# Omnibus Evil MFers in the news thread **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 3, 2023, 11:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496 "2023-05-03T11:05:51Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 25
**Author:** ![enipla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/54ee81/32.png) [@enipla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/enipla)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2023, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/481 "2023-12-17T03:47:19Z")
Interesting about wine and lead bowls. And, well, I’ll stop doing that /s Interesting. Learned something. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2023, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/482 "2023-12-17T03:59:09Z")
You can still drink from lead crystal stemware, but storing liquor in lead crystal decanters isn’t advised. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/483 "2023-12-18T03:58:50Z")
I wouldn’t be too worried about lead glass-- Vitrification is generally the safest way to deal with toxic material. Glass is quite inert. ---
**Author:** ![FluffyBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/ecb155/32.png) [@FluffyBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FluffyBob)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/484 "2023-12-18T16:20:38Z")
Are you sure that is true? I am not convinced the lead is so much encapsulated as part of the structure and possibly able to leach out. My wife blows glass and we have a cold shop in our garage. The coloured glass is generally not recommended for food and beverage use. I believe the accepted practice if to make sure any coloured glass has a coating of neutral clear glass if the object is intended for food use. I do understand that rather than go through expensive safety testing and liability is is more pragmatic for the small companies producing this glass to just issue a disclaimer. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/485 "2023-12-18T17:49:10Z")
> [@FluffyBob](#): > > Are you sure that is true? I am not convinced the lead is so much encapsulated as part of the structure and possibly able to leach out. Serving is fine, storing not so fine. > **[Alcohol should not be stored in leaded crystal decanters](https://www.mcgill.ca/oss/article/it-dangerous-store-alcoholic-beverages-decanters-made-lead-crystal)** > > Glass is made by heating sand and then allowing it to cool down. Sand, or silicon dioxide, has a highly ordered arrangement of its silicon and oxygen atoms. In other words, it has a well-defined crystal structure. When sand is liquified by heat and... > [@Chronos](#): > > I wouldn’t be too worried about lead glass-- Vitrification is generally the safest way to deal with toxic material. Glass is quite inert. Not so much. > Typically, lead crystal contains 24-32% lead oxide. If beverages are stored for a long time in decanters made of lead crystal, tiny amounts of lead can leach out. The maximum allowable level of lead in drinking water is 50 micrograms per litre, a concentration that can be exceeded in wines that are kept in crystal decanters for a long time. Port wine, for example, can steadily increase its lead concentration up to 50 fold in four months, from 90 to 4000 micrograms per litre. Brandy stored over five years can have over 20,000 micrograms per litre. So while there is no problem _serving_ alcoholic beverages from lead crystal decanters at your dinner party, they should not be _stored_ in them for any period of time. Joseph Schwarcz is someone who seems to be pretty authoritative on the subject of chemistry. > **[Joseph A. Schwarcz](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_A._Schwarcz)** > > Joseph A. Schwarcz (born 1947) is an author and a sessional instructor at McGill University. He is the director of McGill's Office for Science and Society. > Schwarcz is an only child, born in Sopron, Hungary to Jewish parents. During the Hungarian uprising in 1956, when he was age 9, the family escaped over the border to Austria and migrated to Canada and settled in Montreal, Quebec. Schwarcz attended Logan school on Darlington and went on to study chemistry at McGill University in Montreal wher... ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/486 "2023-12-18T18:21:14Z")
> [@](#): > > The maximum allowable level of lead in drinking water is 50 micrograms per litre, a concentration that can be exceeded in wines that are kept in crystal decanters for a long time. Port wine, for example, can steadily increase its lead concentration up to 50 fold in four months, from 90 to 4000 micrograms per litre. If I’m not misreading that, it’s saying that even before it’s stored in lead crystal, port wine starts off with nearly twice the allowable level of lead. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/487 "2023-12-18T18:47:59Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > If I’m not misreading that, it’s saying that even before it’s stored in lead crystal, port wine starts off with nearly twice the allowable level of lead. You’re not reading it wrong. Though note that 50 micrograms is the maximum allowable level for _drinking water_, but per the OIV the maximum amount is 100-150 (listed as 0.1-0.15 milligrams in their chart) for wine. [https://www.oiv.int/standards/international-code-of-oenological-practices/annexes/maximum-acceptable-limits](https://www.oiv.int/standards/international-code-of-oenological-practices/annexes/maximum-acceptable-limits) It would probably have been better to cite safe levels in wine in the article, admittedly. According to this paper which cites multiple studies, the lead in wine is generally safe for adult human consumption. > **[A human health risk assessment of lead (Pb) ingestion among adult wine...](https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40550-017-0052-z)** > > Background Recent concerns have been raised regarding heavy metal content in wine and its potential health implications. The goal of this study was to determine if lead (Pb) intake poses a health risk among adult consumers of wine. This was achieved... 90 micrograms per liter is safe. 4,000 is not. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/488 "2023-12-18T19:01:17Z")
> [@Atamasama](#): > > You’re not reading it wrong. Though note that 50 micrograms is the maximum allowable level for _drinking water_, but per the OIV the maximum amount is 100-150 (listed as 0.1-0.15 milligrams in their chart) for wine. Is that just because people (presumably) drink less wine than water, or because the alcohol somehow mitigates against the risk of the lead, or because wine and water are regulated by different bodies who use different methods for determining safe standards? ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/489 "2023-12-18T19:20:34Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Is that just because people (presumably) drink less wine than water It is this yes. This is from the study in my last post, this time citing the EPA: > While some wines were reported to contain Pb concentrations above the current EPA drinking water standard for Pb (15 μg/L), it is critical to note that the EPA’s drinking water consumption rate is considerably higher than the typical daily intake rate of wine. The recommended maximum intake for wine is one to two 5-oz glasses per day, whereas the recommended daily intake for water is 2.7 to 3.7 L (91 to 125 oz) per day, and the EPA estimated consumption rate for adults is 2.4 L (81 oz) per day (ACE [2008](https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40550-017-0052-z#ref-CR1); DHHS [2005](https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40550-017-0052-z#ref-CR18); EPA [2011](https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40550-017-0052-z#ref-CR23), [2015](https://foodsafetyandrisk.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40550-017-0052-z#ref-CR24)). ---
**Author:** ![digs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/digs/32/14889_2.png) [@digs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/digs)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2023, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/490 "2023-12-18T21:28:30Z")
Note to self: _Drink more water than wine in 2024…_ ---
**Author:** ![Wallaby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/dc4da7/32.png) [@Wallaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallaby)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2023, 7:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/491 "2023-12-19T07:27:21Z")
This time for sure! ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/492 "2023-12-27T03:40:51Z")
Happy holidays! Minimum wage is going up in California, so Pizza Hut does the responsible thing and [fires all its drivers](https://www.aol.com/california-pizza-huts-lay-off-234021512.html). Yeah, there’s no way to not see that as evil. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/493 "2023-12-27T15:40:07Z")
To be clear, it isn’t Pizza Hut doing the firing. It’s certain _Pizza Hut franchisees._ Yum! Brands may or may not be evil - those franchisees most certainly are. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/494 "2023-12-27T15:46:46Z")
Pizza Hut is evil for putting hot dogs and yellow mustard on pizza. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/495 "2023-12-27T15:47:32Z")
How do they expect to stay in business? I mean, sure, there are some pick-up and dine-in orders, but delivery is the core of the business for a big chain pizzeria. And Pizza Hut is not a premium product where, if people can’t get it delivered, they’ll go drive to pick it up themselves… They’ll just switch to some other pizza delivery place. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/496 "2023-12-27T15:47:50Z")
Lot of people now asking where they’re supposed to get weed ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/497 "2023-12-27T15:50:10Z")
Any federal land, presumably. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/498 "2023-12-27T17:21:09Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > How do they expect to stay in business? They won’t, and then they’ll blame Biden for their own idiotic self-nut-punching decisions. ---
**Author:** ![Mighty\_Mouse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mighty_mouse/32/7776_2.png) [@Mighty\_Mouse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mighty_Mouse)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/499 "2023-12-27T17:39:26Z")
From a source inside Yum! Brand: They are planning to go to strictly gig delivery. Yum! Brands contracts with Pizza Hut and KFC franchisees in the US give the franchisee a lot of latitude. ---
**Author:** ![Atamasama](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/atamasama/32/12961_2.png) [@Atamasama](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Atamasama)\ **Post date:** [December 27, 2023, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496/500 "2023-12-27T17:46:06Z")
> [@Mighty\_Mouse](#): > > From a source inside Yum! Brand: They are planning to go to strictly gig delivery. That seemed obvious to me the moment I saw the headline. The last few years a number of fast food places around me have begun advertising about how they now deliver food to you. But they never do, it’s all through someone else like DoorDash or Grubhub. By this I mean, you go to the restaurant’s actual website, place an order from their menu, and then someone delivers your order (but it’s through a third party). That’s just how food delivery is done now. Pizza Hut is catching up to how everyone else does it. There are other pizza places around me (Little Caesar’s and Mod Pizza come to mind) that deliver that way and have been doing that for a while. Expect this to be the norm. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496.md?page=24) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/omnibus-evil-mfers-in-the-news-thread/983496.md?page=26)