# One less genocidial egomaniac ... Milosevic is dead. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 11, 2006, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950 "2006-03-11T16:53:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/21 "2006-03-11T20:08:30Z")
> [@yBeayf](#): > > He was no Hitler or Stalin. Heck, he wasn’t even a Saddam. He may or may not of had blood directly on his hands. But indirectly he definitely did. His ultra-nationalistic rhetoric and policies were to a significant extent responsible for the disintegration of Yugoslavia and polarization that occurred. And he definitely directly encouraged the irredentist aspirations of those who DO have blood on there hands. How much blood is almost immaterial - it was too much. Don’t get me wrong - folks like Franjo Tudjman gets a nice chunk of blame as well. Milosivic didn’t cause this chaos single-handedly. But Milosevic was a populist demogogue of the worst sort. - Tamerlane ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/22 "2006-03-11T20:10:26Z")
> [@](#): > > How many non-Serbs was it then? In Bosnia, a few tens of thousands. In Kosovo, less than 10 thousand. > [@](#): > > How many were civilians? There were many civilians killed in Bosnia, though Milosevic didn’t have anything to do with that. There were very few Albanian civilians killed in Kosovo. There was ethnic cleansing going on in Kosovo, and still is; the Albanians aren’t the victims of it, though. > [@](#): > > Of course, the president of Yugoslavia has very little influence on the activities of the government or on the forces allied to it. Rather, the president of Yugoslavia has little influence on the actions of individual soldiers running amok. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/23 "2006-03-11T20:24:57Z")
> [@yBeayf](#): > > In Bosnia, a few tens of thousands. In Kosovo, less than 10 thousand. Oh, that’s _different!_ Only a few tens of thousands of murders. Hardly important at all. We can overlook that. > [@](#): > > Rather, the president of Yugoslavia has little influence on the actions of individual soldiers running amok. Even if this was the case, what steps did Milosevic take to apprehend and punish these supposed “individual soldiers running amok”? Surely that was his responsibility. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/24 "2006-03-11T20:31:50Z")
> [@yBeayf](#): > > In Bosnia, a few tens of thousands. In Kosovo, less than 10 thousand. > (snip)Rather, the president of Yugoslavia has little influence on the actions of individual soldiers running amok. tens of thousands of victims? “indivdiual soldiers running amok”? damn, their either fucking efficient as hell or (more likely), it was systemic to the military, which puts it square on the shoulders of the leaders. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/25 "2006-03-11T20:33:05Z")
:smack: **They’re** vs. “their” please. ---
**Author:** ![Pushkin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ee59a6/32.png) [@Pushkin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pushkin)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/26 "2006-03-11T20:33:55Z")
> [@yBeayf](#): > > Rather, the president of Yugoslavia has little influence on the actions of individual soldiers running amok. The idea being that as the duly elected leader of the country, he should have stopped it perhaps. ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/27 "2006-03-11T20:36:35Z")
> [@](#): > > Only a few tens of thousands of murders. No, that’s tens of thousands _dead_, whether by murder, gunfire, bombing, or what have you. Not everybody who dies in wartime is “murdered”. > [@](#): > > Even if this was the case, what steps did Milosevic take to apprehend and punish these supposed “individual soldiers running amok”? Surely that was his responsibility. Perhaps he failed to do so. That doesn’t make him a mass murderer. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/28 "2006-03-11T20:36:57Z")
Nothing to see here, move along, pay no attention to all the corpses. Wasn’t the catch phrase during the Yugoslovian war Ethnic Cleansing? Besides, it was ONLY tens of thousands of people. Not even a blip. :rolleyes: People like Milosevik make me sincerely hope there IS a hell, with lots of pineapples. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/29 "2006-03-11T20:37:17Z")
Geeze, I make a throw-away pop-culture reference and start a massive hijack. Sorry guys. ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/30 "2006-03-11T20:47:18Z")
> [@](#): > > Wasn’t the catch phrase during the Yugoslovian war Ethnic Cleansing? Yep. It went on, on a small scale, in the Bosnian conflict. Milosevic didn’t have anything to do with that. It also went on, on a large scale, in Kosovo for the past 15 years or so. Milosevic didn’t have anything to do with that, either, and in any case it was non-Albanians who were being ethnically cleansed, and Albanians doing the cleansing. > [@](#): > > Besides, it was ONLY tens of thousands of people. Not even a blip. So how many civilians has the US killed in our current jaunt in Iraq? ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/31 "2006-03-11T20:52:12Z")
> [@yBeayf](#): > > No, that’s tens of thousands _dead_, whether by murder, gunfire, bombing, or what have you. Not everybody who dies in wartime is “murdered”. 7,000 Muslim men and boys murdered in Srebrenica, and another 25,000 women, elderly, and children forcibly taken. That’s in one city and done in 10 days. ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/32 "2006-03-11T20:53:48Z")
> [@](#): > > 7,000 Muslim men and boys murdered in Srebrenica, and another 25,000 women, elderly, and children forcibly taken. That’s in one city and done in 10 days. Srebrenica was an abberation, and not all of those killed were civilians. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/33 "2006-03-11T21:01:31Z")
> [@yBeayf](#): > > Srebrenica was an abberation, and not all of those killed were civilians. Summary execution of soldiers who are prisoners of war is also an atrocity. Srebenica was hardly an aberration, but merely the most egregious example of business as usual during the conflict. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/34 "2006-03-11T21:13:45Z")
> [@Pushkin](#): > > The idea being that as the duly elected leader of the country, he should have stopped it perhaps. Or that maybe some of us don’t buy his excuses about not knowing about it, in the same way we don’t buy Bush’s excuses about not knowing about Abu Graib, etc. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/35 "2006-03-11T21:30:23Z")
> [@yBeayf](#): > > Srebrenica was an abberation, Prijedor, Visegard, Zvornik, Brcko, Bijeljina… the list goes on and on. That’s a lot of “abberations” and quite a few bad apples. ---
**Author:** ![Moirai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/96bed5/32.png) [@Moirai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moirai)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/36 "2006-03-11T21:54:36Z")
Jesus **yBeayf** , where did they grow you? :wally Good riddance to bad rubbish. And the “pineapple up the ass” thing is killing me! 😃 Oh wait, is the “wally” appropriate for this forum? ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/37 "2006-03-11T21:54:51Z")
I wonder which leader of which former Yugoslaivian republic supported and armed the non-military irregular gangs of thugs in Krajiba ? It is striking that when Serbia was forced to withdraw its support for the Krajina Serbs who were busily ethnicaly cleansing that area, that that Serb militia group was so very quickly overrun. Milosevic was the one who provided that support, and was the one forced to withdraw it. Milosevic was the one who autorised and supported the racist regime in Kosovo that denied ethnic Albanians any posts in public employment such as local councils, schools and even hospitals, basically if you were not a Serbian Kosovan, then you were treated in very much the same way as a Deep South black person was back in the pre civil rights days. This was not an accident, it was a deliberate policy to ensure that the Kosovan Serbs controlled all state functions and resources, and it amounted to apartheid. ---
**Author:** ![Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/4da419/32.png) [@Gala\_Matrix\_Fire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gala_Matrix_Fire)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/38 "2006-03-11T22:13:26Z")
**ybeaf** , you’re hilarious. Based on the numbers alone, I don’t see where you base your statement that Slobo wasn’t even as bad as Saddam. We don’t know the human side of Slobo. Please, fill us in. Did he read to his grandkids? Did he have a german shepherd he was fond of? ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [March 11, 2006, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/39 "2006-03-11T23:47:43Z")
Tentative theory: Slobo was dictator of orthodox Serbia. yBeayf is an orthodox christian. Many orthodox churches here in the US (and in Serbia of course) heavily pushed the line that the Serbian atrocities were catholic propaganda against the heroic orthodox Serbs. yBeayf apparently believed those lies. ---
**Author:** ![yBeayf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/e274bd/32.png) [@yBeayf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yBeayf)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2006, 12:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950/40 "2006-03-12T00:16:55Z")
Stopping in briefly before having to run… > [@](#): > > Milosevic was the one who autorised and supported the racist regime in Kosovo that denied ethnic Albanians any posts in public employment such as local councils, schools and even hospitals, basically if you were not a Serbian Kosovan, then you were treated in very much the same way as a Deep South black person was back in the pre civil rights days. First of all, there’s no such thing as a “Kosovan”, just people who live in Kosovo. Kosovo is the Jerusalem of the Serbian people – it’s where they began as a nation. It’s not some independent land. For decades, Albanians have been illegally pouring in, to try to gain Kosovo as part of a greater Albania. In the 90s, they began a campaign of terrorism and assassination to try to drive the Serbs out. When the Serbs quite sensibly tried to crack down on this, the Albanians appealed to the West, who then proceeded to intervene on the wrong side of the conflict. Since then, Albanians have basically had a free hand in driving out the remnants of the non-Albanian population. > [@](#): > > Tentative theory: Slobo was dictator of orthodox Serbia. yBeayf is an orthodox christian. Many orthodox churches here in the US (and in Serbia of course) heavily pushed the line that the Serbian atrocities were catholic propaganda against the heroic orthodox Serbs. yBeayf apparently believed those lies. No. The only references to the Serbian conflict I have ever heard in Orthodox churches have been to pray for its end, and to pray for the protection of people and holy places. My views on this matter are my own. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-less-genocidial-egomaniac-milosevic-is-dead/347950.md?page=3)