# Opening schools

**URL:** <https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247>\
**Category:** The Quarantine Zone\
**Tags:** covid-quarantine\
**Created:** [May 21, 2020, 3:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247 "2020-05-21T15:36:12Z")\
**Posts on this page:** 20\
**Page:** 24

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**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\
**Post date:** [July 16, 2020, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/461 "2020-07-16T14:55:14Z")

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Also . . .

Those are very sensible recommendations. There are LOTS of sensible recommendations we haven’t been able to follow because 5-day a week school for all has to be the priority for all. Just in the last few days, it’s starting to occur to the powers that be that Texas is on fire and maybe that’s a bad idea. So we are scrambling.

I am so burned out about “sensible plans for how to react if the data hits key points”. Texas did that. Then totally ignored it. So it’s hard to trust anything.

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**Author:** ![DSeid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dseid/32/20194_2.png) [@DSeid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSeid)\
**Post date:** [July 16, 2020, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/462 "2020-07-16T15:02:57Z")

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Agree with both posts.

There is a selection bias that these are the kids who are most likely to not be mitigating well, and then putting them together more … like putting those who want to get drunk together in a bar. Yeah they might behave badly without a bar open but the harms are amplified if it is.

It is undeniable that rational plans won’t work if no one actually implements the rational plans.

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**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\
**Post date:** [July 16, 2020, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/463 "2020-07-16T15:14:11Z")

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Also like a bar, some people that might have behaved more sensibly will be under pressure to come out, now that there is a thing to go to. You don’t miss football practice in Texas. If you do, you don’t play.

This, really, is why teachers are so resistant. It’s not that they don’t trust the science, they don’t trust the system. And it’s not unfounded.

We could design a system where under 12s had something approaching normal school, with small classes. We could have redesigned distance learning to be more automated, need fewer teachers. It would have suffered in quality, but it would have been okay. And the other teachers could have been reassigned to teach littles, with a experienced elementary teacher mentor next store, allowing smaller classes. I have long thought this would solve the largest set of problems. Maybe add open work areas where bigger kids could get computers and food and work on distance learning. (And escape abuse).

But that would have involved making decisions that would have made people unhappy. We’ve avoided all of those. I am so disgusted.

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**Author:** ![RealityCheck71](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitycheck71/32/3493_2.png) [@RealityCheck71](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityCheck71)\
**Post date:** [July 16, 2020, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/464 "2020-07-16T15:25:08Z")

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That’s exactly the type of setup I was thinking would be a fairly decent quick fix. It’s nuts that partisan politics has fucked you people up right down to the damn county school board level.

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**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\
**Post date:** [July 16, 2020, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/465 "2020-07-16T16:18:21Z")

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Honestly, local school boards have generally been sensible and on point. Dallas has made the right moves consistently. But the state has undermined every effort.

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**Author:** ![Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heffalump_and_roo/32/7691_2.png) [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heffalump_and_Roo)\
**Post date:** [July 16, 2020, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/466 "2020-07-16T17:30:55Z")

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Several articles have mentioned how some health organizations are worried about children’s mental health if they don’t go back to school. But they don’t mention how children’s mental health might be affected if they did go back to school during a pandemic.

According to [this study](https://www.svt.se/nyheter/lokalt/uppsala/atta-av-tio-barn-oroliga-for-corona) out of Sweden, where schools haven’t closed, children are worried about the coronavirus. Children as young as 4 years old participated and had thoughts about the situation.

> [@](#):
>
> Eight out of ten children are worried about corona
> 
> According to a new research study from Uppsala University, eight out of ten children and young people are worried about corona. It is mainly about relatives becoming ill or dying. In addition, seven out of ten young people state that they would like more information about corona.
> 
> - There is a lot of worry that the children carry. They are both worried about death and illness, especially among older relatives. But also that it has a very negative effect on social life, peer relationships and a great lack of grandparents, says Anna Sarkadi, professor of social medicine at Morgonstudion.

Going to school hasn’t alleviated children’s worry.

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**Author:** ![lobotomyboy63](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobotomyboy63/32/2900_2.png) [@lobotomyboy63](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobotomyboy63)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/467 "2020-07-17T00:07:18Z")

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For any schools still attempting to open in mid-August, this isn’t helpful. [CDC School Guidance Won't Be Released This Week, NPR Has Learned : Coronavirus Updates : NPR](https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/07/16/892105802/cdc-wont-release-school-guidelines-this-week-as-anticipated?utm_campaign=politics&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_term=nprnews&fbclid=IwAR1J9Tx3qPGZgfdyejF5JcSPqAf8ps6Hr-xMNm8_QCsnDyYo4EFEz7jmCQw)

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**Author:** ![RealityCheck71](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitycheck71/32/3493_2.png) [@RealityCheck71](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityCheck71)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/468 "2020-07-17T00:18:48Z")

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> [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](#):
>
> Going to school hasn’t alleviated children’s worry

Uh, ok. You really think “worried about covid” is the mental health concern pediatricians are worried about or think they can solve at all? Kids are going to worry about covid because it’s on TV all the time and their parents are worried. It has nothing to do with school.

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**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/469 "2020-07-17T00:45:12Z")

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Not entirely. Being at home and knowing you can’t go to places because of COVID is really different than being at school where COVID awareness is hammered endlessly all day: teachers acting as mask police, constant reminders to stay six feet apart, teachers visibly scared to come within six feet of you or anyone else. School periodically cancelled because “someone” has it. Teachers out for weeks at a time. A basic tone that following the rules is literally a matter of life or death.

School is going to be rough.

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**Author:** ![RealityCheck71](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitycheck71/32/3493_2.png) [@RealityCheck71](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityCheck71)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/470 "2020-07-17T00:49:58Z")

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I don’t think it’s obviously true that being forced to stay home and seeing mom and dad forced to stay home is a less worry inducing situation.

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**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/471 "2020-07-17T01:17:37Z")

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I don’t think staying home feels “forced” to a kid. It feels normal, just a lot more of it than usual. At home, there are long stretches of time where you can forget about COVID. When it’s just not relevant. At school, in a mask, constantly monitoring your six foot bubble, you’ll never be able to forget about it. It will be a constant stress.

In the big picture, it’s a small element, but for kids who have a safe home, school is going to be much more stressful.

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**Author:** ![RealityCheck71](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitycheck71/32/3493_2.png) [@RealityCheck71](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityCheck71)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/472 "2020-07-17T01:54:46Z")

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Well, I don’t think children should be masked and six foot bubbled in school. Not under ten years old. Most certainly not the four year olds in the linked article.

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**Author:** ![Rushgeekgirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rushgeekgirl/32/3715_2.png) [@Rushgeekgirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rushgeekgirl)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/473 "2020-07-17T02:00:05Z")

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My son is PUMPED for the virtual school to start. He’s looking at it like an adventure he can experience in his PJs. The kids he hangs out with at school have been doing ZOOM since school let out back in March. He is looking forward to going back when it’s safe and he’s smart enough to know right now it’s not. We’ve had over a thousand positive cases reported, 12% have been minors, in the past four days. He is rationally afraid of this virus, especially knowing the people closest to him are higher risk for severe complications. Considering the school can’t guarantee social distancing and won’t be requiring masks and will continue contact sports he knows it’s best to stay home for now. At his school they are starting August 10th. They can do virtual school if they choose and they will do this nine weeks, then they will decide if they should continue it. I’m afraid they won’t and it will cause another surge. For some reason people have it in their heads that kids can’t catch this or transmit it. I know it’s low but FFS if you have a school full of kids how many are you willing to risk and hope they just get the asymptomatic or low symptom cases?

I can’t help but think we’re putting politics and money over people’s health and it’s just not right. Endangering teachers and support staff like this doesn’t seem like a really bright idea either.

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**Author:** ![RealityCheck71](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitycheck71/32/3493_2.png) [@RealityCheck71](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityCheck71)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/474 "2020-07-17T02:22:12Z")

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Did your son do remote school end of last year? How was that?

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**Author:** ![raspberry\_hunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@raspberry\_hunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raspberry_hunter)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/475 "2020-07-17T16:12:30Z")

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Our elementary school district just sent us email saying that their plan (subject to how the numbers look… we were doing pretty well with not too many new cases and then we just literally had a jump yesterday… we’ll see if the numbers start growing again) was to do 5 days a week with smaller classroom sizes (\<20/class) because the board of trustees has allowed them to hire more teachers (they described briefly where the funding was going to come from – a combo of getting rid of “specialist” teachers (who couldn’t do the modified day anyway because they’d mix between different cohorts of kids) and state/federal aid, it looks like, though I don’t have any numbers so I don’t know how realistic this is). I’m rather impressed, it sounds like people have been working really hard on this. I also don’t know _where_ they are going to have all these classes.

My younger child was set to go to K in this district but now I’m also applying to the same private school my older one goes to, which is super small (the entire school is 40 kids), as I think it would limit exposure if both kids were at one very small school, and they’re also more amenable to things like having classes outside (which wouldn’t work so well for a public school, I am guessing).

Unlike all the other kids in her class, who all had a really hard time with it, my older child loved remote school and would probably rather do that than in-person school. She is ASD though, so, as the school director remarked when we had a zoom meeting, remote school has all the good things about school for her (math!) without all the things that annoy her (other kids).But she does need to be with other kids, and I have noticed that when she does a lot of screen time (like all her zoom classes) she gets super grumpy.

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**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/476 "2020-07-17T19:56:12Z")

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Governor Newsom just announced that all schools in California counties on the “watch list” must open with distance learning. That’s about half the counties in the state, and all the urban and suburban ones.

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**Author:** ![Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/heffalump_and_roo/32/7691_2.png) [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Heffalump_and_Roo)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/477 "2020-07-17T20:55:30Z")

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According to this article, some medical experts say that kids can spread the coronavirus, and there’s not enough evidence about the difference in ages that kids can get it and spread it. Some surmise that children might be more dangerous to the spread of the disease since they are often asymptomatic but may still be able to transmit the disease.

> **[Can kids spread the coronavirus? 'Conclusively, without a doubt – yes,'...](https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/health/2020/07/17/coronavirus-can-kids-spread-covid-19-spreadquestions-answered/5450062002/)**
>
> Medical experts say kids recover quicker from COVID-19 but can still be carriers of the virus and facilitate spread in their communities.

> [@](#):
>
> ## Can children carry the coronavirus and spread it?
> 
> “I think the answer is conclusively, without a doubt – yes,” said Dr. Lara Shekerdemian, chief of critical care at Texas Children’s Hospital.
> 
> Surveillance screening, which is testing all children admitted to the hospital, has revealed a higher percentage of them carrying the virus and not showing any symptoms, she said.
> 
> The trend is consistent with data from Florida. About one-third of children tested in the state for COVID-19 returned positive results, which is higher than the overall statewide positivity rate of 11%, [according to state data.](http://ww11.doh.state.fl.us/comm/_partners/covid19_report_archive/pediatric_report_latest.pdf)  
> While there has yet to be hard data to prove asymptomatic spread – transmitting the virus without displaying any symptoms – Shekerdemian said there’s nothing to suggest “the lack of symptoms doesn’t mean you don’t transmit it.”
> 
> “There’s no doubt they can be asymptomatic. Do they carry (the virus) more often than adults?” she said. “That’s a hard one to answer. There isn’t enough surveillance going on in the community.”
> 
> Dr. Megan Culler Freeman, a pediatric infectious disease specialist at UPMC Children’s Hospital of Pittsburgh, said nose swab studies have shown children have the same amount of viral load in their noses as adults.
> 
> However, children are more likely to have only mild symptoms, which may not be noticeable to child or parent. Shekerdemian says by being healthier, children can actually be more dangerous as they’re less likely to stay at home sick and more likely to go out into the world unknowingly spreading the virus.
> 
> ## What age group is more at risk for COVID-19?
> 
> There was no difference in children age groups two or three months ago, Shekerdemian said, but now doctors are seeing more older kids in the hospital for COVID-19.
> 
> She suspects this may be due to teenagers and young adults socializing outside of their houses as businesses reopen. However, she said there’s no data available to support that these older children get sicker or are more at risk for the disease.

Children as young as 2 months old can get coronavirus, something this mother wasn’t prepared for.

> **[Gilbert mother warns others after 2-month-old tests positive for coronavirus](https://www.abc15.com/news/region-southeast-valley/gilbert/gilbert-mother-warns-others-after-2-month-old-tests-positive-for-coronavirus)**
>
> Angelica Wendell thinks her newborn Eevee contracted the virus from Wendell's sister, who was at their home visiting recently and later developed symptoms. She was shocked to find out her daughter had the virus.

Two stories of parents struggling with the decision about sending their kids back to school. The first one is a personal story. The second is a bit of a snarky take on the predicament, admitting they are in a privileged position that leaves them more options.

> **['I am definitely panicking': Parents say school reopening plans leave them...](https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/16/parents-say-school-reopening-plans-leave-them-without-any-good-options.html)**
>
> School districts around the country are rolling out fall class schedules that offer a mix of remote learning paired with a few days in the classroom. But these blended learning plans are throwing families for a loop as parents try to map out how to...

> **[There Are Literally No Good Options for Educating Our Kids This Fall](https://www.thenation.com/article/society/covid-schools-reopening/)**
>
> But the real scandal is that we shouldn’t be in this position in the first place.

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<div class="post-metadata">

**Author:** ![RealityCheck71](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitycheck71/32/3493_2.png) [@RealityCheck71](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityCheck71)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 9:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/478 "2020-07-17T21:08:40Z")

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Well, that’ll shut up all those people saying kids are 100% immune and 100% not contagious.

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**Author:** ![raspberry\_hunter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b19c9b/32.png) [@raspberry\_hunter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/raspberry_hunter)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/479 "2020-07-17T21:13:22Z")

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Oh. Hm. I’m in one of those counties, so I guess disregard my entire last post.

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**Author:** ![Tfletch1](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tfletch1/32/5340_2.png) [@Tfletch1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tfletch1)\
**Post date:** [July 17, 2020, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opening-schools/854247/480 "2020-07-17T21:31:42Z")

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> [@Heffalump\_and\_Roo](#):
>
> Dr. Megan Culler Freeman, a pediatric infectious disease specialist at UPMC Children’s Hospital of Pittsburgh, said nose swab studies have shown children have the same amount of viral load in their noses as adults.
> 
> However, children are more likely to have only mild symptoms, which may not be noticeable to child or parent. Shekerdemian says by being healthier, children can actually be more dangerous as they’re less likely to stay at home sick and more likely to go out into the world unknowingly spreading the virus.

Oh, that doesn’t look good.

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