# On The Road Again - Our Journey Through The West Coast of the USA **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [September 11, 2013, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576 "2013-09-11T15:54:22Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Terr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Terr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Terr)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 9:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/41 "2013-09-16T09:05:13Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > [We’ve seen cars without license plates everywhere.](http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s142/featherlou/San%20Diego%20Trip%202013/SAM_0279_zps60d66d4c.jpg) WTF, man? License plates are optional in the US? All those were new cars, right? In California, when you buy a new car, you are allowed to drive without a rear license plate until you get one from DMV. May take a while. And, since it is a “fix it” ticket, some people cannot be bothered to put the plates on for year. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 16, 2013, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/42 "2013-09-16T16:04:47Z")
> [@palacheck](#): > > When I see the user **Cat Whisperer** I’m certain that, at minimum 1 out of every 10 posts will feature a complaint or snarky aside about America and/or Americans. > > Aren’t you planning on retiring here? Nope. 🙂 > [@Terr](#): > > All those were new cars, right? > > In California, when you buy a new car, you are allowed to drive without a rear license plate until you get one from DMV. May take a while. > > And, since it is a “fix it” ticket, some people cannot be bothered to put the plates on for year. Ah, that makes sense. So you just drive with no plate until such time as you’re required to put one on. We figured that the fine for not having a license plate was so low that people just don’t bother with one and cross their fingers. Off to visit the ocean around San Francisco today - later, dudes! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 17, 2013, 4:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/43 "2013-09-17T04:39:08Z")
Day Eight - San Francisco tourist stuff. We went to Fisherman’s Wharf, Pier 39, had clam chowder in a sourdough bowl, saw sea lions sunning themselves, took pictures of Alcatraz and Lombard Street, rode a cable car, and ate Ghirardelli chocolate. We also had a very nice dinner with **Roderick Femm** and **BlondeBear** , after walking our feet off all day. San Francisco is very hilly. I’m not planning to walk much tomorrow. 🙂 We also learned that drivers, walkers, and cyclists are all insane in San Francisco, but they seem to co-exist somehow. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/44 "2013-09-18T03:07:35Z")
Day Nine - We did not walk very much. We walked around the Golden Gate Park, saw the Conservatory of Flowers, drove across the Golden Gate Bridge, and spent the rest of the day in the car. We were planning to drive up the coast highway, but it turns out that the up and down and constant curves were not good for our stomachs - we bailed after about an hour and a half, looking kind of green. We saw part of the Avenue of the Giants, and drove our car through the Chandelier Tree (a huge redwood). The redwoods are truly awe-inspiring. The further we get from San Francisco and Los Angeles, the more normal the drivers get. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Precambrianmollusc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/precambrianmollusc/32/63_2.png) [@Precambrianmollusc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Precambrianmollusc)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/45 "2013-09-18T03:40:11Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Ran into some serious rain in southern Utah - I thought that was the desert! What the heck is going on with it raining there?!? > > Once again, reminded that Utah drivers are very fast and very stupid. So many people talking on cell phones and texting and weaving in and out of lanes at 85 miles an hour in traffic. Weather has been pretty crazy here in aug/sept, lots of late afternoon thunderstorms with some epic downpours. I haven’t watered the grass for a month and it is still green, normally it would be brown or red and smokey/flames by this time of year with no water. There has been quite a bit of flooding on the burn scars from the wild fires earlier in the year. Yep, I-15 drivers are nuts, but Deerfoot drivers are not a whole lot better, when I am up there I have adopted the “I am in a pickup truck and am changing lanes now, the rest of you can sort yourselves out” mentality. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 3:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/46 "2013-09-18T03:47:48Z")
If you go through the Lancaster in the Antelope Valley (Western Mojave Desert in Northern L.A. County), stop by [Crazy Otto’s](http://www.crazyottosdiners.com) on 20th St. W. and Ave. L and have ham and eggs with biscuits and gravy. Think of me, and maybe I’ll be able to taste them vicariously. Ye Olde King’s Head in Santa Monica has excellent fish & chips, and bangers & mash. In Southern California, drivers are fast and close. Everyone knows what everyone is going to do, though. They still crash into each other, but the system generally works. Remember that motorcycles are allowed to ride between lanes of cars. Please give them room. They’ll be next to you for less than a second. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/47 "2013-09-18T03:49:31Z")
> [@Precambrianmollusc](#): > > Weather has been pretty crazy here in aug/sept, lots of late afternoon thunderstorms with some epic downpours. I haven’t watered the grass for a month and it is still green, normally it would be brown or red and smokey/flames by this time of year with no water. There has been quite a bit of flooding on the burn scars from the wild fires earlier in the year. That was a pretty epic downpour we were driving through. It could have been worse, though - it could have been snow. 🙂 > [@](#): > > Yep, I-15 drivers are nuts, but Deerfoot drivers are not a whole lot better, when I am up there I have adopted the “I am in a pickup truck and am changing lanes now, the rest of you can sort yourselves out” mentality. Yeah, true enough. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 3:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/48 "2013-09-18T03:52:54Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > If you go through the Antelope Valley (Western Mojave Desert in Northern L.A. County), stop by [Crazy Otto’s](http://www.crazyottosdiners.com) on 20th St. W. and Ave. L and have ham and eggs with biscuits and gravy. Think of me, and maybe I’ll be able to taste them vicariously. > > Ye Olde King’s Head in Santa Monica has excellent fish & chips, and bangers & mash. > > In Southern California, drivers are fast and close. Everyone knows what everyone is going to do, though. They still crash into each other, but the system generally works. Remember that motorcycles are allowed to ride between lanes of cars. Please give them room. They’ll be next to you for less than a second. We’re already at Eureka, CA on our way back north - too late! We did notice the motorcycles lane-splitting - it startled Jim every time one came up beside him, but no problems. The drivers in LA and San Francisco were indeed fast and close, but it did generally work. I can’t help but think how much better it would work if they gave up chronic under-taking and talking/texting while driving, though. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/49 "2013-09-18T03:54:58Z")
I am loving reading about your trip. I am sorry that the coast highway didn’t work out for you. It really is stunning, but I can understand it making you sick. > [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > In Southern California, drivers are fast and close. Everyone knows what everyone is going to do, though. They still crash into each other, but the system generally works. Remember that motorcycles are allowed to ride between lanes of cars. Please give them room. They’ll be next to you for less than a second. I totally agree. I learned how to drive in LA and I was (almost) never surprised by what another driver did unless they had out of state plates. I found it very hard to adjust to the seemingly random swerving of East Coast drivers when I moved away. (Seriously, it’s not ok to turn left when the light turns green if there are other cars who are planning to drive straight forward. Ever.) I came to realize that the drivers in So. Cal aren’t bad, they are just diving by a different set of unwritten rules than the rest of the world. People who don’t drive that way are just as scary to us as we are to you. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 3:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/50 "2013-09-18T03:57:34Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > We’re already at Eureka, CA on our way back north - too late! Didn’t have time to read the thread. Oh, well. Next time. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 4:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/51 "2013-09-18T04:00:32Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > \I came to realize that the drivers in So. Cal aren’t bad, they are just diving by a different set of unwritten rules than the rest of the world. People who don’t drive that way are just as scary to us as we are to you. I think Jim was getting the hang of it after a couple of days - there really did seem to be a different set of rules there. ---
**Author:** ![Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dread_pirate_jimbo/32/3897_2.png) [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dread_Pirate_Jimbo)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/52 "2013-09-18T04:20:17Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > \ > > In Southern California, drivers are fast and close. Everyone knows what everyone is going to do, though. They still crash into each other, but the system generally works. Remember that motorcycles are allowed to ride between lanes of cars. Please give them room. They’ll be next to you for less than a second. > [@NAF1138](#): > > \ > I totally agree. I learned how to drive in LA and I was (almost) never surprised by what another driver did unless they had out of state plates. I found it very hard to adjust to the seemingly random swerving of East Coast drivers when I moved away. (Seriously, it’s not ok to turn left when the light turns green if there are other cars who are planning to drive straight forward. Ever.) I came to realize that the drivers in So. Cal aren’t bad, they are just diving by a different set of unwritten rules than the rest of the world. People who don’t drive that way are just as scary to us as we are to you. As the official road trip chauffeur, the thing that most makes me nervous about driving in California is the lack of predictable behaviour. Undertaking is commonplace, turn signals are the exception, not the rule, and shoulder checking simply isn’t done as far as I can tell. From my perspective, as someone who has driven in 18 US states as well as 5 Canadian provinces and one of the territories, I find California driving by far the most stressful. It isn’t so much that Californians operate with a different set of unwritten rules so much as they just kind of do as they please in a massive “everyone for themselves” frenzy. At least, that’s how it looks from my seat. To be fair, there has really only been one near miss so far on this trip where I thought we were actually going to crash, when an SUV in San Francisco swerved out in front of us on the highway into the far left lane and then stopped while I was approaching at close to 40 mph. How I managed to not cream them, the side rail of the road, or get rear-ended is a bit of a mystery to me. Aside from that, I’ve managed to spot most of the other people moving to cut me off and when I haven’t I’ve managed to not occupy the same space as the other vehicle in the moment when they’ve jumped into my space. YMMV. Literally. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/53 "2013-09-18T17:00:39Z")
Off to Portland today - we have Powell’s City of Books, The Grotto, and Waterfront Park on our agenda. ---
**Author:** ![Lancia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lancia/32/17174_2.png) [@Lancia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lancia)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/54 "2013-09-18T17:22:06Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Off to Portland today - we have Powell’s City of Books, The Grotto, and Waterfront Park on our agenda. If you’re looking for a good place for dinner, I have to recommended Abu Rasheed, a Lebanese restaurant in the 1900 block of SW 6th ave. Two blocks down is Pizzicato, which serves excellent if traditionally mainstream salads and pizzas. I would also do absolutely everything in your power to procure some whole-bean Stumptown coffee. Hands-down some of the best coffee in the country. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/55 "2013-09-18T18:58:20Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Off to Portland today - we have Powell’s City of Books, The Grotto, and Waterfront Park on our agenda. Try Pok Pok for the Asian wings and other street dishes. There are so many good places to eat that I hesitate to try to recommend one, but Yelp may be your friend. Or Urban Spoon. ---
**Author:** ![MonkeyMensch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@MonkeyMensch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MonkeyMensch)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/56 "2013-09-19T01:41:33Z")
Undertaking on the freeway: I’m a most-of-my-life-Californian and I had to Google it. Having had it pointed out to me now I sure will notice it in the future. I don’t do it as a rule. My ideal protocol for all drivers is this: if you come up on someone from behind in your lane move one lane to the left; if someone comes up on you from behind in your lane move one lane to the right. And of course the other place I’ve lived in my life was Idaho. 🙂 **CW** , it’s been a lovely thread and I’m glad you’re enjoying your trip. It has reminded me of some of the nearby spots that, however touristy, really should be enjoyed from time to time by the locals because they really are quite nice. (The spots, not necessarily the locals.) Drive safe. ---
**Author:** ![NAF1138](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/naf1138/32/3245_2.png) [@NAF1138](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NAF1138)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/57 "2013-09-19T03:32:25Z")
> [@Dread\_Pirate\_Jimbo](#): > > It isn’t so much that Californians operate with a different set of unwritten rules so much as they just kind of do as they please in a massive “everyone for themselves” frenzy. At least, that’s how it looks from my seat. I totally understand that. Totally. I understand it because I had to make the transition to learning how to drive somewhere else. Believe me when I say that it’s almost the opposite of “everyone for themselves” and it just looks that way because behavior that is totally predictable to a local is totally unexpected to you. Our most common complaint about the traffic on the East Coast is that people drive as individuals out here and don’t look out for each other the way CA drivers do. I understand how crazy that sounds. Anyway, that’s a total side conversation. How was Portland? ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 3:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/58 "2013-09-19T03:55:04Z")
Portland’s good so far - we had dinner and pie at Shari’s Cafe. Not the best food ever, but the price was right, it’s close to the hotel, and hey, pie! 🙂 Thanks for the suggestions, guys - we’ll try to fit some of them in! Oh yeah, we hit another beach along the coast today (I think it was Trinidad State Beach) - have I mentioned how terrifying the unmitigated ocean is? I mean, I love it and all, but it’s terrifying! ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/59 "2013-09-19T16:03:16Z")
> [@NAF1138](#): > > I totally understand that. Totally. I understand it because I had to make the transition to learning how to drive somewhere else. Believe me when I say that it’s almost the opposite of “everyone for themselves” and it just looks that way because behavior that is totally predictable to a local is totally unexpected to you. Our most common complaint about the traffic on the East Coast is that people drive as individuals out here and don’t look out for each other the way CA drivers do. I understand how crazy that sounds. Continuing the hijack… In California (or Southern California, anyway) everyone knows the frustration of crowded freeways, how difficult it can be to get onto one, and how hard it can be to get to an offramp when you’re two lanes over. ISTM that since everyone knows this, they’re more likely to let someone in. ‘You jerk! Why didn’t you move over a mile ago so you could take the offramp? All right, I’ll let you in. I might have some cerebral flatulence myself sometime.’ In Southern California, everyone is in a hurry. If someone is in a greater hurry, people tend to get out of the way if there is room. The general rule is: ‘I’ll let you get away with it this time, and someone will let me get away with it later.’ Everyone understands this, and so everyone _expects_ other drivers to drive that way. And it works. Up here in Washington, and especially down in Oregon, people drive slowly and they will _not_ get out of the left lane. I was up here for years before I heard anyone refer to the ‘fast lane’. Lane splitting: It’s allowed, as long as you’re not a jerk about it. Most people move out of the way. Andy why not? A motorcycle will be abeam for a second or less; except when traffic is actually stopped, in which case they’ll be there for a few seconds. If you try to block them, you have them very close to you for as long as you’re blocking them; perhaps minutes. You’re creating a hazard, and you’re just pushing up your blood pressure and pissing someone off needlessly. Let the rider pass, and you’ll likely get a wave of thanks. Now, I don’t want to give the impression that SoCal drivers are all sitting behind their wheels watching for other drivers to do expected things. As a motorcyclist, I have seen more than my share of ‘Left Seat Passengers’ – people who are just going along for the ride, and happen to have a steering wheel in front of them. Motorcyclists are wary of LSPs, so they’re generally not a problem. They don’t seem to be much of an issue around other cars. (Still, I’ve been rear-ended three times by people who were not paying attention; and last week I allowed myself to be distracted by an eight-legged passenger in front of me and rear-ended someone. It happens.) ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [September 20, 2013, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576/60 "2013-09-20T01:26:07Z")
> [@MonkeyMensch](#): > > Undertaking on the freeway: I’m a most-of-my-life-Californian and I had to Google it. Having had it pointed out to me now I sure will notice it in the future. Born and raised and currently Californian. I had to google it too. I like the and culture that endorses the “pass on the left, but get out of the way unless you’re passing” idea. I do wish that’s what we have here. We don’t. Our laws (and culture) make it OK to pass on the right, so we do. There are times when I love this, but I do think we’d be better off the other way. That said, I think So Cal drivers generally do drive better than others (we get lots of practice). But, yeah, there are practices common here that make it harder for those not from here. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-road-again-our-journey-through-the-west-coast-of-the-usa/668576.md?page=4)