# On the subject of attacking an armed man and getting shot **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [May 9, 2020, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460 "2020-05-09T08:18:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/61 "2020-05-10T14:06:13Z")
I, too, have wandered around buildings under construction. I 5hink the last time was in college, when they were building a new dorm and the framing was put up. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/62 "2020-05-10T14:10:52Z")
> [@](#): > > If he was checking out a house under construction without permission so what? What’s criminal about it? What is criminal about it is [the checking out a house under construction without permission](https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/criminal-trespassing-law.html). ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/63 "2020-05-10T14:18:15Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > What is criminal about it is [the checking out a house under construction without permission](https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/criminal-trespassing-law.html). Your cite does not say what you claim it does. Not at all. You just had to read past the first sentence. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/64 "2020-05-10T14:18:15Z")
With Georgia specifically it looks like [there does need to be a “no trespassing” sign up](https://www.atclawfirm.com/understanding-trespassing-charges-in-georgia/) for it to be criminal just to be there. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/65 "2020-05-10T14:20:22Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > What is criminal about it is [the checking out a house under construction without permission](https://www.nolo.com/legal-encyclopedia/criminal-trespassing-law.html). I didn’t know about that law, and it is a good bet he didn’t either. Your tying it to burglary, or worse, _assuming_ that he intended to burglarize the site, is absolutely asinine. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/66 "2020-05-10T14:22:53Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > With Georgia specifically it looks like [there does need to be a “no trespassing” sign up](https://www.atclawfirm.com/understanding-trespassing-charges-in-georgia/) for it to be criminal just to be there. So, do you want to backtrack on that burglary crap? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/67 "2020-05-10T14:34:09Z")
[And here is the video](https://www.wsbtv.com/news/local/like-you-were-hunting-an-animal-ahmad-arberys-family-reacts-video-his-death/MHZSLUQWDFDBHA4USWMVDPQ52A/). Note the porta-potty outside, eliminating the “had to pee” excuse. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/68 "2020-05-10T14:36:46Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > So, do you want to backtrack on that burglary crap? Nope. There is no vaid excuse for him to wander into someone else’s property and spend minutes inside a house under construction. None. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/69 "2020-05-10T14:38:02Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > Nope. There is no vaid excuse for him to wander into someone else’s property and spend minutes inside a house under construction. None. _ **That is NOT burglary, asshole!** _ ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/70 "2020-05-10T14:43:42Z")
That video _appears_ to show him walking into a home under construction, but all I see is a tree blocking the view as to whether he entered the home under construction or merely looked through a side window and/or looked around the back for a little bit. Is there any video showing him actually entering the place? ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/71 "2020-05-10T14:53:22Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > _ **That is NOT burglary, asshole!** _ You are right–burglary is only one of the possible reasons that he was entering the private property of a random stranger and wandering around without permission. It is just IMHO the most logical one. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/72 "2020-05-10T14:54:16Z")
I don’t think that would be considered ‘burglary,’ as the house is uninhabitable, but it would be simple trespassing or unauthorized access onto private property. Hardly worth drawing pistols out though. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/73 "2020-05-10T14:56:53Z")
Your HO isn’t worth SFA. Why embarrass yourself trying to convince us your opinion has merit? Why not just say you think it’s okay to shoot people if you think you have a reason to? ---
**Author:** ![Northern\_Piper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/northern_piper/32/5304_2.png) [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/74 "2020-05-10T15:13:52Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > You are right–burglary is only one of the possible reasons that he was entering the private property of a random stranger and wandering around without permission. It is just IMHO the most logical one. Here’s the definition of the law of burglary in Georgia, [according to a Georgia law firm](https://www.georgiacriminallawyer.com/burglary): > [@](#): > > **Georgia Law on Burglary** > In Georgia, burglary is defined as the **breaking and entering** into any structure **with the intent to commit a felony therein**. You must intend to commit an underlying offense, which can be a crime against property, such as theft; or a crime against a person, such as assault. Like other Georgia criminal charges, burglary can be charged in different degrees according to the severity of the crime. O.C.G.A. §16-7-1. You’ve quoted the key passage, where the 911 operator clearly knows what the law of burglary is: > [@](#): > > The dispatcher responded: “ **And you said someone is breaking into it right now**? > > **“No,” the caller said. “It’s all open** , it’s under construction. So, what breaking and entering are you asserting Mr Arbery did, and where’s your evidence for that? What door or window are you asserting he forced open? Second, what was the felonious intent? What felony is there evidence that he intended to commit? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/75 "2020-05-10T15:15:00Z")
> [@xenophon41](#): > > Over the past several years, my wife and I have walked through probably two hundred houses under construction. Were we casing the joints? Looking for workmen to rob? Stealing wire or tools? You can’t expect people to answer this question without knowing how dark your skin is. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/76 "2020-05-10T15:16:17Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > You are right–burglary is only one of the possible reasons that he was entering the private property of a random stranger and wandering around without permission. It is just IMHO the most logical one. It’s a construction site, and the article indicated that he was seen walking around the property not actually inside a finished, habitable structure. There’s no felony in progress. I don’t advise lurking around construction sites, but I can remember wandering onto private property numerous times when I was a kid or a teenager - everything from a neighbor’s front lawn to construction sites to demolition sites to college baseball fields. My friends and I were simply warned to get off the property immediately - problem solved. You know why? Because even when we were teenagers and physically mature enough to whip someone’s ass or worse for confronting us, the people who saw us trespassing still didn’t make the assumption that we were dangerous. They didn’t confront us with guns. They didn’t treat us like we were dangerous beasts that had escaped from a wildlife park. Ahmaud Arbery is dead because the people who saw him simply wandering around on the wrong property assumed, just as George Zimmerman did with Trayvon Martin, that he was black and was therefore a drug-dealing thug. All that was required was a simple phone call to the cops. Arbery would be alive, and they wouldn’t be spending their life savings to defend their freedom. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/77 "2020-05-10T15:23:56Z")
> [@Northern\_Piper](#): > > Here’s the definition of the law of burglary in Georgia, [according to a Georgia law firm](https://www.georgiacriminallawyer.com/burglary): > > You’ve quoted the key passage, where the 911 operator clearly knows what the law of burglary is: > > So, what breaking and entering are you asserting Mr Arbery did, and where’s your evidence for that? What door or window are you asserting he forced open? > > Second, what was the felonious intent? What felony is there evidence that he intended to commit? You need to address this to Czarcasm, since he is the one who brought up bulgary, _not_ me. I said only “rob.” ---
**Author:** ![chela](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chela/32/21582_2.png) [@chela](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chela)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/78 "2020-05-10T15:31:39Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > You need to address this to Czarcasm, since he is the one who brought up bulgary, _not_ me. I said only “rob.” Why did you say rob? What made you assume he was taking property forcibly from another? No where is there a victim of robbery or burglary by him. Yet he s dead and also innocent of your slander. ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/79 "2020-05-10T15:34:16Z")
> [@Darren\_Garrison](#): > > You need to address this to Czarcasm, since he is the one who brought up bulgary, _not_ me. I said only “rob.” You’re really not helping your argument, but I’ll play along. > [@Georgia Law Firm Lawson & Berry](#): > > [In Georgia, a person commits robbery when they take property from another person or the immediate presence of another person with the intent to commit theft. O.C.G.A § 16-8-40. There are three ways as to how Robbery can occur, through: > [ul] > [li]Use of force;[/li][li]Intimidation, threat, or placing the other person in fear of immediate serious bodily injury to himself or another; or[/li][li]By sudden snatching[/li][/ul]](https://www.georgiacriminallawyer.com/robbery) So, which of these are shown or intimated in the video? ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [May 10, 2020, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460/80 "2020-05-10T15:46:18Z")
I think the sidetrack of beating on Darren Garrison for making the observation that he may have been doing something wrong is mistaken, since it tends to carry the implication that something here hinges on Arbery being completely innocent of _any_ wrongdoing. It does not. Perhaps he was up to no good, who knows. What would it change if video emerged of him actually stealing something? As asahi has said, white people are not held to some standard of sainthood where suspicion (justified or not) that they may have recently been committing some minor non-violent crime (and present no physical threat whatsoever, imminent or otherwise) leads to a heavily armed redneck lynch mob setting out to confront and murder them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/on-the-subject-of-attacking-an-armed-man-and-getting-shot/853460.md?page=5)