# Old terms in fiction that are weird to hear or read today. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [October 4, 2012, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741 "2012-10-04T20:44:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Ponch8](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ponch8/32/9883_2.png) [@Ponch8](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ponch8)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/101 "2012-10-10T20:08:10Z")
In lots of old books I’ve read, calling somebody a scoundrel was a grave insult. The meaning seems to have softened slightly over the years, and is now on a par with being called a thug or hooligan. (Not that it’s good to be called those things even now.) ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/102 "2012-10-10T20:14:57Z")
> [@Colophon](#): > > Say what? “Apace” has always meant “quickly” and still does. I’ve never heard it used to mean “together”. > > [Apace.](http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/apace) > [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](#): > > Merriam-Webster sort-of agrees with the “together” usage of _apace_, though perhaps not in a physical sense. That is, it defines \*apace \*as synonymous with _abreast_ without differentiating between the meanings “beside one another with bodies in line” and “up to a particular standard,” but the usage example is of the latter meaning. Imprecise of them; Athena would be displeased. > > I too think of _apace_ as primarily meaning “quickly.” Agreed, I typically see “apace” following the word “proceed”: “Proceed apace to the governer’s office.” > [@TruCelt](#): > > I hear it in discussions of R&D work, mostly “we need to keep apace with the technology” or making sure that regulations “keep apace” of the legislation. It’s keeping up with - maintaining or developing the required momentum. Likewise, this is a scenario where I’ve typically seen the word “abreast” used. ETA: Or simply “pace”, without the “a-” prefix: “we need to keep pace with the technology”. ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/103 "2012-10-10T21:42:09Z")
In my hometown, “apace” was how much pie you would get after supper. ---
**Author:** ![Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Skald\_the\_Rhymer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skald_the_Rhymer)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2012, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/104 "2012-10-10T22:00:20Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > ETA: Or simply “pace”, without the “a-” prefix: " [paranoid, solipsistic git] Which, pronounced PAY-see, PAW-chay, or PAW-kay, is also a preposition meaning “contrary to the opinion of (used with deference).” As I never encountered this word before 1991, I am of the firm opinion it was coined during my junior year in college simply to fuck with my head, and that the OED and other such resources were fiddled with to maintain the illusion. See also _flammable_, _postpositive_, and _Merovingian._ [/paranoid solipsistic git] ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/105 "2012-10-11T15:26:49Z")
> [@Ponch8](#): > > In lots of old books I’ve read, calling somebody a scoundrel was a grave insult. The meaning seems to have softened slightly over the years, and is now on a par with being called a thug or hooligan. (Not that it’s good to be called those things even now.) I’d say it’s on the border between outdated and archaic. These days, it’s more likely that someone would be amused by your Ye Olde Timey choice of insults, than that they would be offended by it. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/106 "2012-10-11T15:34:25Z")
In “Requiem for a Heavyweight,” Mickey Rooney levels an angry blast at Maish, calling him in the most contemptuous way possible, a “fink.” In a more recent film, we might expect to hear SOB or MF, but I guess that’s the best they could get away with in those days. ---
**Author:** ![TruCelt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/trucelt/32/523_2.png) [@TruCelt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TruCelt)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/107 "2012-10-11T15:45:26Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > I’d say it’s on the border between outdated and archaic. These days, it’s more likely that someone would be amused by your Ye Olde Timey choice of insults, than that they would be offended by it. Yeah, and scoundrel these days has a connotation of charm about it. We expect the speaker to smile indulgently while referring to the scoundrel. Like that great romp flick “Dirty, Rotten, Scoundrels.” A personal favorite. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/108 "2012-10-11T15:51:06Z")
> [@Harmonious\_Discord](#): > > You lucked out on the penises, because I didn’t find it in the 15 minutes I looked. It will get posted when I run across it again, even when it’s months down the road. I have too much to look through, and haven’t had total recall for well over a decade. Today has been a day where I keep losing things and it’s taking hours to find the stuff. Have you found your penis yet? ETA: By the way, you were my inspiration for my user name. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/109 "2012-10-11T17:26:11Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Have you found your penis yet? Way to hurt a guy, **EP**. ---
**Author:** ![Dendarii\_Dame](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbce88/32.png) [@Dendarii\_Dame](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dendarii_Dame)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/110 "2012-10-11T18:37:10Z")
In L. M. Montgomery’s _Anne of the Island_ (the second sequel to\* Anne of Green Gables)\* Anne goes to college. The author refers to freshmen (a word she uses sparingly) as “freshies” (male) and “freshettes” (female). ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/111 "2012-10-11T19:09:40Z")
> [@Dendarii\_Dame](#): > > In L. M. Montgomery’s _Anne of the Island_ (the second sequel to\* Anne of Green Gables)\* Anne goes to college. The author refers to freshmen (a word she uses sparingly) as “freshies” (male) and “freshettes” (female). That might just be Canadian rather than old-timey; I heard the word “freshies” used to refer to freshmen circa 1990, for instance. ---
**Author:** ![Harmonious\_Discord](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/74df32/32.png) [@Harmonious\_Discord](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Harmonious_Discord)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/112 "2012-10-11T19:42:41Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > Have you found your penis yet? > > ETA: By the way, you were my inspiration for my user name. I said months down the road. It’s something I’ll just have to run across when looking through stories. ---
**Author:** ![hogarth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hogarth/32/1773_2.png) [@hogarth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hogarth)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/113 "2012-10-11T19:56:44Z")
Another jarring term (for me): the word “lover” used to mean something like “suitor” or “wooer” or even “fiancé”. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/114 "2012-10-11T20:20:50Z")
> [@hogarth](#): > > That might just be Canadian rather than old-timey; I heard the word “freshies” used to refer to freshmen circa 1990, for instance. Which reminds me - does anybody use the word “frosh” any more to refer to a freshman? ---
**Author:** ![Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/le_ministre_de_l_au-dela/32/12181_2.png) [@Le\_Ministre\_de\_l\_au-dela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Le_Ministre_de_l_au-dela)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/115 "2012-10-11T20:57:43Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > Which reminds me - does anybody use the word “frosh” any more to refer to a freshman? Yes. First week in most Canadian universities is known as ‘[Frosh Week](https://www.google.ca/search?q=frosh+week&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a)’. ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/116 "2012-10-11T21:21:40Z")
At my alma mater (New Mexico State University, late 1980s & early 1990s), “frosh” was used by the school newspaper as an abbreviation. Usually plural. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [October 11, 2012, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/117 "2012-10-11T21:36:37Z")
> [@Mister\_Rik](#): > > Which reminds me - does anybody use the word “frosh” any more to refer to a freshman? I always got weird looks when I used it. At my school the culture was to say first year anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Dendarii\_Dame](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/bbce88/32.png) [@Dendarii\_Dame](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dendarii_Dame)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2012, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/118 "2012-10-12T18:15:43Z")
Another thing from the _Anne of Green Gables_ books (that I bet isn’t just a Canadian thing, at least not anymore) is that adult married women, with the exception of family members and extremely close friends, are referred to as “Mrs. Harmon Andrews”, “Mrs. Eben Wright”, etc. That is, by their husbands’ names. Not just formally in writing, but in conversation. “Mrs. Eben Wright told me…” etc. ---
**Author:** ![Mister\_Rik](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mister_rik/32/491_2.png) [@Mister\_Rik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mister_Rik)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2012, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/119 "2012-10-12T21:39:07Z")
Back to “apace”, I just coincidentally came across this in a history of Sumeria, published in, I think, 1963: “With this new insight into the Babylonian script, the decipherment could go on apace.” The context is that figuring out how Sumerian writing worked had been going very slowly, until some discoveries about how Babylonian writing worked provided insight into how the Sumerian worked. After that, figuring out Sumerian went more quickly, or “apace”. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2012, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741/120 "2012-10-12T22:36:35Z")
> [@TruCelt](#): > > “Apace” meaning walking quickly instead of walking together > > … > > “Boob” a foolish person. Both of these are in regular use in English English. Indeed, I’ve never heard of apace meaning “walking together.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-terms-in-fiction-that-are-weird-to-hear-or-read-today/636741.md?page=7)