# Old TV shows featuring strong independent women **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** tv-shows-scripted\ **Created:** [May 5, 2021, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442 "2021-05-05T15:56:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/21 "2021-05-05T17:47:51Z")
Barney Miller was always trying out new Detectives. For instance Ron Harris played by Ron Glass was an early one that stuck. (1st season). He basically beat out Rod Perry as Sgt. Wilson. Later Steve Landesberg as Dietrich and Ron Carey as Levitt won full time jobs. So Wentworth had pretty much won the job as a regular when Linda Lavin got offered Alice instead. Clearly she chose wisely for herself, but a shame for Barney Miller. If you notice the final episode of Barney Miller Wentworth is the only short run character to be mentioned. (_Chano doesn’t count as a trial run._) ---
**Author:** ![Jeff\_Lichtman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeff_lichtman/32/1531_2.png) [@Jeff\_Lichtman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jeff_Lichtman)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/22 "2021-05-05T17:54:18Z")
Designing Women (1986 - 1993) - The OP is unclear whether the 30 year limit is for when the show started or when it ended. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 6:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/23 "2021-05-05T18:03:12Z")
> [@Jeff\_Lichtman](#): > > Designing Women (1986 - 1993) - The OP is unclear whether the 30 year limit is for when the show started or when it ended. - I was thinking “Premiered at least 30 years ago”, but either way is fine. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/24 "2021-05-05T18:16:56Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > The OP may have been looking for fictional TV programs but I mention this one and Faye Emerson because it surprises me that after I have lived through the age of women’s rights there has been almost no mention of these television pioneers. Betty White was among that group too and if she hadn’t flat out refused to die to she’d probably be ignored as well. This being Cafe Society, I don’t want to start a Great Debate but what led to the OP was a conversation about women and couples waiting later in life to start families or even foregoing having kids. One theory we had was that there are more independent women role models on TV than there used to be. So while I was originally thinking of fictional characters, your example would fit the bill as well. ---
**Author:** ![PookahMacPhellimey](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pookahmacphellimey/32/3175_2.png) [@PookahMacPhellimey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PookahMacPhellimey)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/25 "2021-05-05T18:20:06Z")
Very British, but Birds of a Feather would qualify. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/26 "2021-05-05T19:57:36Z")
That is an interesting subject in itself. I’d say TV is more of a trailing indicator of societal mores, but certainly is good at reinforcing them. I also think it’s interesting to see how many actresses play women who don’t have children yet have them in real life, often now covering up their real life pregnancies on their shows. ---
**Author:** ![Skywatcher](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/skywatcher/32/254_2.png) [@Skywatcher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Skywatcher)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2021, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/27 "2021-05-05T20:22:03Z")
I think Sybil Fawlty had to be quite strong to put up with Basil. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/28 "2021-05-06T00:46:51Z")
_That Girl_ Marlo Thomas wanted to show that a woman could be independent and have a career. She had a boyfriend, but the show deliberately avoided having them marry (they got engaged toward the end) to avoid the message that a woman needs a man to be complete. ---
**Author:** ![Drum\_God](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drum_god/32/44_2.png) [@Drum\_God](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drum_God)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/29 "2021-05-06T02:35:33Z")
What about _Moonlighting_ and _Remington Steele_? Both of those shows were built around female characters who had the audacity to attempt to succeed in a male-dominated industry. However, I can see where that strong quality could be blunted by the fact that both women sought out men to complete their PI practices. ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/30 "2021-05-06T02:38:53Z")
Ironically, my wife just mentioned “Cybill” but it’s not quite 30. I’d say that yours count. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/31 "2021-05-06T02:48:49Z")
(and then there’s) Maude Our Miss Brooks ---
**Author:** ![steepone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/977dab/32.png) [@steepone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steepone)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/32 "2021-05-06T04:16:49Z")
Mrs Muir (Hope Lange) in the TV series The Ghost And Mrs Muir (1968 - 1970), a single mother raising two kids and she always stood up to the Captain and Claymore Gregg ---
**Author:** ![SmartAleq](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smartaleq/32/163_2.png) [@SmartAleq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmartAleq)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 5:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/33 "2021-05-06T05:59:03Z")
One of my all time favorites was Stephanie Cole in “Waiting For God.” That woman was feisty AF and I wanted to be her when I grew up. And Brett Butler in “Grace Under Fire” just misses the 30 year cutoff by a smidgen but satisfies the spirit of the OP if not the actual letter. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 6:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/34 "2021-05-06T06:18:26Z")
Edith Bunker was not the ‘Ding-bat’ she was made out to be. She ran that house, and was a strong woman. ---
**Author:** ![Greg\_Charles](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/839c29/32.png) [@Greg\_Charles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Greg_Charles)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 7:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/35 "2021-05-06T07:05:16Z")
OP is very wrong about Mary Tyler Moore. A single woman moving to a new city, living alone, and holding her own with the men while producing a TV news show was a very big deal in the 1970s. Lou Grant was a supporting character … the old school newsman whose respect for Mary’s talent overcomes his initial reluctance to let a woman into the club. I’ll add Maj. Margaret Houlihan (M A S H). She started off as a shrill harridan, but grew through the series to become an integral part of the team … a skilled nurse and an intelligent, effective manager of the nursing corps and the operating theater in general. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/36 "2021-05-06T07:28:02Z")
Jill Gascoigne playing Maggie Forbes in _The Gentle Touch_. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/37 "2021-05-06T11:51:25Z")
_The Days and Nights of Molly Dodd_ _The Trials of Rosie O’Neill_ ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/38 "2021-05-06T12:54:01Z")
> [@amarinth](#): > > Our Miss Brooks Been awhile since I saw the TV show, but the radio series was anything but independent. Brooks was sardonic and sharp-tongued, but she spent many episodes mooning over Phil Boynton. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/39 "2021-05-06T13:00:37Z")
In spite of his generally poor treatment of her (her needs come well below the needs of his pet frog, McDougal, in his mind) ---
**Author:** ![Nars\_Glinley](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nars_glinley/32/8177_2.png) [@Nars\_Glinley](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nars_Glinley)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2021, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442/40 "2021-05-06T13:10:35Z")
> [@Greg\_Charles](#): > > OP is very wrong about Mary Tyler Moore. A single woman moving to a new city, living alone, and holding her own with the men while producing a TV news show was a very big deal in the 1970s. Lou Grant was a supporting character … the old school newsman whose respect for Mary’s talent overcomes his initial reluctance to let a woman into the club. You may very well be right. I haven’t seen the show in a long time but most of my memories of it are Grant barking orders at Mary and her meekly replying “Yes Mr. Grant.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-tv-shows-featuring-strong-independent-women/941442.md?page=3)