# Ongoing Euro '08 matches. Spoilers included **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [June 10, 2008, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387 "2008-06-10T00:47:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/41 "2008-06-11T21:16:25Z")
[QUOTE=Kid\_A] Wikipedia now agrees with you: “The winner of the Turkey vs Czech Republic game will qualify for the quarter-finals. If the game finishes as a draw, the qualifying team will be determined by a penalty shootout.” I can’t remember this happening before in a Euro or a World Cup. Has it happened before? [/QUOTE] Nope. Rule in place for this tourney. Priorly, the second tie-breaker would have been the score against the group winner. In that case, the Czechs, having scored one, would only need a tie even if all else was the same. Didn’t like the rule and this adds more drama in any case. Prior to that nonsense, was the even worse “drawing straws.” Anyway, good to know I’m ahead of Wiki. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![duality72](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duality72/32/3910_2.png) [@duality72](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duality72)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/42 "2008-06-11T21:18:52Z")
[QUOTE=Kid\_A] From wikipedia: \*Czech Republic will qualify if they win or draw in their match against Turkey \*Turkey will only qualify if they beat Czech Republic What are the tiebreakers? [/QUOTE] I believe Wikipedia is wrong there. From Wikipedia’s [Euro 2008](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UEFA_Euro_2008#Group_stage) page, you can see the tiebreakers in the group stage (and I verified them against the official UEFA document that is linked). The relevant tiebreaker in case of a draw would be “In cases where exactly two teams are equal in all previously listed critera and play one another to a draw in their final group match, kicks from the penalty mark will be conducted in lieu of the remaining criteria;”. So, from my understanding, PKs would be conducted immediately after the match to decide. I assume the Wikipedia author didn’t realize the “special case” tiebreaker of the two teams playing each other in the final game and just went on to the next universal tiebreaker that relies on points gained in qualification. Glad I took the time to research and write all that when it’s been covered numerous times now. 🙂 Well, I’m posting it anyway! ---
**Author:** ![Kid\_A\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ed8c4c/32.png) [@Kid\_A\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kid_A_1)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/43 "2008-06-11T21:21:51Z")
Cool. Thanks for the thorough explanations. ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/44 "2008-06-11T21:22:04Z")
Hm…I just read/heard recently that tie breakers were going to be points, head-to-head competition, and **then** goal difference. If that’s the case (and I’m remembering correctly) the only reason the Czechs and Turks would have to go to penalties in case of a draw is simply because they’re playing each other in the last game. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/45 "2008-06-11T21:25:00Z")
[QUOTE=RedFury] Let’s just say that you’d be better off with **duality72’s** link. 😉 55th minute, big mistake by Rozehnal on defense, Nuno Gomez fluffs the shot. BTW, should either of these teams win, they book their ticket to the quarters – first or second will depend on the last match. But I’m sure the Swiss and the Turks are rooting for a tie. [/QUOTE] That’s not quite accurate. To be sure to go through winning two games, you have to have a win by the team you beat in the first game. This gives you the hammer over one of the two potential teams that can tie you at 6 pts. For example (as I type this, I don’t know who won the Swiss v. Turks game), Portugal won against the Czechs. Now, if the Swiss win, and the Swiss beat Portugal, and the Czechs beat the Turks, then all finish with 6 points, and it’s down to goal differential. On the other hand, if the Turks win, then there is no combination that can knock Portugal out. Only two teams then could finish level at 6 pts. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/46 "2008-06-11T21:28:43Z")
[QUOTE=RedFury] Priorly, the second tie-breaker would have been the score against the group winner. In that case, the Czechs, having scored one, would only need a tie even if all else was the same. [/QUOTE] Huh? I’ve never heard of that tie-breaking rule. It has traditionally been points, then goal difference. In recent years, they’ve introduced the extra tie-breaking level of points and goal difference in the matches among the tied teams. But it’s news to me if goals scored or goal difference against the group winners is another tie-breaker. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/47 "2008-06-11T21:39:12Z")
[QUOTE=Kid\_A] From wikipedia: \*Czech Republic will qualify if they win or draw in their match against Turkey \*Turkey will only qualify if they beat Czech Republic What are the tiebreakers? [/QUOTE] Well, I’d love to cut and past the answer to this question, but UEFA have “secured” the damn .pdf file so you can’t cut and paste. Can you believe it? [This is the .pdf of the tournaments regulations.](http://www.uefa.com/newsfiles/19079.pdf) Go to page nine to read it. It appears to me that Portugal cannot finish below #1, since they beat both of the teams which can end up level with them on points. As for tie-breaking Turks v. Czechs, PKs require they finish level on goals scored and goals allowed, which would happen if they tie each other. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/48 "2008-06-11T21:43:21Z")
[QUOTE=DSYoungEsq] That’s not quite accurate. To be sure to go through winning two games, you have to have a win by the team you beat in the first game. This gives you the hammer over one of the two potential teams that can tie you at 6 pts. For example (as I type this, I don’t know who won the Swiss v. Turks game), Portugal won against the Czechs. Now, if the Swiss win, and the Swiss beat Portugal, and the Czechs beat the Turks, then all finish with 6 points, and it’s down to goal differential. On the other hand, if the Turks win, then there is no combination that can knock Portugal out. Only two teams then could finish level at 6 pts. [/QUOTE] Quite right, thanks. I was oversimplifying the mindset of those teams in terms of the most likely finishes. Or rather, the ones they’d like the most. * * * While I admit to being wrong to the second tie-breaker in group stages, what you do against (goal difference-wise) against _all/any_ teams directly tied with yours in all other aspects is the second tie-breaker. > [@](#): > > If teams were level on points, they were ranked on the following criteria in order: > > 1. Greatest total goal difference in the three group matches > 2. Greatest number of goals scored in the three group matches > 3. If teams remained level after those criteria, a mini-group would be formed from those teams, who would be ranked on: > 1. Most points earned in matches against other teams in the tie > 2. Greatest goal difference in matches against other teams in the tie > 3. Greatest number of goals scored in matches against other teams in the tie > > 4. If teams remained level after all these criteria, FIFA would hold a drawing of lots[ Obviously, in this case it doesn’t matter as the two tied teams in all the three first criteria _have yet to play._ And there can only be one mathematical winner since #4 is not currently applicable. The one with more goals against the other. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2008, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/49 "2008-06-11T21:50:59Z")
[QUOTE=DSYoungEsq] …As for tie-breaking Turks v. Czechs, PKs require they finish level on goals scored and goals allowed, which would happen if they tie each other. [/QUOTE] My turn to give you a semi-hard time. What possible _other way_ could that happen? Dude, a tie in all possible record-breakers, is a tie. Thus you need _a winner_ from that match. End of story 😉 ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/50 "2008-06-12T16:52:32Z")
Ok, Germany have Croatia right where they want them. All part of the plan… \ ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 4:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/51 "2008-06-12T16:55:07Z")
That’s not a score I was expecting to see. Hmmmm. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/52 "2008-06-12T17:21:11Z")
that’s such a nasty goal (2-0). I love it. 😃 but Germany will win in the end, i’m afraid… ---
**Author:** ![chique](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/4491bb/32.png) [@chique](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chique)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/53 "2008-06-12T17:21:18Z")
Holy cow. Didn’t expect that, either. Wow. What’s Germany doing out there? ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/54 "2008-06-12T17:36:55Z")
See what I mean? (2-1) it’ll be an interesting last 15 minutes. ---
**Author:** ![Svejk\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea666f/32.png) [@Svejk\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Svejk_1)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/55 "2008-06-12T17:52:08Z")
Red for Schweinsteiger for being frustrated, and now the ref has ended it all! You guys know this song that goes ‘Schade Deutschland, alles ist vorbei?’ 😃 ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/56 "2008-06-12T17:56:53Z")
I had the scoreline correct, at least. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/57 "2008-06-12T18:12:09Z")
Wow…The Panzers fall. So much for _that_ stroll… ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/58 "2008-06-12T19:45:39Z")
Is no one watching today?? Good thing we set this thread up. 😃 Polish goal against the run of play, and quite possibly offside, to boot. Austria punished harshly for failure to put away several good chances. We’ll see how the second half goes… ---
**Author:** ![duality72](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duality72/32/3910_2.png) [@duality72](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duality72)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/59 "2008-06-12T22:00:40Z")
And Austria manages to pull out a point in the waning minutes. Another big confrontation set for the final matchday, now Austria and Germany, to determine which will advance. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2008, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387/60 "2008-06-12T22:30:27Z")
Austria… the words “cow’s arse” and “banjo” spring to mind, as in not being able to hit one with the other. They have a unique ability to dominate the game but never look remotely like scoring, as in their game against Croatia. Anyway, it was a penalty, very evident shirt-pulling there. The fact that other such offences go unpunished is irrelevant. It was a foul. I wish they gave penalties every time for that. Then it would soon stop, no? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ongoing-euro-08-matches-spoilers-included/452387.md?page=4)