# On Frazier...What word was this? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [May 2, 2014, 7:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491 "2014-05-02T07:19:59Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Tread](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/53a042/32.png) [@Tread](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tread)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 7:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/21 "2014-05-04T07:02:02Z")
> [@Alley\_Dweller](#): > > I heard it was **Frasier** and **Niles**. Can anyone confirm? I’ve heard it both ways ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 7:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/22 "2014-05-04T07:04:49Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > So what’s _metier_? Seriously. It’s your forte. ---
**Author:** ![Leo\_Bloom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leo_bloom/32/10377_2.png) [@Leo\_Bloom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leo_Bloom)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/23 "2014-05-04T13:09:08Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It’s your forte. Is it? Couldn’t something be my métier, and I’d suck at it? I’d never use it that way, but still. (Notice I still am studiously avoiding going to a dictionary, because this is always more fun to explore words.) ---
**Author:** ![AncientHumanoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ancienthumanoid/32/278_2.png) [@AncientHumanoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AncientHumanoid)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/24 "2014-05-04T16:22:41Z")
> [@Manduck](#): > > And meteors a fiery balls of rock. And Wendy’s burger are meatier than those from that Scottish joint, MacDonald’s ---
**Author:** ![burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/burpo_the_wonder_mutt/32/365_2.png) [@burpo\_the\_wonder\_mutt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burpo_the_wonder_mutt)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/25 "2014-05-04T16:26:36Z")
> [@AncientHumanoid](#): > > And Wendy’s burger are meatier than those from that Scottish joint, MacDonald’s But they’re not beatier, bigger or bouncier than the Who album. 🙂 I’m sorry, I’m gonna go take a nap. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/26 "2014-05-04T18:18:49Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Is it? Couldn’t something be my métier, and I’d suck at it? I suppose if you sucked at everything, the thing you sucked at _least_ could be called your metier. But generally it means something that you’re good at. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/27 "2014-05-04T18:29:23Z")
> [@Leo\_Bloom](#): > > Is it? Couldn’t something be my métier, and I’d suck at it? I’d never use it that way, but still. (Notice I still am studiously avoiding going to a dictionary, because this is always more fun to explore words.) My understanding is that both mean something you’re notably good at. But the connotation is that your metier is a professional skill while your forte is a social skill. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/28 "2014-05-04T18:38:04Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > My understanding is that both mean something you’re notably good at. But the connotation is that your metier is a professional skill while your forte is a social skill. “Forte” is something you’re good at - it’s your strength. “Metier” means what you do; your profession or usual activity, with the secondary meaning being that it’s something you’re good at, too. ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/29 "2014-05-04T19:10:57Z")
And “_forte_” is a French word that refers to part of a foil, it seems to have no relation to the Italian word “_forté_” (loud). The nominal opposite is the French word “_foible_”, which refers to another part of the foil which is weaker than the _forte_. Technically, the trailing “e” is silent, but most people (Americans, anyway) pronounce it because otherwise it sounds too much like your stronghold. ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 7:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/30 "2014-05-04T19:33:20Z")
> [@eschereal](#): > > And “_forte_” is a French word that refers to part of a foil, it seems to have no relation to the Italian word “_forté_” (loud). Huh? The Latin word is fortis, which means strong, and gave rise to both words. It’s pretty clear that they are about as closely related as you can get. But before this thread I didn’t realize the standard American pronunciation of forte was one syllable. I’ve always heard it spoken as two syllables. ---
**Author:** ![Folacin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folacin/32/3195_2.png) [@Folacin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folacin)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/31 "2014-05-04T20:03:58Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Huh? The Latin word is fortis, which means strong, and gave rise to both words. It’s pretty clear that they are about as closely related as you can get. > > But before this thread I didn’t realize the standard American pronunciation of forte was one syllable. I’ve always heard it spoken as two syllables. I think you misread \*\*eschereal’s \*\*statement. Most American’s (at least all the ones I know) pronounce it as two syllables. I assume he is saying that in French, the ‘e’ is silent. ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 8:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/32 "2014-05-04T20:41:39Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > I think you misread \*\*eschereal’s \*\*statement. Most American’s (at least all the ones I know) pronounce it as two syllables. > > I assume he is saying that in French, the ‘e’ is silent. If you Google around, it appears that the prescriptivist pronunciation is the French one. But, as you say, I’ve only ever heard the two-syllable pronunciation in the wild. ---
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2014, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/33 "2014-05-04T20:53:06Z")
> [@Folacin](#): > > I think you misread \*\*eschereal’s \*\*statement. Most American’s (at least all the ones I know) pronounce it as two syllables. > > I assume he is saying that in French, the ‘e’ is silent. I’ve seen it spelled “fortay.” But I’ve also seen “voila” spelled “wha-la.” ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/34 "2014-05-05T16:00:08Z")
> [@Jinx](#): > > When a female friend takes Miles Who is Miles? ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_Door](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/50afbb/32.png) [@Bill\_Door](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_Door)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/35 "2014-05-05T16:11:00Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > If you Google around, it appears that the prescriptivist pronunciation is the French one. But, as you say, I’ve only ever heard the two-syllable pronunciation in the wild. That word, like niche, is one that most people pronounce incorrectly. If you say it right, you will most likely be corrected. ---
**Author:** ![johnspartan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a183cd/32.png) [@johnspartan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/johnspartan)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/36 "2014-05-05T20:09:21Z")
m’loo, as in my loo, which is English English for my toilet. She was saying she wasn’t Frazier wasn’t in Miles’s toilet. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/37 "2014-05-05T20:25:10Z")
> [@johnspartan](#): > > m’loo, as in my loo, which is English English for my toilet. She was saying she wasn’t Frazier wasn’t in Miles’s toilet. ¿Qué? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/38 "2014-05-05T20:32:49Z")
> [@Erdosain](#): > > Huh? The Latin word is fortis, which means strong, and gave rise to both words. It’s pretty clear that they are about as closely related as you can get. > > But before this thread I didn’t realize the standard American pronunciation of forte was one syllable. I’ve always heard it spoken as two syllables. Among people who learn pronunciations from dictionaries and etymologists, the e is silent. Most Americans pronounce it like the Italian word with a different meaning. Perhaps they learned it in music classes. ---
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/39 "2014-05-05T20:43:43Z")
> [@johnspartan](#): > > m’loo, as in my loo, which is English English for my toilet. She was saying she wasn’t Frazier wasn’t in Miles’s toilet. lol ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2014, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491/40 "2014-05-05T21:38:19Z")
> [@Bill\_Door](#): > > That word, like niche, is one that most people pronounce incorrectly. If you say it right, you will most likely be corrected. As in probably every language words borrowed from another language often get a different pronunciation. In short order it isn’t the wrong pronunciation, its the correct American pronunciation. And only the pedants care. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-frazier-what-word-was-this/687491.md?page=3)