# Operation Pillar of Cloud -- Gaza Under Siege **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 15, 2012, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137 "2012-11-15T22:17:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/361 "2012-11-20T21:59:15Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > No, they still haven’t Damuri, just like the last dozen times you made that claim. > You need to stop saying things that aren’t true. I linked you the post the last time you said this. I think it was brazil 84. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/362 "2012-11-20T22:00:42Z")
> [@Ibn\_Warraq](#): > > So because some anonymous poster on an obscure messageboard may or may not have claimed all critics of Israel are anti-Semites, it’s impossible to criticize Israel. :dubious: > > Beyond that I have a really tough time believing that any reasonable poster said(obviously we’re a huge board and some are rather “vocal”). > > Who said this? Links, please. I think you we’re also in the thread where I linked brazil 84s comments. Why is it that’s have to keep linking those cites? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 10:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/363 "2012-11-20T22:01:50Z")
No, you really didn’t. And attentive readers will also note that you’ve now changed your claim from “people” to “Brazil, on one single occasion”. You need to stop saying things that aren’t true. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/364 "2012-11-20T22:13:46Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > No, you really didn’t. > And attentive readers will also note that you’ve now changed your claim from “people” to “Brazil, on one single occasion”. > You need to stop saying things that aren’t true. Really? That’s your big come back? You admit that I have been accused of antisemitism because I criticized Israel but i’m a liar because I used the term “people”? Gotcha.:rolleyes::smack: ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/365 "2012-11-20T22:26:07Z")
Looks to me like he said “you’ve changed your claim”, not “I admit you’re right”. But sometimes words have two meanings, like Led Zeppelin told us. Just don’t get a bustle in your hedgerow. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [November 20, 2012, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/366 "2012-11-20T23:55:50Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I think you we’re also in the thread where I linked brazil 84s comments. Why is it that’s have to keep linking those cites? I honestly don’t remember this event you’re referring to. Can you please link so I can see what exactly was said and what the context was. I also don’t want to violate any rules but I asked about “reasonable” posters. Brazil doesn’t strike me as being terribly representative of the Dope. ---
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/367 "2012-11-21T00:05:03Z")
Another bizaro world thread. Current score: Dead Palestinians: a little over 100 Dead Israelis: 3 Netanyahu’s re-election campaign : 8 weeks remaining ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/368 "2012-11-21T00:09:06Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > You need to stop saying things that aren’t true. Knock it off. You know the rules about accusations of lying. Stop it. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/369 "2012-11-21T00:19:35Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > . . . might just turn out The Flat Earther here is not me. Raises hand. That’d be me. But I’ll take it to another thread. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/370 "2012-11-21T00:20:44Z")
> [@levdrakon](#): > > . . . Body dragged through streets of Gaza. Don’t watch if you don’t want to see it. I don’t want to see it…but can someone link to a news story about it? ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/371 "2012-11-21T00:21:06Z")
I know the rules about lying. I also didn’t accuse him of lying. The rules are that: > [@](#): > > Questioning or disputing the accuracy of another poster’s statements–“I don’t think that’s right”, “That’s incorrect”, “You are mistaken”, or even “That’s not true”-- is what Great Debates is all about. I pointed out that his statement is not true. That’s explicitly allowed. I also pointed out that he should not repeat it. I did not, however, claim that Damuri is deliberately stating something that is not true, nor would this be the correct forum to discuss the source of his error. But I will follow your mod note and I will not state again in this thread that Damuri should not say erroneous things. ---
**Author:** ![RandMcnally](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b782af/32.png) [@RandMcnally](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RandMcnally)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/372 "2012-11-21T00:23:11Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > I don’t want to see it…but can someone link to a news story about it? People on a motorcycle were dragging around a body of a supposed Israeli collaborator. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 12:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/373 "2012-11-21T00:44:26Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > I don’t want to see it…but can someone link to a news story about it? At the bottom [of this article](http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/21/us-palestinians-israel-hamas-idUSBRE8AD0WP20121121) is: > [@](#): > > Hamas executed six Palestinians accused of spying for Israel, who a security source quoted by Hamas Aqsa radio said had been “caught red-handed” with “filming equipment to take footage of positions”. The radio said they had been shot. > > Militants on a motorcycle dragged the body of one of the men through the streets. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 4:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/374 "2012-11-21T04:40:45Z")
> [@BrokenBriton](#): > > Another bizaro world thread. Current score: > > Dead Palestinians: a little over 100 > Dead Israelis: 3 I don’t understand what casualty rates have to do with who is or isn’t right or wrong in a conflict. Since when was being good at war a bad thing? In any event, one of the reasons the numbers are so lopsided, aside from Israel having a more talented military force, is simply that Israel puts a great deal of emphasis on protecting its civilians from getting killed. They have an advanced civil defense system to warn civilians and get them to take appropriate shelter. Hamas, conversely, does not want its civilians protected; they want lots of them killed, since this enables them to use the bodies for PR. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/375 "2012-11-21T04:57:39Z")
> [@BrokenBriton](#): > > Netanyahu’s re-election campaign : 8 weeks remaining I already told you to stop making these snide remarks about the election. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 5:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/376 "2012-11-21T05:55:36Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > Hamas, conversely, does not want its civilians protected; they want lots of them killed, since this enables them to use the bodies for PR. And it’s not just Hamas. "We are all behind you, the struggling nation, the heroic that is presenting its children as heroes every day” - Egyptian Prime Minister Hisham Qandil, speaking in Gaza November 16th. There’s something seriously off-kilter about the view that children are to be used as [del]pawns[/del] “heroes” in an armed conflict. ---
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 7:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/377 "2012-11-21T07:31:33Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > I already told you to stop making these snide remarks about the election. “snide”? Get over yourself, already. If you don’t think the motive and context for beginning this exchange with Hamas was the election, then make the case because it’s pretty clearly central to what is happening. Otherwise, (a) how about letting people argue what they wish to argue and (b) it’s kind of weird to want to power trip on the internet. ---
**Author:** ![levdrakon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@levdrakon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/levdrakon)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/378 "2012-11-21T07:35:30Z")
> [@BrokenBriton](#): > > If you don’t think the motive and context for beginning this exchange with Hamas was the election, then make the case because it’s pretty clearly central to what is happening. Go on. ---
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 7:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/379 "2012-11-21T07:44:43Z")
Not permitted. Read above. ---
**Author:** ![brazil84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8491ac/32.png) [@brazil84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brazil84)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2012, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/380 "2012-11-21T09:11:40Z")
> [@tagos](#): > > They aren’t ‘strangely silent’. They expect no better of violent dictatorships. They do expect better of Israel and other democracies. How do you know that? Did you read it somewhere or is it your own speculation? I would love to have some quotes from prominent “Pro-Palestinian” people and organizations which effectively concede that Israel is morally superior to its Arab neighbors. Please provide them if you know of any. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137.md?page=20)