attention with Audis years ago. No one ever found evidence of mechanical problems with the cars, and boy did some folks try! What was found was that the gas pedals on Audis were a little farther to the left than on most cars, hence Audis experienced more cases of unintended acceleration. The brouhaha led to the design of shift interlocks that inhibit shifting out of park unless the brake pedal is actually depressed. So what people are thinking is “my God the car’s running away on me and I don’t dare take my foot off the brake and make it worse!” ---
**Author:** ![NurseCarmen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5daacb/32.png) [@NurseCarmen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NurseCarmen)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 9:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/4 "2003-01-09T21:12:48Z")
Long long ago, I used to work for a law firm that represented a major auto manufacturer. One case I was working on was a wrongful death case. A woman from rural South Dakota manged to _Run Herself Over._ Several years prior, A young comedy troupe named Monty Python had suggested such a feat in a comedy sketch about a race among twits. Life imitating art imitating life imitating art imitating… ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/5 "2003-01-09T21:18:37Z")
A confession: I’m afraid to get old! 😮 * * * Favorite quote from 5th grade social studies: “Oh, that Nick-o-lie Lennin! He’s a dirty-bird!” ---
**Author:** ![SCSimmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@SCSimmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCSimmons)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 10:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/6 "2003-01-09T22:12:28Z")
And of course, one oughtn’t jump to conclusions. My (parked) car was wrecked by an elderly driver doing about 25 mph in reverse in a parking lot a few months back. When I got out (yes, I was in it), I could smell the charred remains of her brake pads in the air. And the police report indicated that her engine continued to race after she was removed from the vehicle, until they shut it off. Not that she was immune to the irrational decision-making panic bug. Hitting my car brought hers to a stop, you see. And then … She shifted into Drive. :eek: I have never in my life seen anyone go that fast in a parking lot. The next time she was stopped, it was by a brick wall. :eek: Fortunately, she wasn’t seriously injured. For the benefit of anyone out there who ever finds him/herself in this situation-I highly recommend shifting to Neutral. This public service announcement is brought to you by … OK, me. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/7 "2003-01-09T22:18:40Z")
Turning the key to “off” would also be effective, and would spare the engine from overrevving. ---
**Author:** ![Breezy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/b3f665/32.png) [@Breezy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Breezy)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/8 "2003-01-09T22:29:24Z")
My key won’t turn off unless you are in park. So shutting the key off wouldn’t be an option. ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/9 "2003-01-09T22:58:47Z")
The name is “confusion and slow reaction.” It happens frequently and not just to the elderly. Fortunately, the result is generally a bruised bumper and a stove in garage wall. In my little town we have had two fatalities with this sort of thing in the last 10 years or so. In one incident an elderly gentleman (and a gentleman in every sense of the word) was angle parked, put the car in “drive” instead of “reverse,” jumped the curb and crushed a young woman against the front of the drug store. When he felt himself going foreword instead of backwards he went for the break and hit the gas. It was all over in an instant. ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/10 "2003-01-09T23:02:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Gary T \* > \*\*Turning the key to “off” would also be effective, and would spare the engine from overrevving. \*\* Once, the accelerator cable on my seldom-used pickup truck got hung up as I floored it to pass someone on the freeway. The truck kept going faster. When I pushed in the clutch, it simply revved up to the limiter (I was pleased to find out I had a limiter). I turned off the engine and then coasted a bit while I stomped and kicked the accelerater to free the cable. A few hundred yards later I turned the ignition back on and let out the clutch. The truck “push started” itself and all was well. It wasn’t till a few years later that I read that you should never turn off the ignition in such cases: the steering wheel lock can engage, at highway speed :eek: ---
**Author:** ![handy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5a626/32.png) [@handy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handy)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2003, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/11 "2003-01-09T23:14:51Z")
I had the carpet catch the pedal sometimes, so the pedal stays down. But I just switch to neutral until I get the thing straightened out. ---
**Author:** ![Myrr21](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e495f1/32.png) [@Myrr21](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Myrr21)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/12 "2003-01-10T01:53:19Z")
My grandmother hit a church once. She was just about to go in to check when mass was, and then we went in to check when mass was 🙂 Well, actually, we hit the concrete part and not the wood. I was very disappointed that we didn’t crash through and end up in the pews. That would have been a better story. It later did turn out to be a mechanical problem–the bloody thing shifted from park to drive by itself. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/13 "2003-01-10T04:04:19Z")
_My key won’t turn off unless you are in park._ Keys won’t turn to “lock” unless in park. I’ve never experienced a car that can’t be turned “off” in any gear. _It wasn’t till a few years later that I read that you should never turn off the ignition in such cases: the steering wheel lock can engage, at highway speed_ Not really a concern in a parking lot, but certainly one wouldn’t want to lose steering control on the highway. If you have your wits about you (i.e. not a panic situation), you can take care to turn only to “off”, not to “lock”. Most modern cars will not engage the steering lock until the key is withdrawn, but the wise thing to do is check how it works in your car and decide if it would be safe to turn it off on the highway. ---
**Author:** ![kirk280980](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c77e96/32.png) [@kirk280980](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kirk280980)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/14 "2003-01-10T05:04:36Z")
One of my cow-orkers, bless her, had a little spot of bother the first time she drove an automatic. In a moment of absent mindedness, she got confused with the pedal orientation and ended up stomping on the accellerator instead of the brake. After crunching to a halt, she stepped out of the car to find her garage door embossed into the shape of a Ford Escort’s front end :eek:. ---
**Author:** ![Duke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e8c25b/32.png) [@Duke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 5:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/15 "2003-01-10T05:09:29Z")
P. J. O’Rourke nailed this topic in his book _Parliament of Whores_. His point was about the spate of “sudden-acceleration incidents” caused by allegedly faulty vehicles–you may remember this from the '80’s. After millions of dollars of testing, the USDoT found that, as you might expect, the drivers were actually caused by “pedal misapplication”–i.e. hitting the gas instead of the brake. P. J. has his usual field day with this. To wit: > [@](#): > > These sudden-acceleration incidents, or SAIs, closely resemble those sudden-intelligence incidents, or SUIs, that many of us have experimented with our automobiles…we’d be driving down a country road at a reasonable and prudent 115 miles an hour and–all of a sudden, for no apparent reason–the car would suffer an SUI and roll over five times in a cornfield. As for the “old people” angle to this (the stated “stuck” gas pedal): > [@](#): > > It’s worth noting…that the Honda Civic’s pedal placement is nearly identical with the Audi 5000’s [a car that was blamed for a lot of the SAIs], yet the Civic got few SAI complaints. On the other hand, the Mercury Marquis–where, on a clear day, you can almost see the accelerator from the brake–was in the SAI top ten. We don’t need a “60 Minutes” investigative team to tell us what kind of person buys a little Honda rice rocket and what kind of person buys a huge Mercury Medicare sled. So, yah, it’s pretty well known. And, just think, your tax dollars funded a multi-million dollar study of the phenomenon. ---
**Author:** ![SweetLucy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@SweetLucy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SweetLucy)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 7:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/16 "2003-01-10T07:12:45Z")
The term “sudden elder acceleration” has been coined for this, as I recall from a news article I read several years ago. Here in New Mexico, it seems that young adults are more likely to “suddenly accelerate.” They seem to have difficulty keeping their vehicles from colliding into houses, etc. especially at night on winding roads. Yeah, it’s really rocket science to keep one’s car on the road, I know, poor babies…😕 ---
**Author:** ![Zoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/a4c791/32.png) [@Zoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zoe)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/17 "2003-01-10T07:50:19Z")
My friend and I are both near 60. We agree that already we can tell a difference in our driving, mainly a lack of concentration. I am a strong supporter of testing the response time of drivers age sixty and over. With that said, the question > [@](#): > > What exactly is going on in their heads that they think the gas pedal is the brake and keep pressing it even though the car is racing. Is there a name for this kind of mental confusion? is a little mean-spirited. If you are lucky, you will enter that same state of mental confusion and easy panic yourself. It’s called old age. I can see how older people might fool themselves into thinking that the problems were not their fault. After all, when you have to admit to yourself that you can’t drive anymore, you lose your independence. That is very, very hard to surrender to. But surrender they must. I was very nearly a victim of the “stuck pedal” syndrome. I was leaving a hospital after major surgery and sat waiting in a wheelchair at an underground parking lot for my husband to pick me up. He had gone to get the car. Suddenly, a car that had just pulled out of a parking space just sort of went wild. The car was in reverse and headed right for me and another lady. It missed me by a very short distance and almost plowed into the glass wall that surrounds the four elevator shafts. (I had frozen in panic in the chair.) The car was making terrible squealing sounds. Even when it stopped going in reverse, it lurched forward and then back again. Finally, a very shaken elderly woman was able to get out of the car. I could almost mouth the words for her: “The pedal stuck.” ---
**Author:** ![minor7flat5](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minor7flat5/32/258_2.png) [@minor7flat5](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minor7flat5)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 12:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/18 "2003-01-10T12:44:48Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Gary T \* > \*\*If you have your wits about you (i.e. not a panic situation), you can take care to turn only to “off”, not to “lock”. Most modern cars will not engage the steering lock until the key is withdrawn, but the wise thing to do is check how it works in your car and decide if it would be safe to turn it off on the highway. \*\* Yes, I considered this. I verified that my truck only locks the steering wheel when the key is turned to “lock”. Nevertheless, it’s kind of scary thinking that the difference between calmly gliding to the shoulder and potential firey death is one key-position away. ---
**Author:** ![Philster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/13edae/32.png) [@Philster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Philster)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/19 "2003-01-10T13:38:35Z")
The brakes can stop the car, even if floored. Unfortunately, the foot that would be hitting the brake pedal is actually pressed to the floor with the accelerator pedal underneath it. These sudden acceleration episodes can always be pinned back on the driver when the brakes check out to be ok. For sudden unintended acceleration to happen, the engine would have to rev on it’s own AND the entire brake system would have to fail simultaneously. ---
**Author:** ![Rick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9f8e36/32.png) [@Rick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rick)\ **Post date:** [January 10, 2003, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589/20 "2003-01-10T14:30:30Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Philster \* > \*\*The brakes can stop the car, even if floored. > > Unfortunately, the foot that would be hitting the brake pedal is actually pressed to the floor with the accelerator pedal underneath it. > > These sudden acceleration episodes can always be pinned back on the driver when the brakes check out to be ok. > > For sudden unintended acceleration to happen, the engine would have to rev on it’s own AND the entire brake system would have to fail simultaneously. \*\* Actually four things would have to happen in order for SA to be the cause [list=1] [li]Complete failure of hydraulic brake system[/li][li]engine goes to full power by itself[/li][li]after the crash the brake system fixes itself leaving no trace[/li][li]the engine also fixes itself leaving no trace[/li][/list=1] There are two chance of this happening slim and none. 🙂 [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-people-and-stuck-gas-pedals-as-an-excuse-for-runaway-car-accidents/147589.md?page=2)