# Operation Pillar of Cloud -- Gaza Under Siege **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 15, 2012, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137 "2012-11-15T22:17:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 12:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/41 "2012-11-16T12:19:48Z")
I’m sorry - I don’t understand your metaphor. ---
**Author:** ![Latro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a87d85/32.png) [@Latro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Latro)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/42 "2012-11-16T12:38:31Z")
Does Tel Aviv have one of those shield thingies? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 12:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/43 "2012-11-16T12:48:43Z")
I think so. ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/44 "2012-11-16T13:04:26Z")
Shield thingies? ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/45 "2012-11-16T13:07:16Z")
Shit, I’ve got friends in the Deir al-Balah UNRWA camp. (Medical volunteers.) Anyone know if that area’s getting hit? ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Colossus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dr.colossus/32/9423_2.png) [@Dr.Colossus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Colossus)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 1:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/46 "2012-11-16T13:14:02Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Another siren. Heard an explosion this time - don’t know if it was a hit or an interception. stay safe and keep us posted. i have friends there but they are beyond the green line and are fighting their own battles. crazy that you are living through this right now. godspeed. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/47 "2012-11-16T13:55:32Z")
I was looking at the CNN map today and it struck me as to how _tiny_ the whole place is. A rocket with 70 km range can strike TelAviv from Gaza. I have to drive that far just to get to court. Seriously the place absolutely dima-fucking-nutive. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 2:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/48 "2012-11-16T14:04:19Z")
It might be preferable for Israel to hold back on a full-scale invasion for more than the obvious reasons, such as the current situation with Iran. Nothing the Iranians would like better than for Israel to get embroiled in a mess in Gaza, providing a reason to get Muslims in the region riled up and distracting attention from Iran’s nuclear program. ---
**Author:** ![BrokenBriton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@BrokenBriton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrokenBriton)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/49 "2012-11-16T14:21:19Z")
How many days of campaigning are there left in the election? ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/50 "2012-11-16T15:12:26Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > In any event, rockets weren’t mentioned because it was [**Israel who broke the truce**](http://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/how-israel-shattered-gaza-truce-leading-escalating-death-and-tragedy-timeline). I have no dog in this fight, but have you considered maybe finding a slightly more objective source? ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/51 "2012-11-16T15:16:18Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > I was looking at the CNN map today and it struck me as to how _tiny_ the whole place is. A rocket with 70 km range can strike TelAviv from Gaza. I have to drive that far just to get to court. Seriously the place absolutely dima-fucking-nutive. Isn’t Israel about the size of Connecticut? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/52 "2012-11-16T15:23:35Z")
> [@BrokenBriton](#): > > How many days of campaigning are there left in the election? You’ve made your point, and if you keep doing this it’s going to look like trolling. Stop now. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/53 "2012-11-16T17:03:34Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I have no dog in this fight, but have you considered maybe finding a slightly more objective source? That particular timeline has been cited by a number of other publications (such as The Guardian & Telegraph) as the most accurate account of events. As you can see it is fully cited and ends with a statement by [**Reuters**](http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/11/14/us-palestinians-israel-violence-idUSBRE8AD0V920121114) which comes to the same conclusion. That said, yes, I can give you additional sources, essentially providing the same sequence of events: –[**Reformatting Palestine**](http://jacobinmag.com/2012/11/reformatting-palestine/) –[**Israel’s Latest Assault on Gaza: The Lie of Who Started It**](http://antiwar.com/blog/2012/11/11/israels-latest-assault-on-gaza-the-lie-of-who-started-it/) ---
**Author:** ![Tristan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tristan/32/18058_2.png) [@Tristan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tristan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/54 "2012-11-16T17:10:48Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > I have no dog in this fight, but have you considered maybe finding a slightly more objective source? He really can’t. **RedFury** believes that Israel should just put up with random rocket fire into their cities, and any attempt to stop that is bloodthirsty warmongering. The Palestinians are not to blame, at all, for anything they do. It’s all Israel’s fault. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/55 "2012-11-16T17:40:27Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > That said, yes, I can give you additional sources, essentially providing the same sequence of events: > > –[**Reformatting Palestine**](http://jacobinmag.com/2012/11/reformatting-palestine/) > > –[**Israel’s Latest Assault on Gaza: The Lie of Who Started It**](http://antiwar.com/blog/2012/11/11/israels-latest-assault-on-gaza-the-lie-of-who-started-it/) None of those are objective sources, man. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/56 "2012-11-16T18:47:50Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > None of those are objective sources, man. There are no objective sources wrt to this issue unfortunately. Except perhaps Chinese State TV. And the BBC. [QUOTE=John Mace] Isn’t Israel about the size of Connecticut? [/QUOTE] No idea how big Connecticut is. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/57 "2012-11-16T18:50:25Z")
In terms of size Israel is usually compared to New Jersey: 8,019 square miles to 8,729 sq mi. Which means New Jersey is actually almost 10 percent larger. But that’s much closer than Connecticut (5,544 sq mi). ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/58 "2012-11-16T18:54:36Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > There are no objective sources wrt to this issue unfortunately. Except perhaps Chinese State TV. And the BBC. Ha! Funny. ---
**Author:** ![RedFury](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/ec9cab/32.png) [@RedFury](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RedFury)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 7:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/59 "2012-11-16T19:01:07Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > None of those are objective sources, man. If you challenge them, cite please. ---
**Author:** ![Malthus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Malthus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malthus)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2012, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137/60 "2012-11-16T19:14:30Z")
> [@RedFury](#): > > If you challenge them, cite please. You are claiming these cites of yours as unbiased? You are joking, right? 😃 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/operation-pillar-of-cloud-gaza-under-siege/641137.md?page=4)