# Open letter to Bricker **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 6, 2008, 12:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263 "2008-09-06T00:51:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Jodi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7feea3/32.png) [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/61 "2008-09-06T02:36:35Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > Perfectly reasonable and I agree. _However_…I can’t say that I think this OP is a particularly fine example of “toning down the drama.” I never said it was. I just think some of us could really benefit from some fresh air, and I certainly include **Scylla** in that. A drink, a romp with a puppy, a glance at the stars, a good solid rogering – jeez, people, whatever works to dial down the hatin’, consider going out and doing that for a while. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/62 "2008-09-06T02:38:38Z")
You guys just don’t get it. The Board hasn’t moved to the left in any meaningful way. The Board is full of Americans, and Americans, by and large, don’t like politics. Me, I’m a natural born wonk, I thrive on this stuff. But most folks don’t. And I’m definitely on the conservative wing of the extreme left, have been since I knew better. Most folks generally do not agree with my politics and that remains the case here on the Boards. What we agree about is that the Bushiviks have proved to be the most godawful Gozilla size clusterfuck in our history. Its not about conservative or liberal political theory, its about ignorant and arrogant shit-for-brains leading us into a turd-infested fever swamp. We few, we band of botherers, we lefties…we told you so. Every step of the way, we told you so. And you sneered upon us with the casual contempt of the certain. And you were wrong. Dead wrong, totally _fahrblondget_, one eighty out, up shit creek without a clue. There are people who agree with this assessment who are politically conservative. Simply because they agree with lefties on certain thunderingly obvious facts doesn’t make them lefties, it makes them awake. I think friend **Bricker** is simply having an “episode”, his train of thought derailed on a hairpin turn. The intensity of these ghastly years wears people down He is simply another in the long list of people for whom I’ve prescribed a nice cup chamomile tea, some Mozart and a book of Twain quotes. He’ll be all right, he’s just having one of those crises that happen to thoughtful men forced to confront the notion that their dearly held beliefs are just so much butt pudding. Its good for you, it builds character and undermines certainty, and doubt is as holy as faith. If not more so. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/63 "2008-09-06T02:39:45Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > In point of fact, that’s been debunked as another one of the smear campaign lies. You got a quote from her from a reputable source, or a link to a piece of legislation she endorsed supporting that? > **[Homepage | CBN](https://cbn.com/)** > > The Christian Broadcasting Network is a global ministry committed to preparing the nations of the world for the coming of Jesus Christ through mass media and humanitarian outreach. > [@](#): > > John McCain and his running have different views on the evolution debate, but neither have pushed their stance on the issue. > > Gov. Sarah Palin has said publicly that she backs creationism in schools, but did not force the idea as Alaska’s governor. That would be the smearers on the Christian Broadcasting Network, of course. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/64 "2008-09-06T02:39:57Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > You want to hear something really weird? > > I really enjoy interacting with you, and I’ve grown to truly like you. Seriously. > > It’s like when I go jogging, there’s this dog that comes right up to the fence barking. Used to scare the shit out of me. The dog used to hate me. > > Now, nothing on the surface has changed. I still run, he still barks. But, I imagine that my running by is a part of the day that dog looks forward to. If I don’t show up, I think he gets worried. I think I detect some relief in the bark the next day when I show up. I know if I run by and he’s not there I’m a little disapointed and worried about him. I hope he’s ok. I’m always relieved the next day when he’s barking at me. > > Over the years, I’ve come to think of you affectionately… like I do that dog. I really don’t get you. In this thread, you’re “expressing concern” that debate here on the board is dead, that there is too much crap being flung, and that other posters, like Bricker, shouldn’t let a pile on get to them. Then you spend post after post revelling in the shit-flinging with another poster. And, apparently, enjoying the hell out of it. Even defining part of yourself about it. To me, it appears you want and enjoy this kind of repetitive idiotic insults. That you CRAVE it. And you do it, in a thread where your main premise is that that kind those kinds of posts are ruining the sdmb. As I said, I just don’t get you. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/65 "2008-09-06T02:43:22Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > He’ll be all right, he’s just having one of those crises that happen to thoughtful men forced to confront the notion that their dearly held beliefs are just so much butt pudding. Its good for you, it builds character and undermines certainty, and doubt is as holy as faith. If not more so. It seems that during your two-week or so hiatus I forgot the somnambulistic qualities of some of your posts. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/66 "2008-09-06T02:49:56Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > In point of fact, that’s been debunked as another one of the smear campaign lies. You got a quote from her from a reputable source, or a link to a piece of legislation she endorsed supporting that? To remark on this, of course I did not mention that she proposed any Legislation, but it has to said again in a more nuanced way: in board that fights ignorance, a person that even considers to give creationists the time of the day in schools deserves no respect whatsoever. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/67 "2008-09-06T02:54:18Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > The difference with you–and **Bricker** , and **Shodan** and **Starving Artist** –is that you still don’t admit there’s a fundamental disconnect between the current Republican powerpimps and actual conservatism. You know, fiscal caution. Limiting governmental interference in the lives of citizens. Shrinking the deficit. Not playing Big Brother in the lucrative religion business. You demonstrably don’t care about truth, or character or responsibility. I made a post in another thread explaining how I – and, I would assume, many other conservatives – continue to vote Republican in spite of the fact that in some of the ways you mention, the party isn’t what it once was. I had you in mind as I composed it as a way of perhaps persuading you that everyone who votes Republican isn’t necessarily an asshole, but I got busy and never got around to bringing it to your attention. I don’t know that it’ll make any difference in your viewpoint, but [here it is](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10157704&postcount=273). ---
**Author:** ![ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e9bcb4/32.png) [@ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ComeToTheDarkSideWeHaveCookies)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/68 "2008-09-06T02:55:05Z")
I consider myself a little fish in a big pond on the Dope. I was brought here, as many others were, by a Scylla post (Horror of Blimps), I fell in love with the place right away and have been up to my armpits in it ever since. I like the fact that the written words of someone with views that very much differ from my own on many topics are what brought me here. There are no politics or social commentary in the Horror of Blimps. It is just a great story. From my first day reading here, I have been reminded of the common ground that can exist amongst even the most differing of perspectives. I try to keep a level head as much as possible here when it comes to interacting with other posters. I posted in the thread that Bricker started earlier this week. I did not pile on him, and I was not alone. There were other even-keeled posts made in that thread by people who do not necessarily share Bricker’s perspectives. Funny thing is, I don’t recall much discussion coming about from those posts. A few of them, yes. Perhaps they were authored by the even-keeled folks who have more interesting things to say, or who have established more of a discourse across the various lines in the sand that we draw around each other. I have no problem venting my ire here based on things that I have seen or read elsewhere, or that have happened to me or my friends and family. But I don’t often get worked up at other posters. It just isn’t how I’m wired. I don’t get the mindset that feels compelled to make personal attacks. If I encounter people here who are on the “other side” of whatever issue I am venting my ire about, my instinct is to go after the issue and not the jugular. I’m also quite aware that such a pacifist attitude in other areas of my life has not necessarily always worked in my favor, but I know no other way to be. Drama often begets drama and lashing out often comes back around. Not being dramatic or confrontational is often seen as boring without something else for people to find compelling. Just my $0.02. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/69 "2008-09-06T02:56:38Z")
> [@TVeblen](#): > > Great. More attention whoring. > > **Scylla** , you’re the despicable shit who, during the invasion of Iraq, attacked anyone and everyone who even dared question that weapons of mass destruction would be found. I attacked anyone and everyone? Really? Not true. That’s lie #1. > [@](#): > > We were excoriated as ‘jackal puke’, unpatriotic, weak–for even wondering whether the weapons inspectors and dubious international folks were right. You have a cite to me calling you jackal puke? I never called you that. The implication that I did or am somehow culpable for someone else’s actions is disingenuous. > [@](#): > > You made a big, public deal on the board that if those pesky weapons of mass destruction in fact were _not_ found by Thanksgiving of that year you’d seriously reconsider your stance on the war and support for Bush. > > Thanksgiving came and went. And you went with it. Just slunk away. All that fiery Republican warrior spirit…just went silent, and stayed that way for a long time, especially on political matters. But then you started up again, a victim of all those vicious board libruls. This is an outright lie. In point of fact, I conceded in GD publically, in a thread I opened for that express purpose, **Before** Thanksgiving. I did this immediately after the report came out finding no weapons of Mass Destruction. Then, on Thanksgiving another thread was opened in the pit, and I participated and conceded that I had been wrong about the WMDs there, as well, and that Bush had lied. Seeing as it happened not once but twice, I consider it a bald and outright lie that you have just fabricated. Even if you genuinely beleive the lie you just told, it is no better because you lacked the responsibility and decency to even check before you made your accusation. I remember back in the day you were a fervent but fair-minded debater. I thought you were always a good mod. I remember the fun we had in the Iron Chef threads. I remember how we used to dance and play in a field of daffodils as small children until one day you grew bresses and things got awkward. Then I went off to seek my fortune, but got kidnapped pirates and you married Prince Humperdink. What happened to you? Why’d you do that? Why are you making up lies about me? > [@](#): > > I didn’t expect a retraction or an apology, from you or any of the others who slung around insults and accusations of cowardice, coddling terrorists, etc. It was a tense, ugly time. People make mistakes, heartfelt, honest ones. Especially when misled by deliberate lies from those they trusted. Those betrayals cut the deepest and leave scars that won’t heal. Or not. Betrayal and dishonesty are weirdly _okay_ with some fanatics. …and I guess lies are ok with some others? > [@](#): > > What I will _not_ forgive nor forget is the behavior of many ‘conservatives’ toward non-GOP loyalists since then. I’m not a party animal of any stripe so I don’t get the rabid my-team-or-EVIL boosterism. You’re a die-hard Republican. So are a bunch of my family, mostly of the staunch Goldwater variety. I’m the Independent oddball of the family. But with one exception, none of even those ardent Republican partisans swallowed Rove/Bush’s shit then swore it was peanut butter. They didn’t accept the neocon lies and they sure as hell never forgot. They never dug in their feet and kept digging, deeper and deeper, to avoid an unpalatable truth: the current administration _sucked_. And got worse and worse, with wire tapping, imprisoning people indefinitely without trial, etc. yeah, yeah yeah and the music swells with the force of your righteousness. I’m not talking politics here. I talking about behavior on this board. > [@](#): > > ::SNIP:: (more politics.)… You demonstrably don’t care about truth, or character or responsibility. Pot. Kettle. Black. Babes. I ain’t the one making up lies, today. > [@](#): > > ::SNIP:: (more politics and how bad we are to support what we support) I don’t see it the way you see it. The other difference is that I don’t think your evil because you disagree with me. That’s why I’m so cool! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/70 "2008-09-06T02:58:02Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > We few, we band of botherers, we lefties…we told you so. Every step of the way, we told you so. And you sneered upon us with the casual contempt of the certain. And you were wrong. Dead wrong, totally _fahrblondget_, one eighty out, up shit creek without a clue. And pride prevents them from acknowledging such in any way. I’m becoming increasingly convinced that the GOP is a shell. The only thing holding it together it the sheer stubborn determination to keep the country out of lefty hands. They don’t have anything they’re fighting _for_, as **Starving Artist** ’s link to his own post so elegantly demonstrates. They’re just fighting _against_ the depraved, amoral, commie liberals. ---
**Author:** ![E-Sabbath](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e19adc/32.png) [@E-Sabbath](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-Sabbath)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/71 "2008-09-06T02:58:05Z")
Say, uhm. Scylla? You’re not really here for the hunting, are you? ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 2:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/72 "2008-09-06T02:59:37Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > [Homepage | CBN](http://www.cbn.com/CBNnews/437661.aspx) > That would be the smearers on the Christian Broadcasting Network, of course. Huh, Thanks. Did not see that. The point is clarified and conceded. Well done. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/73 "2008-09-06T03:05:01Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > I really don’t get you. In this thread, you’re “expressing concern” that debate here on the board is dead, that there is too much crap being flung, and that other posters, like Bricker, shouldn’t let a pile on get to them. > > Then you spend post after post revelling in the shit-flinging with another poster. And, apparently, enjoying the hell out of it. Even defining part of yourself about it. To me, it appears you want and enjoy this kind of repetitive idiotic insults. That you CRAVE it. And you do it, in a thread where your main premise is that that kind those kinds of posts are ruining the sdmb. > > As I said, I just don’t get you. Yeah, it’s a little weird, but with Lissener it feels like friendly banter. It’s been years since it’s actually gotten heated, at least as far as I’m concerned. ---
**Author:** ![Starving\_Artist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aeb1de/32.png) [@Starving\_Artist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Starving_Artist)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/74 "2008-09-06T03:06:34Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > They don’t have anything they’re fighting _for_, as **Starving Artist** ’s link to his own post so elegantly demonstrates. They’re just fighting _against_ the depraved, amoral, commie liberals. I don’t speak for all Republicans, but I’m sure there are plenty who feel the same way. And if you want to characterize yourself as a depraved, amoral, commie go right ahead. You won’t find those words – or characterizations – in my post. Angry, wrongheaded do-gooderism and its consequences is more how I’d describe it. Now, having said that, what would you have us do? Vote Democrat and add even more to the societal damage that we believe they’ve created? Not in this lifetime, pal. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/75 "2008-09-06T03:07:17Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > Say, uhm. Scylla? > > You’re not really here for the hunting, are you? au contraire. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/76 "2008-09-06T03:07:28Z")
> [@ivylass](#): > > **Scylla** , give it up. We’re in the minority here. I’ve learned to keep my head down and my mouth shut when it comes to politics. Well, I haven’t. Because basically, who gives a shit what these people think? A lot of Dopers are interesting to talk with. But the screaming idiots? They’re just there to make fun of, and to prod them into meltdowns so you can laugh at their foolishness. > [@TVeblen](#): > > The difference with you–and Bricker, and Shodan and Starving Artist–is that you still don’t admit there’s a fundamental disconnect between the current Republican powerpimps and actual conservatism. You know, fiscal caution. Limiting governmental interference in the lives of citizens. Shrinking the deficit. Not playing Big Brother in the lucrative religion business. So I’m supposed to vote for Obama, who is even worse? That doesn’t make any sense. > [@](#): > > You demonstrably don’t care about truth, or character or responsibility. This is why your opinion isn’t worth anything. Saying I care nothing about truth or responsibility because because I don’t vote for nanny-state liberals is both petty and stupid. So you pitch a tantrum every time someone posts that he won’t swallow the liberal Kool-aid. So? Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/77 "2008-09-06T03:09:40Z")
> [@Scylla](#): > > Yeah, it’s a little weird, but with Lissener it feels like friendly banter. It’s been years since it’s actually gotten heated, at least as far as I’m concerned. It is weird. Your OP, hell all your posts, would carry a lot more weight if you practiced what you preach. You, and I, both want the SDMB to be more about debate than shit flinging. Yet here you are, flinging shit with the best of them. And enjoying it. Just strikes me as odd. ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/78 "2008-09-06T03:10:44Z")
You want to hear something else really weird? I honestly believe **elucidator** is my friend. I mean, I argued with him sometimes with shameful hate, some of my worst behavior here, and I did it for years. You gotta really like somebody to do that. Seriously, if there is one person I would like to share a beer with, he’s it. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/79 "2008-09-06T03:14:44Z")
> [@Starving\_Artist](#): > > It seems that during your two-week or so hiatus I forgot the somnambulistic qualities of some of your posts. Don’t read 'em. I’ll get over it. ---
**Author:** ![Mosier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/7ea924/32.png) [@Mosier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mosier)\ **Post date:** [September 6, 2008, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263/80 "2008-09-06T03:17:42Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > But the screaming idiots? They’re just there to make fun of, and to prod them into meltdowns so you can laugh at their foolishness. There was a meltdown of epic proportions here recently. You’re right! It is kind of fun to point and laugh. Jackass. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/open-letter-to-bricker/462263.md?page=5)