# Once Upon A Time \[edited title\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [October 23, 2011, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574 "2011-10-23T21:19:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Devil_s_Grandmother)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/241 "2011-12-16T19:51:38Z")
> [@pancakes3](#): > > [Regina/EvilQueen]… knows about a prophesy of snow’s baby undoing it all, and the blatant ways that emma is unraveling the magic just makes all of the queen’s moves completely illogical. really, she’s just awful at her job of being evil. Wait, does Regina know that SnowWhite’s baby can undo the curse? I thought only Snow, Charming and Rumpelstiltskin were there when Rumpelstiltskin’s prophecy was given. ---
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2011, 8:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/242 "2011-12-16T20:13:08Z")
yeah. iirc in the 2nd episode rumplestiltskin told her after the big spell backfires with a horse-heart. it’s why she stormed the castle looking for the baby. it also reinforces a central theme that all magic comes at a price, and all magic has its flaws - the flaw in this curse the baby. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/74df32/32.png) [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Devil_s_Grandmother)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2011, 11:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/243 "2011-12-16T23:46:46Z")
I knew I missed one of the early episodes, it must have been that one. Thanks, **pancakes3**. But I must admit, I like the series less now that I know that. If Regina knows that SnowBaby was coming on his/her 28th birthday to topple the curse, her behavior towards Emma has been completely stupid. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [December 17, 2011, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/244 "2011-12-17T01:13:12Z")
Maybe they didn’t intend for the Evil Queen Mayor to be ambiguous, but years of shows trying to pull shit like that have just made people look for this sort of stuff everywhere. Not the least, Lost, where apparently many of these guys used to work. Not saying it means they suck, just they really shouldn’t be like “wha how can they think THAT?” ---
**Author:** ![Kylede](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/a6a055/32.png) [@Kylede](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kylede)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/245 "2011-12-19T03:04:24Z")
> [@The\_Devil\_s\_Grandmother](#): > > I knew I missed one of the early episodes, it must have been that one. Thanks, **pancakes3**. But I must admit, I like the series less now that I know that. If Regina knows that SnowBaby was coming on his/her 28th birthday to topple the curse, her behavior towards Emma has been completely stupid. Pay attention people… The mayor know the she, herself, is the evil queen. She knows that she cast a spell on herself and the entire town. NO WHERE in the HEAL was she present when Rumplestiltskin told Snow & Charming that their daughter would be the one to break the curse…Just because we know it, doesn’t mean the Mayor/queen knows it. Many people on this message board are mistaking the mayor/queens knowledge with omniscience, which it is not. Here is all she knows about Snow and Charming’s baby. 1. they had a baby 2. they did something to the baby so she didn’t appear in Storybroke when the curse was cast. 3. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ELSE ABOUT THE CHILD (I have to re-watch the episode, but she might not even know if the baby was a boy or a girl)!!! Here are the Facts we (the Audience) know about Snow and Charming’s baby. 1. Emma is the child 2. Henry is Emma’s son, thereby making him Snow’s grandson (The Queen/Mayor does not know this about Henry…I have to keep saying that) 3. Emma can break the curse (This fact was shared with Snow and Charming, NOT the Queen/Mayor) 4. We can pretty much assume Rumple/Mr Gold is the most knowledgeable person about all these facts in the real world and HEAL So to all the people who keep speculating on the Queen/Mayors motivations, you have to remember what she does and does not know. It seems many people thought she knew everything when they relized she remembered about the curse, and this is SIMPLY not the case!!! Sorry for the yelling…I just need to get that off my chest! ---
**Author:** ![Push\_You\_Down](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/push_you_down/32/9095_2.png) [@Push\_You\_Down](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Push_You_Down)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/246 "2011-12-19T05:39:37Z")
If she can’t figure out that Emma is dangerous to and ultimately undoing what she’s built in Storybrook… the queen is an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/247 "2011-12-19T14:31:50Z")
> [@Kylede](#): > > Pay attention people… The mayor know the she, herself, is the evil queen. She knows that she cast a spell on herself and the entire town. NO WHERE in the HEAL was she present when Rumplestiltskin told Snow & Charming that their daughter would be the one to break the curse…Just because we know it, doesn’t mean the Mayor/queen knows it. Many people on this message board are mistaking the mayor/queens knowledge with omniscience, which it is not. > > … [snipped wrongful information] > > So to all the people who keep speculating on the Queen/Mayors motivations, you have to remember what she does and does not know. It seems many people thought she knew everything when they relized she remembered about the curse, and this is SIMPLY not the case!!! > > Sorry for the yelling…I just need to get that off my chest! well… as grateful as we simple rubes are for your gracious enlightenment, i think you need to fact-check better. as you claim that some people are overestimating the queen’s omniscience, you might be doing the same for yours. https://www.youtube.com/embed/mTIO3gznrog?feature=oembed&wmode=opaque that would be pretty indisputable evidence that queen knows, and quite unambiguously, that snow’s baby can undo the curse and she also knows that the baby is loose. couple that with the amount of circumstantial evidence that emma is the baby, and i say the queen should piece together everything quite easily. circumstantial evidence such as: - emma’s an orphan and has no known family - henry, who is openly acknowledging the curse and hellbent on ending it, is equally hellbent for emma to stay in town. - everyone emma comes in contact with starts getting their memories back - just everything overall going to shit when she hits town plus… she’s an EVIL queen! mandated killings should come loose and fast. why is she so quick to kill her huntsman but let the woman who’s stirring all this shit up, chainsawing trees, abducting her son, stealing her man, etc. walk free? ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/248 "2011-12-19T21:40:59Z")
> [@pancakes3](#): > > well… as grateful as we simple rubes are for your gracious enlightenment, i think you need to fact-check better. as you claim that some people are overestimating the queen’s omniscience, you might be doing the same for yours. > > [http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTIO3gznrog](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mTIO3gznrog) > > that would be pretty indisputable evidence that queen knows, and quite unambiguously, that snow’s baby can undo the curse and she also knows that the baby is loose. Yeah, Rumply told her about the baby, but he did NOT say the baby was female, so the queen can’t focus on just one gender. He also didn’t tell her it could be broken when the child was 28 years old, so she doesn’t have a time frame to focus in on, either. Add that to the fact that time and memory in Storybrooke is rather flexible, then even if he had told her, she might not be able to be aware of how much time has passed. Plus, for all we know, Storybrooke has only existed for Henry’s lifetime or a little longer. Just because Emma has been in the Real World for 28 years doesn’t meant that Storybrooke has. ---
**Author:** ![pancakes3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ba9def/32.png) [@pancakes3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pancakes3)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/249 "2011-12-19T22:11:33Z")
Are you saying that it makes sense for the queen to not know that emma is the apocalypse baby because she doesn’t have every detail about the situation? What prophecy ever tells the whole story? ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/250 "2011-12-19T22:50:14Z")
> [@pancakes3](#): > > Are you saying that it makes sense for the queen to not know that emma is the apocalypse baby because she doesn’t have every detail about the situation? What prophecy ever tells the whole story? \ Considering Emma seems to be the first outsider to stay in Storybrooke for any length of time (as far as we know) and that Regina’s grip on things seems to be slipping since Emma’s arrival, I’d think it pretty obvious, myself. But we’re outsiders, and we have more information than the characters do. I’m saying is that all Regina \*knows \*is that Snow & Charming’s baby is fated to be able to break the curse. She not only doesn’t have every detail, she doesn’t have any details; just that bare, solitary fact. ---
**Author:** ![StGermain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stgermain/32/2868_2.png) [@StGermain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StGermain)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/251 "2011-12-20T06:16:33Z")
> [@Kylede](#): > > Pay attention people… The mayor know the she, herself, is the evil queen. She knows that she cast a spell on herself and the entire town. NO WHERE in the HEAL was she present when Rumplestiltskin told Snow & Charming that their daughter would be the one to break the curse…Just because we know it, doesn’t mean the Mayor/queen knows it. Many people on this message board are mistaking the mayor/queens knowledge with omniscience, which it is not. > > Here is all she knows about Snow and Charming’s baby. > > 1. they had a baby > > 2. they did something to the baby so she didn’t appear in Storybroke when the curse was cast. > > 3. ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ELSE ABOUT THE CHILD (I have to re-watch the episode, but she might not even know if the baby was a boy or a girl)!!! > > Here are the Facts we (the Audience) know about Snow and Charming’s baby. > > 1. Emma is the child > > 2. Henry is Emma’s son, thereby making him Snow’s grandson (The Queen/Mayor does not know this about Henry…I have to keep saying that) > > 3. Emma can break the curse (This fact was shared with Snow and Charming, NOT the Queen/Mayor) > > 4. We can pretty much assume Rumple/Mr Gold is the most knowledgeable person about all these facts in the real world and HEAL > > So to all the people who keep speculating on the Queen/Mayors motivations, you have to remember what she does and does not know. It seems many people thought she knew everything when they relized she remembered about the curse, and this is SIMPLY not the case!!! > > Sorry for the yelling…I just need to get that off my chest! Wow. Who died and made you Maleficent? StG ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2012, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/252 "2012-01-02T17:50:07Z")
Was kinda bored last night, and thy had a marathon of past shows on ABC, so I watched. Not bad! I don’t know how long this can go on before it starts to trip over itself, but so far I’m liking it. Much, much better than Grimm, of which I’ve watched a few episodes. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2012, 3:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/253 "2012-01-06T03:36:19Z")
Help. In the preview for the next episode Henry said that Emma doesn’t want to owe Mr. Gold a _second_ favor. What was the first? ---
**Author:** ![Saltire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saltire/32/553_2.png) [@Saltire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saltire)\ **Post date:** [January 6, 2012, 4:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/254 "2012-01-06T04:10:17Z")
Emma promised Gold an unspecified favor to get him to let Ashley/Cinderella keep her baby. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2012, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/255 "2012-01-08T04:22:58Z")
> [@Saltire](#): > > Emma promised Gold an unspecified favor to get him to let Ashley/Cinderella keep her baby. Ah, okay. Thanks. I didn’t remember that being couched as a favor. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2012, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/256 "2012-01-08T22:28:31Z")
A new episode is on tonight (1/8), if anyone didn’t know. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2012, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/257 "2012-01-09T01:23:18Z")
Well, damn. Who’dda thunk you could wind up feeling sorry for Rumplestiltskin? ---
**Author:** ![salinqmind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/3ec8ea/32.png) [@salinqmind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/salinqmind)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2012, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/258 "2012-01-09T01:54:45Z")
Robert Carlyle is absolutely amazing! Totally mesmerizing, and as I’ve stated before, inexplicably hot, bad teeth and all. I look forward to his scenes every week. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2012, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/259 "2012-01-09T03:33:24Z")
All we (simwife and I) can say is - wow - excellent stuff - can’t wait till next week ! Hansel and Gretal! I truly hope they don’t screw this series up - so far it has far exceeded our expectations. ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [January 9, 2012, 1:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574/260 "2012-01-09T13:02:07Z")
It was good to see Brad Dourif guest-starring. Too bad it’s almost certainly only a one-time thing. So now we know more of Mr. Gold’s origins (and, yes, his completely inexplicable hotness), but we still have no idea what he wants. And, really, that’s an even more important question. Knowing why/how someone has power is important. Knowing what s/he wants to do with it is crucial. We know Regina wants everyone to have no happy endings. I don’t think she’s particularly happy with that, but it’s been her driving force so long that I’m not sure she can be shaken loose from the idea. But Mr. Gold - what does he want, beyond the safety of himself and possibly Bae, if the latter is still alive, and somehow I doubt it. Revenge, as well? On whom? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/once-upon-a-time-edited-title/600574.md?page=14)