# Omicron? Why not Epsilon? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [December 20, 2021, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363 "2021-12-20T12:45:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/21 "2021-12-21T11:38:59Z")
The pronunciation hell aspect of this is interesting too. With omicron we of course already have a twin variant “omnicron”. As well as short versus long “o” sound. The correct pronunciation of the Greek letter xi is apparently “gzai” (rhymes with “buy”). I think that would have mutated to many forms… The “xi” in president xi’s name is basically like the English word “she” btw. The “x” represents a slightly different sound to “sh”, more of a hissing, but it’s not that different that you wouldn’t be understood saying “she”. ---
**Author:** ![dtilque](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d6d6ee/32.png) [@dtilque](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dtilque)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 11:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/22 "2021-12-21T11:58:52Z")
> [@dtilque](#): > > So I predict the next Variant of Concern (or whatever the terminology for named variants is) will be rho. It occured to me, after posting the above, that rho is so dense that it’ll think it’s an honor to have a disease named after it. ---
**Author:** ![wjChia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wjChia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wjChia)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/23 "2021-12-21T13:14:10Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > The “xi” in president xi’s name is basically like the English word “she” btw. The “x” represents a slightly different sound to “sh”, more of a hissing, but it’s not that different that you wouldn’t be understood saying “she”. more “see” than “she” ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/24 "2021-12-21T13:22:20Z")
> [@wjChia](#): > > more “see” than “she” I disagree. I mean, it’s neither “see” nor “she” and it’s obviously somewhat arbitrary which is the closer facsimile. But [here is a native speaker pronouncing it](https://youtu.be/nTjjjIC3la8?t=23). Definitely seems more like “she” to me. And it definitely sounded closer to “she” in my years living in China. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/25 "2021-12-21T13:39:24Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > Besides, the rule about not naming viruses for places of course pre-dates Covid. Interesting when it’s happened several times post-Covid naming the virus for countries where the variant came from…and also that few made the same stink about it or called it racism. So, yeah…I’m skeptical that this was a thing before China weaponized it to deflect from their fuckup by calling it racism. > [@Mijin](#): > > The Republicans in particular doubled-down on “Wuhan Virus” and such partly to thumb their noses at the WHO, partly to deflect all blame elsewhere and not on any of the US handling, and partly because racism is their brand. But this started when it was still called the ‘Wuhan Virus’ wrt the racism bit…ironic, when they themselves called it that initially as well. But I’ll concede that the Republicans calling it the ‘Chinese Virus’ was motivated in part by racism…and in part just by wanting to thumb their noses at the CCP. But mainly by racism. ---
**Author:** ![wjChia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/d6d6ee/32.png) [@wjChia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wjChia)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/26 "2021-12-21T13:39:29Z")
习 is definitely closer to “see”, if his surname was 许, then yes, it should sound a lot closer to “she”. Anyway, it’s just a pointless nitpick, no hijack intended. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/27 "2021-12-21T13:51:40Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Interesting when it’s happened several times post-Covid naming the virus for countries where the variant came from… No it hasn’t. The names have been Alpha, Delta, Omicron etc. Some news organizations erroneously referred to, for example “the Indian variant” but that was early on and was fairly short-lived before the correct name caught on. > [@wjChia](#): > > 习 is definitely closer to “see”, if his surname was 许, then yes, it should sound a lot closer to “she”. That’s a strange sentence. “xu” is much more like the English word “shoe”. Anyway, I provided a recording of a native Chinese speaker saying “xi”. People can make their own minds up. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/28 "2021-12-21T13:58:51Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > I agree with you about avoiding ‘Xi’ being political, but regarding “Chinese Virus” or “China virus” there was no doubt a racist angle there as it was much the same people who then moved on to saying “Kung flu” and all that other crap. Plus, a lot of the people using the “I’m not racist, I just don’t like the CPC!” argument for using “The China Virus” then turned around and started yelling at US citizens of Asian descent to “Take your virus back to China!!!” So, yeah, maybe the “Hate the CPC, love the C” argument is just window dressing for their racism? ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/29 "2021-12-21T14:11:29Z")
If the next letter in the Greek alphabet were Merkel or Johnson or Kishida or Modi it would also be skipped. The fact that WHO’s “common surname” statement is a bit of window dressing doesn’t mean that they’re just making obeisance to the Chinese by skipping Xi. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/30 "2021-12-21T14:19:36Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > No it hasn’t. The names have been Alpha, Delta, Omicron etc. Some news organizations erroneously referred to, for example “the Indian variant” but that was early on and was fairly short-lived before the correct name caught on. Sigh. Yeah, it did…and you even mentioned it in this paragraph. Alpha, Delta, etc (but not Xi 😛 ) are or were WHO designations. This is different than the scientific name for a virus. Naming a virus after the country or region of origin, such as the Wuhan Virus was always unofficial but happened in many outbreaks and, as noted, in many of the follow-on variants in THIS outbreak. No one called Zaire ebolavirus (or ebola Zaire) racist, West Nile Virus, Middle East Respiratory Syndrome, Zika, etc, nor did anyone make a big deal about India or UK variant. These were always unofficial names and this unofficial naming convention goes back for centuries without anyone calling it racist, even when it was dead wrong (such as Spanish flu). Wuhan virus was just part of that unofficial naming convention, but the CCP made a huge stink about it and called it racist and basically got everyone to call it racist going forward. AFTER the CCP made a big stink, you start to see such stalwarts of the pubic media as CNN calling for a change in this (though I didn’t see them howling about the aforementioned India or UK variant names). To me, this was a tempest in a teacup that was stirred up by the CCP because they didn’t want the virus associated with their country and were trying to deflect that…though, again, THEY called it Wuhan virus initially as well. Anyway, I think that’s all I have to say on this subject of naming as I’m probably the only one annoyed by this. I don’t have an issue not naming viruses after the place of origin (I don’t care one way or the other), but it’s pretty clear WHY this went down as it did, and clear that the fix was in wrt making it ‘racist’ initially but then all the articles stopped once that was in the publics mind and little mention was made when this happened again wrt India and the UK…and probably won’t be brought up again when it’s another country. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/31 "2021-12-21T14:25:32Z")
We will never know, so no way to put that to the test. I’ll say that Mu IS a more common last name (it’s still not that common) in China than Xi is a surname, yet they didn’t bat an eye about it. Of course, it was never about it being a common name (i.e. the WHO explanation was bullshit, which was my original point), it was about not naming it for the current ruler of the CCP, so perhaps if there was a Greek letter for Biden they wouldn’t have done that either. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/32 "2021-12-21T14:28:59Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > So, yeah, maybe the “Hate the CPC, love the C” argument is just window dressing for their racism? Are you calling me a racist? Just want to be clear here. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/33 "2021-12-21T14:40:43Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Are you calling me a racist? Just want to be clear here. I’m saying if you’re using the same argument as the racists, maybe you should stop and think about your overall messaging. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/34 "2021-12-21T14:47:03Z")
Yes, like if I’m a vegetarian, I should think about the overall message because Hitler was a vegetarian as well… Thanks…appreciate you being honest and straightforward on your thoughts towards me. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/35 "2021-12-21T14:52:01Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Yes, like if I’m a vegetarian, I should think about the overall message because Hitler was a vegetarian as well… If you were promoting vegetarianism because it “preserves your pure Aryan blood”, then yeah, maybe? You’re deploying the “hate the CPC” argument in a discussion of “is ‘China Virus’ racist?”, which is a bit more of a problem than just saying you hate the CPC. I’m not a fan of the CPC either, but I also recognize that a whole lot of the discussion around COVID is explicitly racist against all Asians, ethnically Chinese people in particular. So, yeah, maybe take a step back and think about it. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/36 "2021-12-21T14:58:01Z")
> [@Horatius](#): > > If you were promoting vegetarianism because it “preserves your pure Aryan blood”, then yeah, maybe? No. I’m not promoting that the CCP is evil and corrupt because I agree with racists that hate Chinese people. Except apparently in your mind. In my own, it’s pretty simple…they are evil and corrupt. And they manipulate our own media and our own weaknesses, including racism, against us. They did this, clearly, to deflect from their own fuckups. And, to me, this is clear in how the Wuhan virus being racist meme has played out. If racists want to use this to bash on Chinese people in general, then they aren’t doing this for the same reasons or have the same rationale…they merely are mouthing the same words. > [@Horatius](#): > > You’re deploying the “hate the CPC” argument in a discussion of “is ‘China Virus’ racist?”, which is a bit more of a problem than just saying you hate the CPC. I’m saying that the whole thing was the CCP manipulating our own media and our own weaknesses against us. > [@Horatius](#): > > I’m not a fan of the CPC either, but I also recognize that a whole lot of the discussion around COVID is explicitly racist against all Asians, ethnically Chinese people in particular. Sure it is. Since my son’s partner and his family are Chinese, and now live in the US, I’m kind of aware of this as I’ve seen it first hand. > [@Horatius](#): > > So, yeah, maybe take a step back and think about it. Thank you for your input. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/37 "2021-12-21T14:59:31Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Naming a virus after the country or region of origin, such as the Wuhan Virus was always unofficial but happened in many outbreaks and, as noted, in many of the follow-on variants in THIS outbreak. No one called Zaire ebolavirus (or ebola Zaire) racist, West Nile Virus, Middle East Respiratory Syndrome, Zika, etc, nor did anyone make a big deal about India or UK variant. You originally said “post-covid”. I don’t dispute that previously scientists used names like Ebola “Zaire”. Such countries have often complained about the stigma they received for this, and that’s why – at long last – the guidance on naming viruses was updated / formalized. Which happened before covid. Now, no variant of covid has been named for a place. It’s true that, as I say, in the early stages of a variant starting to spread in some location it temporarily colloquially is referred to with that place name. That’s understandable, but that’s not the name of the variant. And it’s a very different thing from certain parties in the US insisting on calling covid-19 “China virus” long after it has a well-known official name. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/38 "2021-12-21T15:07:32Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > And it’s a very different thing from certain parties in the US insisting on calling covid-19 “China virus” long after it has a well-known official name. I already conceded this (I was mad when I wrote what I originally did), but I’ll do so again. I agree…calling it the ‘China virus’ was motivated to a great extent by racism. > [@Mijin](#): > > You originally said “post-covid”. I don’t dispute that previously scientists used names like Ebola “Zaire”. Such countries have often complained about the stigma they received for this, and that’s why – at long last – the guidance on naming viruses was updated / formalized. Which happened before covid. Yet, the widespread use of the Wuhan virus (and Indian and UK variant) were still used…and used by the CCP and their state-run mouthpieces. It wasn’t until the CCP and state-run media started to call it racism that it was labeled such. You can clearly see when the CCP started to complain and western media outlets started to do stories on how this was racist and why it should change. As I said, I don’t have a dog in this fight…I don’t really care what a given virus is or was called. I think it’s good they do a non-scientific naming convention that is divorced from the country of origin as I don’t think knowing where it originated in the name really matters. Often it’s not even where it originated, such as the ironically (considering this side discussion) initially named South Africa variant (now omicron). All I’m saying here is this became a huge thing when the CCP decided they wanted to deflect and went into full-court press mode…using our own press to press home the point. Now, it’s firmly fixed in everyone’s mind that the initial call of the Wuhan virus was racist. ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/39 "2021-12-21T15:28:17Z")
> [@XT](#): > > Yet, the widespread use of the Wuhan virus (and Indian and UK variant) were still used…and used by the CCP and their state-run mouthpieces. It wasn’t until the CCP and state-run media started to call it racism that it was labeled such. You can clearly see when the CCP started to complain and western media outlets started to do stories on how this was racist and why it should change. Again, I lived in China until recently; I never heard anyone refer to it as Wuhan virus colloquially, or on state TV. It was called guanzhuang (coronavirus) or xinguan (novel corona). Now _descriptively_ people may have said “Mystery virus in Wuhan” or whatever in the early days, but that’s not a _name_. Regarding the rest of your claim, we can say that it’s factually false that the _only_ reason for suggesting a non-regional name for the virus was politics, as it’s simply a fact that the official naming convention is not to do that. It’s irrelevant whether China objected to names like “China virus”. The WHO had to give it a generic name according to their own naming convention. To do _otherwise_ would have been to make up new ad hoc rules for political reasons. ---
**Author:** ![XT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xt/32/456_2.png) [@XT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/XT)\ **Post date:** [December 21, 2021, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363/40 "2021-12-21T15:33:22Z")
> [@Mijin](#): > > Again, I lived in China until recently; I never heard anyone refer to it as Wuhan virus colloquially, or on state TV. While they have done a great job of scrubbing this, it’s trivially easy to find. [Here](https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1177375.shtml) is global times…it’s the title of the freaking article: ### Wuhan virus preventable, controllable: commission Assuming you actually read the state media, there are plenty of examples like this early on (i.e. in early 2020)…but later it became a thing. Anyway, I’m not going to play search/link bingo. If you don’t recall or never saw it then you didn’t. I did, mainly because I had people point it out to me as a thing, especially in the Chinese language articles which I can’t read since I don’t read Chinese. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omicron-why-not-epsilon/956363.md?page=3)