# Opening schools **URL:** \ **Category:** The Quarantine Zone\ **Tags:** covid-quarantine\ **Created:** [May 21, 2020, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247 "2020-05-21T15:36:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/321 "2020-07-10T22:11:48Z")
I think we should keep schools open in places where the infection rate is low. I also think we should continue distance learning as best when can, when we have to close schools. But I also think an optional extra year should be added at the end of elementary, middle, and high schools so kids can “catch up” without stigma if they still have skill gaps when they hit that transition. I think it could be presented in a way that limited any stigma. In fact, affluent parents might be the most enthusiastic about it. ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 10:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/322 "2020-07-10T22:16:23Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > 15% get infected (high estimate) and _of those_ 4% pass it on (in a household level contact). This [paper](https://doi.org/10.1093/cid/ciaa549) suggest the rates of household transfer was much higher during the New York crisis. Table 2 says that of those houses with a proband case, 57% of the time another household member also tested positive. In houses with children 5-17 32% of them tested positive. Just to clarify, the data are from New York State, excluding NYC. This is a back reference from the [Vox article](https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2020/7/9/21318560/covid-19-coronavirus-us-testing-children-schools-reopening-questions) that @Trom posted, which points out that these are different findings than the much lower household transmission rates from China. The obvious conclusion from this, is that if any member of a household has Covid-19, then all household members need to stay home from school for an appropriate length of time. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/323 "2020-07-10T22:25:14Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Really, what is so bad about having kids skip 1 year of school? Poor kids often don’t learn much at school as it is because of funding and caring issues. I don’t see how that wouldn’t condemn at least SOME kids who might otherwise have made it to definite poverty. ---
**Author:** ![echoreply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/echoreply/32/3641_2.png) [@echoreply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/echoreply)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/324 "2020-07-10T22:25:27Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > Really, what is so bad about having kids skip 1 year of school? If anything, it might be mentally good for them. Let them think about what they really want to do in life, catch up on whatever topics or subjects they were previously weak in, etc. For the older ones, a “gap year” is not only common, but in fact sometimes even recommended. > > Furthermore - maybe someone can do the math for me - but if we reopen all schools in earnest, isn’t it possibly we’d actually end up killing or harming more kids and teachers than are killed in school shootings or the like every year? Unless we are in a hard shutdown of nearly everything, many kids will not be staying isolated at home, just because school is closed. Many of the children are just going to be in day care if they’re not at school. So some of the kids may not be receiving any additional protection by having schools closed. Closing schools may still be the reasonable response. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/325 "2020-07-10T22:33:41Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Poor kids often don’t learn much at school as it is because of funding and caring issues. I don’t see how that wouldn’t condemn at least SOME kids who might otherwise have made it to definite poverty. I think the idea is that if they were in 3rd grad last year, start 4th grade Sept 2021. And it’s not a terrible idea, but a year of total verging seems bad. Plus, do we layoff every employee from the largest single employer in many places? ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/326 "2020-07-10T22:37:17Z")
They would still be a lot more isolated, especially the big kids. Unless we radically shoft the structure of schools to cohort, students are mingling with hundreds of other kids and adults in a day. Many also are bringing in exposure from their own retail jobs, which multiplies. Hanging out with friends doesn’t compare. ---
**Author:** ![VOW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vow/32/3043_2.png) [@VOW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VOW)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/327 "2020-07-10T23:43:59Z")
The percentage of kids getting sick in CA/FL/TX is growing, and more are developing complications. On a lighter note Trump made campaign stops in Florida today, and he wasn’t wearing a mask. ~VOW ---
**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/328 "2020-07-10T23:55:28Z")
> [@echoreply](#): > > > [@DSeid](#): > > > > 15% get infected (high estimate) and _of those_ 4% pass it on (in a household level contact). > > This [paper](https://doi.org/10.1093/cid/ciaa549) suggest the rates of household transfer was much higher during the New York crisis. Table 2 says that of those houses with a proband case, 57% of the time another household member also tested positive. In houses with children 5-17 32% of them tested positive. > > Just to clarify, the data are from New York State, excluding NYC. > > This is a back reference from the [Vox article](https://www.vox.com/platform/amp/2020/7/9/21318560/covid-19-coronavirus-us-testing-children-schools-reopening-questions) that @Trom posted, which points out that these are different findings than the much lower household transmission rates from China. … Thing is it isn’t just China that that result is an outlier from. In [South Korea](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7104686/) found 7.56% with hardly any under 19. In [Taiwan](https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamainternalmedicine/fullarticle/2765641) about 5% among family contacts and less than 1% among those under 19. So these first cases in New York State having high numbers of others in the household (actually 38% in the household when the index case was not included), albeit still with less than half the rate in children as in adults (see Table 2), makes one wonder what was different about the early cases in New York State …? Then I noticed that the overwhelming majority of those tested were in households with 5 or more household members (240 of 343) and remember (Doh!) that [ground zero for COVID-19 in New York State was _the Hasidic Orthodox community_](https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/08/nyregion/coronavirus-rockland-monsey-jews.html), large families with crowded schuls, regularly attended. Yeah, “common sources cannot be ruled out”. Not sure I’d extrapolate from there to the rest of America. ---
**Author:** ![RealityCheck71](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitycheck71/32/3493_2.png) [@RealityCheck71](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityCheck71)\ **Post date:** [July 10, 2020, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/329 "2020-07-10T23:55:29Z")
> [@VOW](#): > > The percentage of kids getting sick in CA/FL/TX is growing, and more are developing complications Where did you see that? ---
**Author:** ![VOW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vow/32/3043_2.png) [@VOW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VOW)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/330 "2020-07-11T00:53:29Z")
ABC news ~VOW ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/331 "2020-07-11T01:22:15Z")
[Joint statement today from AAP, NEA, AFT, and AASA](https://services.aap.org/en/news-room/news-releases/aap/2020/pediatricians-educators-and-superintendents-urge-a-safe-return-to-school-this-fall/): > [@](#): > > “Returning to school is important for the healthy development and well-being of children, but we must pursue re-opening in a way that is safe for all students, teachers and staff. Science should drive decision-making on safely reopening schools. Public health agencies must make recommendations based on evidence, not politics. We should leave it to health experts to tell us when the time is best to open up school buildings, and listen to educators and administrators to shape how we do it. > > “_ **Local school leaders, public health experts, educators and parents must be at the center of decisions about how and when to reopen schools** _, taking into account the spread of COVID-19 in their communities and the capacities of school districts to adapt safety protocols to make in-person learning safe and feasible. For instance, schools in areas with high levels of COVID-19 community spread should not be compelled to reopen against the judgment of local experts **.** A one-size-fits-all approach is not appropriate for return to school decisions. > > “_ **Reopening schools in a way that maximizes safety, learning, and the well-being of children, teachers, and staff will clearly require substantial new investments in our schools and campuses** _. We call on Congress and the administration to provide the federal resources needed to ensure that inadequate funding does not stand in the way of safely educating and caring for children in our schools. Withholding funding from schools that do not open in person fulltime would be a misguided approach, putting already financially strapped schools in an impossible position that would threaten the health of students and teachers. The emphasized pieces are pretty flippin’ important. The NC legislature looks to be pulling some parliamentary bullshit that’s trying to force schools to be fully open for the first 5 days, without having any additional funding to districts and without consulting with any educators in the process. That’s scary as hell. All the teacher rage that’s been trembling under the surface of our country over the past few years? Get your seismographs ready. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/332 "2020-07-11T01:25:23Z")
Quoting a friend of mine from elsewhere: > [@](#): > > What I would really, really, really love to see done is the running of drills with folks who are putting plans in place. I want someone in a position of power to walk me through the specifics of a school day from AM bus stop to PM bus stop with me being able to throw all the monkey wrenches we know will arise into their ‘plan’ and see how they cover those possibilities. Kid at the bus stop has a fever but no parent around! Child figures out that coughing on people gets a reaction! We can’t use water fountains and half the kids forgot their water bottles! Two teachers and a bus driver are out with strep! A child has a hacking cough but their mom can’t pick them up for 3 hours and we have no nurse to supervise them in seclusion! A parent called and said their kid went to a birthday party and now 3 of the kids there have fevers, but don’t want to get tested! Child who only takes their meds when at school is completely dysregulated on their ‘in person’ weeks and makes it impossible for a classroom to function! A parent who committed to all virtual learning has a really important meeting so they drop their kid off at school! Every time they say ‘I don’t know’ or ‘we’ll figure that out later’ they have to put 1000 dollars into our discretionary spending account. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/333 "2020-07-11T01:30:48Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > The emphasized pieces are pretty flippin’ important. The NC legislature looks to be pulling some parliamentary bullshit that’s trying to force schools to be fully open for the first 5 days, without having any additional funding to districts and without consulting with any educators in the process. That’s scary as hell. When does NC open? Our superintendent suggested the other day that we may delay the first day of school 3 weeks, to the say after Labor Day. We’d make up the time, and it would give us the opportunity to get a little more settled. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/334 "2020-07-11T01:43:57Z")
Our superintendent is an inexperienced corrupt megalomaniac who used the position as a failed stepping stone to a lieutenant governor campaign; he’s basically said nothing. Plan is to open August 17. ---
**Author:** ![VOW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vow/32/3043_2.png) [@VOW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VOW)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/335 "2020-07-11T01:46:47Z")
Texas child care centers had a increase 759% in the number of infections from last month to this month. 1800 individuals, both staff and children. ABC news, “World News Tonight.” ~VOW ---
**Author:** ![VOW](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/vow/32/3043_2.png) [@VOW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VOW)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/336 "2020-07-11T01:50:37Z")
@Left_Hand_of_Dorkness The emphasized portion from above leaves out one very important aspect: MONEY. School districts across the nation don’t have extra bucks in a Bible or under somebody’s mattress to pay for the recommended safety measures. ~VOW ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/337 "2020-07-11T01:54:37Z")
That is our original date. I’m sorry you have especially bad leadership at a time of crisis. (Familiar theme!) Our superintendent is very solid. He’s been here since 2005, which is basically unheard of in large urban districts. I am super, super grateful. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/338 "2020-07-11T01:55:47Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > . We call on Congress and the administration to provide the federal resources needed to ensure that inadequate funding does not stand in the way of safely educating and caring for children in our schools. Withholding funding from schools that do not open in person fulltime would be a misguided approach, putting already financially strapped schools in an impossible position that would They are aware. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/339 "2020-07-11T02:21:45Z")
My wife’s school district just announced a plan: All distance learning until there are no new cases in our county for seven days. ---
**Author:** ![Tfletch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tfletch1/32/5340_2.png) [@Tfletch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tfletch1)\ **Post date:** [July 11, 2020, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/340 "2020-07-11T02:54:35Z")
> [@VOW](#): > > Texas child care centers had a increase 759% in the number of infections from last month to this month. 1800 individuals, both staff and children. Yep. That’s just one month. [https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/06/health/texas-coronavirus-cases-child-care-facilities/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2020/07/06/health/texas-coronavirus-cases-child-care-facilities/index.html) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247.md?page=18)