# Opinion poll - Dem nomination: Who will win. Why? Result? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 3, 2008, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063 "2008-02-03T04:34:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/41 "2008-02-05T14:38:37Z")
[QUOTE=Shodan] No, just general incompetence by Carter. He was in over his head, and it took him a while to realize it. [/QUOTE] The only thing I can ever hold against Carter is making the election of Ronald There’s a Free Lunch And We’re Going to Eat It Reagan possible. Treating other nations with repect- what a novel idea! Too bad Reagan and Bush II couldn’t grasp it. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/42 "2008-02-05T15:22:45Z")
[QUOTE=BobLibDem] Treating other nations with repect- what a novel idea! [/QUOTE] Well, if you define “botching a rescue operation” as “treating Iran with respect”… And of course, the whole “[warrantless wiretapping](http://thinkprogress.org/2005/12/20/drudge-fact-check/)” thing that the peanut farmer started. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/43 "2008-02-05T15:34:06Z")
[QUOTE=Shodan] Well, if you define “botching a rescue operation” as “treating Iran with respect”… And of course, the whole “[warrantless wiretapping](http://thinkprogress.org/2005/12/20/drudge-fact-check/)” thing that the peanut farmer started. [/QUOTE] I was thinking more in terms of the Panama Canal treaty. Had the rescue gone as planned, Carter would have won a second term. Sometimes discretion is the better part of valor. He could have started a war over it but didn’t . As a result, nobody died. ---
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/44 "2008-02-05T15:42:08Z")
Of course, regardless of what you think about Carter, dubya makes him look like frikkin’ Jed Bartlett. I proudly cast my vote for Obama. I am sick of being extorted by insiders who tell me, “trust me, I know how to work the system”. I don’t want to get health care for everyone in the same way that I get a speeding ticket fixed. I want transparency in government, I want accountability from the executive. Obama shows me that he has respect for the necessity of both. That may be idealistic, it may be naive. But God help me at this point I am willing to risk it. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/45 "2008-02-05T15:46:26Z")
[QUOTE=BobLibDem] Had the rescue gone as planned, Carter would have won a second term. [/quote] Well, if my aunt had balls, she’d be my uncle. But she doesn’t, and neither did Carter. > [@](#): > > Sometimes discretion is the better part of valor. But incompetence never is. > [@](#): > > He could have started a war over it but didn’t. As a result, nobody died. I’m afraid you’re wrong about [that.](http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/april/25/newsid_2503000/2503899.stm) Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![burundi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3ec8ea/32.png) [@burundi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/burundi)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/46 "2008-02-05T15:53:12Z")
I _want_ Obama to win, but my gut tells me that Clinton will squeak by with the nomination. McCain will then wipe the floor with Clinton in the national election. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/47 "2008-02-05T15:55:31Z")
[QUOTE=Shodan] I’m afraid you’re wrong about [that.](http://news.bbc.co.uk/onthisday/hi/dates/stories/april/25/newsid_2503000/2503899.stm) [/QUOTE] OK, I stand corrected. Eight died. Still he’s a piker compared to W. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/48 "2008-02-05T16:06:59Z")
“Still not as bad as Bush”. The SDMB’s ultimate _tu quoque_. For the rest of time, or eighteen months after a Republican takes the White House, whichever comes first. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/49 "2008-02-05T16:10:23Z")
Give me a president who tries to negotiate and winds up with a failed rescue attempt vs. one the calls other nations evil and shoots first and asks questions later. ---
**Author:** ![stolichnaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bcef8e/32.png) [@stolichnaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stolichnaya)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/50 "2008-02-05T16:12:21Z")
Carter really should have taken a closer look at those helicopters. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 4:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/51 "2008-02-05T16:13:22Z")
I still don’t see how Obama is supposed to resemble Carter, except for the Beltway-outsider factor. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/52 "2008-02-05T16:16:02Z")
**Quartz** and **Anduril** , knock off the name-calling and ratchet back the hostility. (As it happens, the specific rules against attacks in **GD** relate to other posters, not off-board third parties, but when it starts to go personal, here, or is used to simply raise hackles we don’t need it, here, either.) [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![AHunter3](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ahunter3/32/368_2.png) [@AHunter3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AHunter3)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/53 "2008-02-05T16:19:27Z")
Obama may end up getting the nomination, but any Obama supporters who are figuring he’s got it nailed have no idea just how much slogging remains ahead of him if he’s going to do so. Similarly, anyone predicting a sweeping McCain victory in November if Clinton does get the Dem nom should question whether they are seriously underestimating Clinton the politician. ---
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/54 "2008-02-05T16:54:12Z")
Apparently, Hillary’s already thrown in the towel in both [Kansas and North Dakota](http://ruralvotes.com/thefield/). > [@](#): > > The Associated Press has an interesting find: > > ``` > TOPEKA, Kan. (AP) — The co-chairman of Hillary Rodham Clinton’s presidential campaign in Kansas predicted Monday that she wouldn’t win its Democratic caucuses because of the resources put into the state by rival candidate Barack Obama… > > “This is truly, tomorrow night, going to be a David-and-Goliath event, and Senator Clinton is the David,” he said. “We know that we are going to be dramatically outnumbered on people — there’s no doubt about it.” > > ``` > > Translation: He’s complaining about “the resources put into the state by rival candidate” when his own candidate raised almost $100 million dollars last year? The heartland story of tonight won’t just be that one candidate reached out to rural voters, but that another candidate chose not to. > > Update: Bloomberg reports that Clinton has written off North Dakota as well. I’m still predicting an Obama blowout in the Primary that few saw coming, and a comfortable win in the General. ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/55 "2008-02-05T17:02:27Z")
[QUOTE=AHunter3] Obama may end up getting the nomination, but any Obama supporters who are figuring he’s got it nailed have no idea just how much slogging remains ahead of him if he’s going to do so. Similarly, anyone predicting a sweeping McCain victory in November if Clinton does get the Dem nom should question whether they are seriously underestimating Clinton the politician. [/QUOTE] I’m with ya **Shayna** and so are tens of thousands of other like minded folk. BTW - He was ELECTRIFYING last night in Hartford. He packed the entire stadium to standing room only. People cheered for 10 minutes before letting him speak. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Onomatopoeia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/onomatopoeia/32/4145_2.png) [@Onomatopoeia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Onomatopoeia)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/56 "2008-02-05T17:10:13Z")
Sadly, I have to admit I’m one of those who believes Clinton will win the democratic nomination, and then be eviscerated by McCain in the GE. In addition, the insane vitriol against Clinton is palpable in the republican party base which, as someone else mentioned, will mobilize like never before in opposition to a Hillary presidency. Unfortunately, I think we’re looking at four more years of a republican presidency, even though McCain will gravitate back to the center once he has the nomination locked up and will be ultimately deemed palatable by many democrats and independents. As others have said, I hope I’m wrong, as I believe Obama can beat McCain. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/57 "2008-02-05T18:02:17Z")
[But at least the Dems are united . . .](http://action.credomobile.com/comics/2008/01/with_us_or_against_us.html) ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/58 "2008-02-05T18:38:53Z")
I’m not worried in the least about November, no matter which Dem wins the nomination. In a much less favorable environment four years ago, and while being a weaker candidate than either of these two, Kerry lost to Bush nationally by 2.5% of the vote. I think either one of them will be a nontrivial improvement over Kerry. ---
**Author:** ![tds1273](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/df705f/32.png) [@tds1273](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tds1273)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/59 "2008-02-05T19:52:05Z")
[QUOTE=Phlosphr] I’m with ya **Shayna** and so are tens of thousands of other like minded folk. BTW - He was ELECTRIFYING last night in Hartford. He packed the entire stadium to standing room only. People cheered for 10 minutes before letting him speak. 😃 [/QUOTE] Damn, and I thought I was fortunate enough to catch it live on C-Span. I have a feeling you’ll be telling your young’uns about that night for a long time. I’ve caught just about all of his appearances on C-Span and noticed that he broke in some new material last night. When he broke down the ‘okey-doke’ or when, just before he went into the hope part of his speech, he went point by point in welcoming a debate against Mccain. He was on fire last night, he was even interacting with the crowd more so than usual. How were you able to get in? Did you have to buy or earn tickets or just get in line early enough? So jealous… ---
**Author:** ![Phlosphr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c68b51/32.png) [@Phlosphr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phlosphr)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2008, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063/60 "2008-02-05T20:02:51Z")
[QUOTE=tds1273] Damn, and I thought I was fortunate enough to catch it live on C-Span. I have a feeling you’ll be telling your young’uns about that night for a long time. I’ve caught just about all of his appearances on C-Span and noticed that he broke in some new material last night. When he broke down the ‘okey-doke’ or when, just before he went into the hope part of his speech, he went point by point in welcoming a debate against Mccain. He was on fire last night, he was even interacting with the crowd more so than usual. How were you able to get in? Did you have to buy or earn tickets or just get in line early enough? So jealous… [/QUOTE] Campaigning for him from day one in CT got us campaign passes…we worked the event as much as attended. I’ll tell you one thing that I am already sure you know, if he get’s the nom we were witnessing the next president last night. 😃 ROCK ON BARACK! It’s interesting, I have not bee this fired up about a candidate ever in an election, I’m a 30-something so I haven’t had a great pool of people to vote for. Bill Clinton was the last person I voted for who I really enjoyed. I have nothing much against he or his wife personally, but there is no way I’d cast my vote for her, no way no how. I want to be inspired, I want to know my president is going to work for me and my family, I want to understand him when he speaks on television. Barack is under NO misconceptions that he will have it easy when in office, as a matter of fact he knows he got a shit load of cleaning up to do. I trust him to do it. I do not trust Hilary to run this country. We are all democrats in this race, I understand that, but Obama is a representative for me of a 21st century president - and I can’t wait to see the battleground after today and acerss what falls out from this primary. I do believe he is going to do quite well across the country. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-dem-nomination-who-will-win-why-result/436063.md?page=4)