# One Night Ultimate Werewolf game **URL:** \ **Category:** Thread Games\ **Created:** [December 15, 2015, 4:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500 "2015-12-15T04:11:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/181 "2015-12-16T20:47:12Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > What should we have done to rattle cages? Lied. It’s a game of bluffing. When HookerChemical shows up, it would have been best if there’d been a couple of competing claims about what happened in the night and then their response could confirm or deny a particular claim. As it is, they’ll claim villager. I agree, JB. If it were me, I’d have required the game to end hours ago. ---
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/182 "2015-12-16T21:34:25Z")
Holy cow, this game is moving fast. I didn’t think a day-long period away from the board would put me so far behind. I’m partially through the thread, but here are a few quick comments. > [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > Normally I’d say lynch the lurker. But Wolverine is the lurker, and he may have been switched with me, which makes me the lurker !? :D:smack: We’re less than 24 hours into play, Prof. P. Have you learned nothing about suggesting LtL, or do we send TexCat after you again? > [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > I’ll wait for Hooker before I answer that. Nope. Villager. > [@TexCat](#): > > Claimed starting roles: > Inner Stickler, Seer > Biotop, Troublemaker > snfaulkner, Villager > Prof. Pepperwinkle, Mason > TexCat, Robber > HookerChemical, Mason > Wolverine, Tanner > Mahaloth, Seer > Johnny Bravo, Drunk > sachertorte, Troublemaker > > So, it appears that there is no one started as 2nd villager or Insomniac or Hunter. A am not the mason. I’m a villager. I have not made the claim of being a Mason, though I think others inferred it from Prof P’s statements. > [@Biotop](#): > > Say you were a wolf and you could see how this game might be going to play out. The smart thing, it seems to me, would be to either get a false claim out good and early OR to lay low and claim “villager.” You would not wait to find out if your role was switched because if and when you discovered it you could always say “Hey, I WAS a wolf, which is why I lied, but now…” > > **Inner Stickler** ’s claim surprised me in that it came out before he could confirm his role had not been switched. But for it to be false, **IS** would have to be willing to risk another Seer appearing (one has), a Tanner who WAS switched appearing (one has) and an Isomniac appearing (one has not so far). The claim also came out before anyone could make a false claim on those roles (assuming **IS** is telling the truth). > > I don’t see why a wolf would dare that many contradictions in a “First Post of the Day” claim. The risk would be too great , it seems to me. Right now I believe **Inner Stickler**. But we shall see. There’s a lot in IS’s claim to go wrong, so it’s bold. It’s also the first game of this, so it’s possible he simply misplayed it. I think the former is more likely. ---
**Author:** ![Biotop](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biotop/32/321_2.png) [@Biotop](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biotop)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/183 "2015-12-16T21:37:07Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > I agree, JB. If it were me, I’d have required the game to end hours ago. I guess I can now say that I did not really switch the players I claimed I did. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/184 "2015-12-16T21:37:34Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > Lied. I did lie. But no one else was playing along. ---
**Author:** ![TexCat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/texcat/32/9041_2.png) [@TexCat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TexCat)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/185 "2015-12-16T21:39:55Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > I guess I can now say that I did not really switch the players I claimed I did. Ugh. ---
**Author:** ![sachertorte](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sachertorte/32/3727_2.png) [@sachertorte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sachertorte)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/186 "2015-12-16T21:41:40Z")
I have to agree with TexCat. This game went from ‘really interesting’ to ‘kind of dull’ to ‘sort of painful’ now. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/187 "2015-12-16T21:46:04Z")
> [@Biotop](#): > > I guess I can now say that I did not really switch the players I claimed I did. Uh huh, and let me guess: one of the players you switched was Inner Stickler. ---
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/188 "2015-12-16T21:55:13Z")
Sorry for the delay folks. I missed the start. By the time I showed up, the interesting lies had been told. Though it looks like Bio has one more to reveal. Though at the moment I’m leaning strongly toward the IS lynch. If he’s a hunter, we win if he picks the werewolf. If he’s a wolf, we win flat out. One potential problem is that if there are no wolves in the game, the correct lynch is no lynch. But that would require that JB didn’t pick a wolf when he had a 67% chance of doing so. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/189 "2015-12-16T22:07:32Z")
oh, good, I’m a Mason again. ---
**Author:** ![Wolverine](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ba9def/32.png) [@Wolverine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolverine)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/190 "2015-12-16T22:19:40Z")
> [@TexCat](#): > > Yep. I just realized that. **Wolverine** , can you confirm once again that you did not start as a wolf? If you did, you are no longer a wolf and owe no allegiance to Mahaloth. You can now win by exposing this scheme. For the last time, I was a Tanner. I was not a werewolf. > [@Biotop](#): > > I guess I can now say that I did not really switch the players I claimed I did. Uh, I meant, maybe, I am a werewolf and you should kill me or something. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/191 "2015-12-16T22:29:00Z")
Yeah, I know THAT feeling. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 10:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/192 "2015-12-16T22:44:44Z")
I’m totally confused and lost, partly due to my own dumbness. It’s kind of a pain. I have no real idea what to do. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/193 "2015-12-16T22:53:51Z")
Oh jeez…all of my brains…they hurt…you guys play way too early in the morning for me…but anyway, I think I’m following along and might actually understand the game finally…maybe…I have nothing really to add at the moment however. I can only say I started as Villager. Not sure if **Biotop** ’s devious switchery involved me or not. But if not, then I am still Villager. I unfortunately have no way to really prove that however. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/194 "2015-12-16T22:58:13Z")
This seems fairly obvious to me (so I’m probably wrong, but whatever). Post 165: Biotop says that we should wait on Hooker because his reveal could “turn this whole game upside down.” Post 172: I show that if Biotop is really the troublemaker, there’s no way that Hooker’s reveal could be in any way earthshattering. Post 182: Hooker claims villager. Post 183: Biotop attempts to turn the game upside down by saying that he switched two **different** players. So what happened? Biotop thought the game might be turned upside down because he was never the troublemaker and thought Hooker might have been. As soon as Hooker claimed villager, Biotop was safe to change his original story. Why does it matter? Because Biotop is the other wolf and wants to throw things into confusion to keep us from killing Inner Stickler. What now? Two possibilities. 1. Biotop tells us that he switched Inner Stickler and somebody else, which is a transparent attempt to get us to change our plan to kill Inner Stickler. “Hey guys, he’s not the Hunter anymore. So-and-so is so we should kill him instead.” 2. Biotop tells us that two **different** folks got switched, in which case Inner Stickler is still either the hunter or the wolf and we finish out the game as we’ve been planning. ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/195 "2015-12-16T23:20:34Z")
What would a **Biotop** lone wolf scenario look like? He could see that there was no troublemaker, right? So no worries of a counter claim, and would now **Sachertorte** claim was false. **Inner Stickler** as hunter would still be acting Alince-in-Wonderlandy to get killed so his shot would matter… what else? ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/196 "2015-12-16T23:22:34Z")
If a lone wolf Biotop knew there was no troublemaker, he wouldn’t have slipped that Hooker’s reveal might have turned the game “upside down.” ---
**Author:** ![snfaulkner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snfaulkner/32/433_2.png) [@snfaulkner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snfaulkner)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/197 "2015-12-16T23:28:00Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > If a lone wolf Biotop knew there was no troublemaker, he wouldn’t have slipped that Hooker’s reveal might have turned the game “upside down.” I’m going both ways on this. While I originally agreed with this, I’m trying to think of ways he could still use that slip of info to his advantage. I’m willing to believe he is devious enough to do figure out a way, even if I am not. ---
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/198 "2015-12-16T23:28:31Z")
> [@sachertorte](#): > > **Inner Stickler** as hunter would still be acting Alince-in-Wonderlandy to get killed so his shot would matter… But his shot only matters as a second chance. As a hunter, if he weren’t acting weird and we didn’t target him and targeted a wolf instead, he’d still win with town. ---
**Author:** ![HookerChemical](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/278dde/32.png) [@HookerChemical](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HookerChemical)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/199 "2015-12-16T23:30:50Z")
> [@Johnny\_Bravo](#): > > If a lone wolf Biotop knew there was no troublemaker, he wouldn’t have slipped that Hooker’s reveal might have turned the game “upside down.” It’s possible that I would have claimed something that had already been claimed but not confirmed. Perhaps that’s what he anticipated, but it’s pure speculation. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [December 16, 2015, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500/200 "2015-12-16T23:33:53Z")
A Biotop/Stickler wolf duo doesn’t explain how Biotop knew to counter sachertorte’s claim. A lone wolf Biotop who knows there’s no troublemaker still allows for a scenario where my evidence train in 119 confirms several town players. It also still allows for us killing Inner Stickler and then IS killing Biotop. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/one-night-ultimate-werewolf-game/740500.md?page=11)