# Old West bullshit facts. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 23, 2018, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612 "2018-06-23T09:15:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![vperry1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ee7513/32.png) [@vperry1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vperry1)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/1 "2018-06-23T09:15:16Z")
I know movies, dime store novels, books and passed down folk lore contributed to what we belive to be facts about the Wild West. But with all the experts, historians and documentation out there, why do people still believe the hype? A few things that stick out me me are: 1. Wild Bill Hickok was killed holding aces and eights/the dead man’s hand. Um, nope. No proof whatsoever, yet still believed as fact. People, cards, drinks, tables and chairs went flying. Oh, but we know exactly what cards he held??? 2. Val Kilmer, er, I mean Doc Holliday killed Johhnny Ringo. Nope again. 3. Every article about Doc Holliday is followed or preceded by a photo of some mustachioed dude who is not him. 4. Virgil and Morgan Earp were shot on the same night. Need I say it again? Why not…nope! There are so many messed up facts, but people swear by them–even reenact them. Just a beef I have. Any you care to add, by all means, have at it. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/2 "2018-06-23T12:11:33Z")
Gunfight showdowns- two men challenging each other to fight in the street - are the invention of pulp novels. They probably never happened (why would they?). One town did stage them for people passing through as a publicity stunt. Many big towns banned guns. You were required to turn them in while visiting; you’d get yours back when you left. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 12:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/3 "2018-06-23T12:13:20Z")
They had stricter gun laws than they do today. Everybody didn’t walk around with six shooters holstered to their sides. ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/4 "2018-06-23T12:45:10Z")
Did bars really have the double swinging doors that opened onto the sidewalk in your typical old western town? ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/5 "2018-06-23T14:09:37Z")
Guy goes up to bar. Tells the bartender, “Whisky.” Bartender grabs a full bottle of whisky. Opens it. Pours some of it into a glass. Gives glass to man. _And then gives him the “almost full” bottle, too._ :eek: Did this ever happen in real life? If so, does the bartender measure how much whisky is left in the bottle when he’s done drink’n, and then charge him accordingly? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/6 "2018-06-23T14:51:26Z")
The swinging doors existed. Before air conditioning, you wanted whatever breeze you could get. What the movies never show is the set of full doors that were also there, inside or out, that would allow the saloon to be locked up when closed. As for the whisky, the shot glass served as the measure. But they wouldn’t leave the bottle. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/7 "2018-06-23T15:00:01Z")
> [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](#): > > Did bars really have the double swinging doors that opened onto the sidewalk in your typical old western town? > [@silenus](#): > > The swinging doors existed. I was in an ‘Old West Town’ that had swinging saloon doors. Unfortunately, somebody’s dog came in just inside the doors and crapped on the floor. I walked in and slipped in it and fell on my bum. After picking myself up, and before I could alert anyone to the hazard, another guy walked in and slipped in the dog poo and landed on _his_ bum. I told him, ‘I just did that!’ He punched me in the face. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/8 "2018-06-23T15:01:07Z")
> [@Grrr](#): > > They had stricter gun laws than they do today. Everybody didn’t walk around with six shooters holstered to their sides. _Some_ places had stricter gun laws than you will find in much of the US today…but you are right that everybody didn’t walk around wearing a holstered revolver. Rifles and shotguns were preferred for most purposes. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 3:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/9 "2018-06-23T15:51:22Z")
A couple that bug me: 1. White cowboys, and only white cowboys. Do a little research and you’ll find that huge numbers of cowboys were either Mexican or black. 2. Cowboy hats. Most wore whatever they could find that had a brim - bowlers, derbys, skimmers, whatever. Stetsons were popular but very expensive. Your run-of-the-mill ranch hand couldn’t afford them. 3. Bank robberies everywhere. Research shows that there were only about 8 true bank robberies, _in 40 years across 15 states_. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 4:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/10 "2018-06-23T16:01:42Z")
Tumbleweed, that iconic symbol of the Old West, is an invasive species that was accidentally introduced to the US in the 1870s. ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/11 "2018-06-23T16:18:25Z")
As for the reasons: that definitive university press biography of famous Old West celebrity X sold 5,000 copies–while 50 million Americans saw one or another misleading movie or TV shows about him. ---
**Author:** ![Flyer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/flyer/32/7298_2.png) [@Flyer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Flyer)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/12 "2018-06-23T16:25:46Z")
> [@vperry1](#): > > I know movies, dime store novels, books and passed down folk lore contributed to what we belive to be facts about the Wild West. But with all the experts, historians and documentation out there, why do people still believe the hype? > > A few things that stick out me me are: > > 1. Wild Bill Hickok was killed holding aces and eights/the dead man’s hand. Um, nope. No proof whatsoever, yet still believed as fact. People, cards, drinks, tables and chairs went flying. Oh, but we know exactly what cards he held??? > > 2. Val Kilmer, er, I mean Doc Holliday killed Johhnny Ringo. Nope again. > > 3. Every article about Doc Holliday is followed or preceded by a photo of some mustachioed dude who is not him. > > 4. Virgil and Morgan Earp were shot on the same night. Need I say it again? Why not…nope! > > There are so many messed up facts, but people swear by them–even reenact them. Just a beef I have. Any you care to add, by all means, have at it. The myths started even before the frontier was officially declared closed. If people with access to contemporary information and sources believed the myths, how are you going to get rid of them now? ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/13 "2018-06-23T16:29:11Z")
_This is the West, sir. When the legend becomes fact, print the legend._ ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/14 "2018-06-23T18:29:28Z")
Whenever I see an old movie or tv show of the old west and no manure or mud on the street? With horses everywhere? Streets back then were absolutely nasty. ---
**Author:** ![Asuka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@Asuka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asuka)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/15 "2018-06-23T18:42:35Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > _Some_ places had stricter gun laws than you will find in much of the US today…but you are right that everybody didn’t walk around wearing a holstered revolver. Rifles and shotguns were preferred for most purposes. Yeah, in general if the locals knew you you could walk around with whatever gun you wanted. It was the outsiders they didn’t trust they would have turn in their guns. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/16 "2018-06-23T18:48:12Z")
Watching or reading westerns, you’d think every man back in the old west was a cowboy (unless they were a sheriff). But cowboy wasn’t all that common an occupation. There were more miners than cowboys and farmers outnumbered them both. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/17 "2018-06-23T19:01:49Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Watching or reading westerns, you’d think every man back in the old west was a cowboy (unless they were a sheriff). But cowboy wasn’t all that common an occupation. There were more miners than cowboys and farmers outnumbered them both. Possibly this is from the few times a year when either a cattle drive came through and/or the cowboys were on their yearly binge of spending their pay. ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/18 "2018-06-23T19:12:52Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Whenever I see an old movie or tv show of the old west and no manure or mud on the street? With horses everywhere? > > Streets back then were absolutely nasty. In the movie Boom Town, Gable’s character first meets Tracy’s character as they are both trying to walk on a single plank, in opposite directions, that is crossing a muddy street in a western town. In general, though, so many westerns are set in the arid southwest that it is not surprising that the streets are dusty instead of muddy. The manure, though, is another story. But on a dusty street you could probably see it well enough to avoid it. It’s kind of like how you almost never see anyone using an outhouse unless it is key to the story. > [@Asuka](#): > > Yeah, in general if the locals knew you you could walk around with whatever gun you wanted. It was the outsiders they didn’t trust they would have turn in their guns. In the movie Rio Bravo, I believe John Wayne’s character Sheriff Chance instituted this policy temporarily during an emergency. Otherwise I don’t remember seeing it in a movie. It struck me as hard to enforce, there must have been side streets or alleys that people could sneak into town by. Of course I’ve never seen a genuine old west town in real life. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/19 "2018-06-23T19:23:11Z")
I expect the “turn in the guns” laws functioned like a lot of modern day gun laws do: as a pile-on charge. Concealable guns existed then. There were one and two shot deringers, small revolvers, and various oddball multi-barreled pieces. Then, too, I doubt the local lawman was searching the baggage of everybody who came into town. These laws largely worked only with the consent of those willing to comply. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2018, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612/20 "2018-06-23T19:34:28Z")
> [@Roderick\_Femm](#): > > In the movie Rio Bravo, I believe John Wayne’s character Sheriff Chance instituted this policy temporarily during an emergency. Otherwise I don’t remember seeing it in a movie. It struck me as hard to enforce, there must have been side streets or alleys that people could sneak into town by. Of course I’ve never seen a genuine old west town in real life. Such a law was central to the story of _[Unforgiven](https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0105695/?ref_=ttfc_fc_tt)_. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/old-west-bullshit-facts/816612.md?page=2)