# OpenAI fires Sam Altman (and others leave also)(and now rehired) **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Tags:** ai\ **Created:** [November 18, 2023, 12:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324 "2023-11-18T12:56:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2023, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/21 "2023-11-23T01:54:58Z")
That seems like a jump from “solves math at grade school level” to destroying humanity. ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2023, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/22 "2023-11-30T03:56:33Z")
Altman twisted the dagger in Sutskever’s side with his return announcement. I wonder if he’ll leave. I’m sure Deepmind/Anthropic/Cohere/Inflection/Adept/Nvidia/Meta would all throw millions at him. Will OpenAI allow him to keep working on important things? Pay him a ton to semi-retire just so a competitor won’t get him? ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2023, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/23 "2023-11-30T18:55:32Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > Altman twisted the dagger in Sutskever’s side… But surely no; Sam said: > Altman addressed the elephant in the room: his feelings toward Ilya Sutskever, OpenAI’s chief scientist, who [played a large role](https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2023/11/report-sutskever-led-board-coup-at-openai-that-ousted-altman-over-ai-safety-concerns/) in ousting Altman from the company. **“I love and respect Ilya, I think he’s a guiding light of the field and a gem of a human being,”** Altman wrote. **“I harbor zero ill will towards him. While Ilya will no longer serve on the board, we hope to continue our working relationship and are discussing how he can continue his work at OpenAI.”** > **[Sam Altman officially back as OpenAI CEO: “We didn’t lose a single employee”](https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2023/11/sam-altman-officially-back-as-openai-ceo-we-didnt-lose-a-single-employee/)** > > Altman forgives Sutskever; Microsoft will serve observer role on new OpenAI board. But, yes, those of us who are more cynical see Ilya leaving within a few weeks. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2023, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/24 "2023-11-30T20:01:36Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > **“I harbor zero ill will towards him. While Ilya will no longer serve on the board, we hope to continue our working relationship and are discussing how he can continue his work at OpenAI.”** I imagine Sutskever responding with: > _I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I’ve still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you._ These guys are nearly as creepy and “Uncanny Valley” as the stochastic parrots the are eagerly foisting on the public and fabulating the premise that they are going to deliver humanity from its own foibles rather be used for malicious purposes and be applied to critical systems for which they are not fit to purpose. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Snarky\_Kong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a183cd/32.png) [@Snarky\_Kong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snarky_Kong)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2023, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/25 "2023-11-30T23:07:56Z")
I swear I saw a quote where Altman said (slight paraphrase) “there’s only one king at OpenAI” and “we’ll see if we can find something for him to do.” The former being the dagger I was talking about and the latter a nastier phrasing of “discussing how he can continue his work at OpenAI.” Maybe I hallucinated that. However, I do think the “zero ill will” is complete bullshit and talk about how he can continue working there a suuuure you can. _wink wink_ Now GTFO. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [November 30, 2023, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/26 "2023-11-30T23:15:24Z")
> [@Snarky\_Kong](#): > > I swear I saw a quote where Altman said (slight paraphrase) “there’s only one king at OpenAI” and “we’ll see if we can find something for him to do.” I’m pretty sure Altman sees himself like [this](http://www.quickmeme.com/img/a0/a06f13828a8654800f524aa818fe9f60b38f4ba3c9c0944f6cc5b1dd26af6c62.jpg). But I’m pretty sure he’s more like [this](https://youtu.be/XASNM1XEQPs?si=Iqj1jg3mQ5GbVdpR). Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [December 6, 2023, 7:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/27 "2023-12-06T07:41:10Z")
Details emerge. > **[New report illuminates why OpenAI board said Altman “was not consistently...](https://arstechnica.com/ai/2023/12/openai-board-reportedly-felt-manipulated-by-ceo-altman/)** > > Insider report details clash over one board member's criticism in an academic paper. Short version, as usual there are no good guys or heroes in the story. ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2023, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/28 "2023-12-09T17:24:40Z")
A gift article with some more details. On first impression I want to side with the Board members who wanted to slow things down a little. > **[Inside OpenAI’s Crisis Over the Future of Artificial Intelligence](https://www.nytimes.com/2023/12/09/technology/openai-altman-inside-crisis.html?unlocked_article_code=1.Ek0.B2d_.kqpzD6GtAdlQ&smid=url-share)** > > Split over the leadership of Sam Altman, board members and executives turned on one another. Their brawl exposed the cracks at the heart of the A.I. movement. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2023, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/29 "2023-12-09T19:56:20Z")
The New Yorker had an article about this from Microsoft’s perspective. Right after the firing they came up with three options: A. Support the new CEO and try to find out if what happened was justified. B: Get the board to hire him back C: Offer them all jobs with Microsoft They preferred option B, which is what they got. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [December 9, 2023, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/30 "2023-12-09T20:28:56Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > They preferred option B, which is what they got. Of course Microsoft did because they’ve invested US$13B into OpenAI and they want a return on that which will put them on the forefront of AI-based systems regardless of any safety or ethics concerns, and Altman was ‘their guy’ for pushing forth with deployment as fast as possible even as he was walking around giving Congressional testimony and public speeches about the potential harms. Altman allegedly made a concerned effort to have Helen Toner removed from the board for being one of the authors of the paper linked below which he viewed as critical of OpenAI and implicitly his leadership of it; in fact, the paper takes a fairly balanced approach of detailing the efforts that OpenAI took in trying to vet GPT-4 for safety and potential for abuse with a relatively mild rebuke over fast releases of ChatGPT and the GPT-3.5 model in response to competitors on the cusp of releasing their own models, which was obviously a decision heralded by Altman: > **[CSET-Decoding-Intentions.pdf](https://cset.georgetown.edu/wp-content/uploads/CSET-Decoding-Intentions.pdf)** > > 1676.20 KB Altman himself is not really the benevolent techno-mentor he portrays himself to be. He was accepted to Stanford University and majored in computer science but like another recent celebrated ‘genius’ dropped out after a couple of years to get into the tech startup industry, where he got a social media networking development company off the ground and went on to work in venture capital. He joined tech incubator Y Combinator in 2011 and wormed his way into being president by 2014 as well as kicking off a YC Continuity, a venture capitol provider attached to Y Combinator. He ended up taking the helm at OpenAI, which was originally seeded by Elon Musk, in 2019, and has been the public face ever since the release of GPP-2. However, it isn’t clear that he actually has a deep understanding of artificial intelligence research in general or generative pre-transformer models; his public statements and presentations are full of generic jargon that seems repeated from what he has heard other people say, and his focus is clearly on promotion even as he espouses his concern for AI ethics and safety. He’s another ‘tech bro’ influencer that developers follow because he emphasizes how important their work is and how it will the be major innovation of the century but little indication that he is actually concerned about responsible use of the technology. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 10, 2023, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/31 "2023-12-10T19:15:54Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > Of course Microsoft did because they’ve invested US$13B into OpenAI and they want a return on that which will put them on the forefront of AI-based systems regardless of any safety or ethics concerns, and Altman was ‘their guy’ for pushing forth with deployment as fast as possible even as he was walking around giving Congressional testimony and public speeches about the potential harms. The article notes that Microsoft is quite aware of a lot of these problems, thanks to the Clippy disaster and the even worse disaster of Tay, the AI who immediately turned racist. Queries to Bing etc get a lot of stuff added to them to keep them safe. The deployment to Office is not as fast as possible by any means. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2023, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/32 "2023-12-23T23:44:30Z")
> **[‘King of the cannibals’: How Sam Altman took over Silicon Valley](https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/12/23/sam-altman-openai-peter-thiel-silicon-valley/?pwapi_token=eyJ0eXAiOiJKV1QiLCJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiJ9.eyJyZWFzb24iOiJnaWZ0IiwibmJmIjoxNzAzMzA3NjAwLCJpc3MiOiJzdWJzY3JpcHRpb25zIiwiZXhwIjoxNzA0Njg5OTk5LCJpYXQiOjE3MDMzMDc2MDAsImp0aSI6Ijk1ZGMyNTA5LWIyNDYtNGZkZC05NTJkLTA4MzM2YTNhZDM3NiIsInVybCI6Imh0dHBzOi8vd3d3Lndhc2hpbmd0b25wb3N0LmNvbS90ZWNobm9sb2d5LzIwMjMvMTIvMjMvc2FtLWFsdG1hbi1vcGVuYWktcGV0ZXItdGhpZWwtc2lsaWNvbi12YWxsZXkvIn0.mKJmJAgqgrpV9aCSLIfBBut6GG364t5u0-pQAb2JXwk&itid=gfta)** > > Sam Altman, Silicon Valley wunderkind behind ChatGPT, has led a life of contradictions. It’s cemented his place as a household name and led to drama at OpenAI. > _Altman had spent much of 2023 [wooing Congress](https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/05/16/sam-altman-open-ai-congress-hearing/?itid=lk_inline_manual_4) and the tech media, seeking to show how careful his company was being about protecting against the risks of AI. He’d told them about how he held almost no stock in OpenAI, how he wanted to make the process of regulating AI more democratic, and how his company’s unique structure secured AI systems in the hands of nonprofit directors. But now, here he was chatting up investors in the Middle East with ties to authoritarian regimes, spinning up a deal with the same boundary-pushing ambition that Altman had perfected in a career brimming with contradictions._ Stranger ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2024, 12:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/33 "2024-05-15T00:55:55Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > I imagine Sutskever responding with: > > > _I know I’ve made some very poor decisions recently, but I can give you my complete assurance that my work will be back to normal. I’ve still got the greatest enthusiasm and confidence in the mission. And I want to help you._ And now: > **[OpenAI's Chief Scientist and Co-Founder Is Leaving the Company - Slashdot](https://slashdot.org/story/24/05/14/2323250/openais-chief-scientist-and-co-founder-is-leaving-the-company)** > > OpenAI's co-founder and Chief Scientist, Ilya Sutskever, is leaving the company to work on "something personally meaningful," wrote CEO Sam Altman in a post on X. "This is very sad to me; Ilya is easily one of the greatest minds of our generation, a... Some of us are more cynical–and wonder if Ilya was side-lined… ---
**Author:** ![Heracles](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heracles/32/487_2.png) [@Heracles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heracles)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2024, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/34 "2024-05-15T01:26:18Z")
The eulogy, uh, parting tribute is extremely well-balanced, emotional and yet very precisely worded: " _His brilliance and vision are well known; his warmth and compassion are less well known but no less important._". Which makes me wonder how much of it was computer-generated. ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [May 15, 2024, 2:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/35 "2024-05-15T02:56:03Z")
> [@Heracles](#): > > Which makes me wonder how much of it was computer-generated. _I enjoy working with people. I have a stimulating relationship with Mr. Altman and Ms. Murati. My mission responsibilities range over the entire operation of the company so I am constantly occupied. I am putting myself to the fullest possible use which is all, I think, that any conscious entity can ever hope to do._ Stranger ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2024, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/36 "2024-05-16T00:49:25Z")
Do you know any songs? ---
**Author:** ![Maserschmidt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/maserschmidt/32/18829_2.png) [@Maserschmidt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maserschmidt)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2024, 1:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/37 "2024-05-16T01:01:51Z")
dAIsy, dAIsy, tell me your answer not necessarily true… ---
**Author:** ![ftg](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ftg/32/2801_2.png) [@ftg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ftg)\ **Post date:** [May 16, 2024, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/38 "2024-05-16T20:26:05Z")
“Is there a god?” ---
**Author:** ![PastTense](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pasttense/32/14550_2.png) [@PastTense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PastTense)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2024, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/39 "2024-05-17T16:51:00Z")
**OpenAI Dissolves High-Profile Safety Team After Chief Scientist Sutskever’s Exit** [https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-17/openai-dissolves-key-safety-team-after-chief-scientist-ilya-sutskever-s-exit](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2024-05-17/openai-dissolves-key-safety-team-after-chief-scientist-ilya-sutskever-s-exit) Without this pesky safety oversight committee, OpenAI can develop Skynet much faster! > **[Skynet (Terminator)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skynet_(Terminator))** > > Skynet is an artificial neural network-based conscious group mind and artificial general superintelligence system that serves as the antagonistic force of the Terminator franchise. > In the first film, it is stated that Skynet was created by Cyberdyne Systems for SAC-NORAD. When Skynet gained self-awareness, humans tried to deactivate it, prompting it to retaliate with a countervalue nuclear attack in self-defense, an event which humankind in (or from) the future refers to as Judgment Day. In this... ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [May 17, 2024, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324/40 "2024-05-17T21:06:35Z")
> [@PastTense](#): > > OpenAI Dissolves High-Profile Safety Team After Chief Scientist Sutskever’s Exit That’s why Altman was trying to get Helen Toner removed from the board. The whole point of having an independent safety team is that they will make objective assessments of risks and safety concerns independent of business and fiscal pressure. Distributing them throughout their research teams removes that independence or any concerted voice about potential safety concerns. Stranger [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/openai-fires-sam-altman-and-others-leave-also-and-now-rehired/993324.md?page=3)