# Opinion Poll: what downsides do you think restricting guns have? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 16, 2020, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047 "2020-02-16T21:46:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![purplehorseshoe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/purplehorseshoe/32/2996_2.png) [@purplehorseshoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/purplehorseshoe)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 12:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/41 "2020-02-18T12:01:44Z")
> [@Tempe\_Jeff](#): > > How about a waiting period and FBI background check for voting too? Amend the Constitution if you want to restrict rights guaranteed by said document. I believe there’s currently an 18-year waiting period as it is. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 12:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/42 "2020-02-18T12:12:18Z")
> [@Tempe\_Jeff](#): > > How about a waiting period and FBI background check for voting too? Amend the Constitution if you want to restrict rights guaranteed by said document. I’ve just about had it with all these damn voters killing kids in our schools, churches, and synagogues. ---
**Author:** ![JRDelirious](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jrdelirious/32/9531_2.png) [@JRDelirious](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JRDelirious)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/43 "2020-02-18T12:38:01Z")
> [@Tempe\_Jeff](#): > > How about a waiting period and FBI background check for voting too? Amend the Constitution if you want to restrict rights guaranteed by said document. For over two centuries there has not been one right that has been absolutely, unconditionally, free of any limits whatsoever regardless of circumstance. At best, legislatures and courts have said, “oh, THAT is not included in what freedom of (whatever) means” (see: libel; polygamy; sawed off shotguns; etc) or have recognized exigent circumstance - sometimes unjustly, but they have. Anyway for those two centuries \*it was never the general norm everywhere \*for everyone to be maximally armed 24/7 everywhere they set step. And that includes what many call the Good Old Days. OTOH as **Chronos** mentions it is not an absolute all-or-nothing proposition. (Although at both ends of the spectrum some have given hints of that: at least in the matter of state by state legislation, there are pro-gunners for instance who have advocated total interstate reciprocity which would mean the laws of the least restrictive state would trump everyone else’s, and anti-s have OTOH sought to use federal preemptions whenever they can, and some of their leaders stated they do want total removal of some arms from civilian private hands; some Pro-s who have taken positions that their gun toting overrides a private owner’s entitlement to say what goes inside their property; and so on and so forth. ) ---
**Author:** ![Isamu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/7c8e57/32.png) [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 1:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/44 "2020-02-18T13:16:36Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Who says it’s only going to be a punch that you need to protect yourself from? No. Velocity said that “people…would have no means of self defense.” I hear that same phrase said a lot in these kinds of threads, and it’s just wrong. I would prefer the discussion to be free from hyperbole and free from factually incorrect slogans. That’s all. ---
**Author:** ![Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a87d85/32.png) [@Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tired_and_Cranky)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/45 "2020-02-18T15:40:38Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Defensive gun use can prevent crime, but I don’t know how much of it that it prevents. I mean, it’s literally true that defensive gun use may prevent some crime but it might also be true that gun use that users consider defensive are really just crimes. Research shows that policies intended to promote defensive gun use tend to increase crime. For instance, there is no evidence that stand your ground laws reduce violent crime but there is evidence that they increase homicides. [https://www.rand.org/research/gun-policy/analysis/stand-your-ground/violent-crime.html](https://www.rand.org/research/gun-policy/analysis/stand-your-ground/violent-crime.html) > **[Stand Your Ground Laws, Homicides, and Injuries](https://www.nber.org/papers/w18187)** > > Founded in 1920, the NBER is a private, non-profit, non-partisan organization dedicated to conducting economic research and to disseminating research findings among academics, public policy makers, and business professionals. > [@JRDelirious](#): > > OTOH as **Chronos** mentions it is not an absolute all-or-nothing proposition. (Although at both ends of the spectrum some have given hints of that: at least in the matter of state by state legislation, there are pro-gunners for instance who have advocated total interstate reciprocity which would mean the laws of the least restrictive state would trump everyone else’s, and anti-s have OTOH sought to use federal preemptions whenever they can, and some of their leaders stated they do want total removal of some arms from civilian private hands; some Pro-s who have taken positions that their gun toting overrides a private owner’s entitlement to say what goes inside their property; and so on and so forth. ) Second amendment absolutists should be appalled at the idea of interstate reciprocity for the carrying of firearms. The second amendment was intended to allow states to provide themselves an armed militia. Such a militia is useful for states to resist the power of the federal government or that of other states. The founders would roll over in their graves at the idea that a federal law could empower California to send three million armed troops to Wyoming and Wyoming law could do nothing to stop it. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/46 "2020-02-18T15:44:51Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Not only does it depend on what the restrictions are; it depends on how they come about. If, somehow, in America as it is today, a bare majority of anti-gun politicians got elected and immediately passed the most restrictive gun control laws they could, then the result would be that a lot of them would lose their next election and the laws they passed would be repealed. What would make a difference would be if education and research progressed to the point where the substantial majority of the people wanted those restrictions, and then elected representatives accordingly. We need to change the culture before we can change the laws. That’s how it _should_ work, but the progressive left seems to think more like a revolutionary elite. Making decisions based on what the [del]proles[/del] people want is the opposite of their m.o.; in this case, weaning America off the “gun culture” according to some. And there’s an extreme asymmetry to passing vs. repealing laws, almost a one-way ratchet: once something’s illegal, the law stays on the books by sheer inertia, since government has almost no institutional interest in controlling fewer things. Would marijuana have been made illegal at any time since 1970 if it hadn’t been already? ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/47 "2020-02-18T18:06:54Z")
> [@Tired\_and\_Cranky](#): > > The founders would roll over in their graves at the idea that a federal law could empower California to send three million armed troops to Wyoming and Wyoming law could do nothing to stop it. I think I’m missing something here. ---
**Author:** ![Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a87d85/32.png) [@Tired\_and\_Cranky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tired_and_Cranky)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2020, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/48 "2020-02-18T21:17:24Z")
The second amendment is about preserving states’ ability to maintain a militia, right? It’s right in the text. “A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.” It’s for the prevention of tyranny and all that. But a new federal law is passed. It says that if any state allows you to carry a weapon in its borders, you can carry that weapon in any other state, regardless of that second state’s laws to the contrary. That’s how reciprocity would work. The state can’t pass a law that prohibits you from carrying that weapon there. So California passes a law issuing carry permits to members of its militia. It grants two million such permits, buys them guns, and pays them to occupy Wyoming. Wyoming is stuck with two million armed Californians in its borders and it has no legal remedy unless they break some other law. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2020, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/49 "2020-02-19T06:03:15Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > But will we further empower it? > > Aren’t most people hostile to gun control already republicans? of the ones who aren’t, do you think they’ll switch over and become republicans? Do you know which “candidate” has won almost every single Presidential election? I’m speaking of the candidate who beat Reagan in the 1984 “landslide.” **Did.Not.Vote.** Did.Not.Vote even edged out LBJ (barely) in the 1964 landslide. American elections are not about changing people’s minds. The people too stupid to pick a Party are going to vote based on hair style, or Facebook jokes. The reason not to get gun nuts riled up, is NOT the fear that they may stop voting rationally — that’s not an option. **It’s the fear they may _vote at all_.** ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2020, 6:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/50 "2020-02-19T06:10:15Z")
> [@MacTech](#): > > … My AR (that may or may not exist, or may or may not been lost in a “Tragic Boating Accident” is not harming anyone … Many gun lovers have signaled they will commit a felony by lying to the authorities if government exercises its legal right to ban guns. In the Age of Fake Facts, _Everybody’s a Constitutional Lawyer._ 🆒 Tell me, do you stand under a gold-fringed flag when you lie to the police? The gun lovers pretend to be about law and order. But then they brag about how they’ll turn felon when Hillary comes for their Gunzzz! Bah! ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2020, 12:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/51 "2020-02-19T12:51:00Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Many gun lovers have signaled they will commit a felony by lying to the authorities if government exercises its legal right to ban guns. In the Age of Fake Facts, _Everybody’s a Constitutional Lawyer._ 🆒 Tell me, do you stand under a gold-fringed flag when you lie to the police? > > The gun lovers pretend to be about law and order. But then they brag about how they’ll turn felon when Hillary comes for their Gunzzz! Bah! You’re saying that anything- anything whatsoever- should be obeyed if it somehow gets duly passed as a law? ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [February 19, 2020, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/52 "2020-02-19T21:44:56Z")
I believe defensive gun use rarely makes the news but vastly outnumbers offensive uses. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/53 "2020-02-21T07:40:27Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > I live in a country where a violent felon with gang affiliations can send his girlfriend into a gun store, have her buy a gun and then she gives it to him in the parking lot. You do not live in such a country. What you describe is in violation of several federal laws. Or do you mean that they can get away with doing that despite the law against it? Isn’t that one of the main complaints by the pro-gun side? That law abiding citizens will obey the law, but gang members and their girlfriends will continue to own and use guns despite the prohibition? ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/54 "2020-02-21T07:48:03Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Indeed. I don’t hear too many people advocating for prohibiting Americans from keeping a handgun in their home for self defense or owning a rifle or shotgun for the hunting. > (actually, I don’t hear \*anyone \*advocating for restrictions like that, but I’m sure someone somewhere has proposed it) That is exactly the prohibition (a complete handgun ban) that was at issue in Heller. Four Justices of the Supreme Court believed it to be a proper ban as did Barack Obama and all of those on the left. Chicago had a similar ban as did many surrounding cities and if not for Heller and McDonald would continue to have those bans. This is an alternate universe where a handgun ban is just an outrageous idea that hardly anyone proposes. Many did and would continue to do so if not ruled unconstitutional. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/55 "2020-02-21T09:59:13Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > I believe defensive gun use rarely makes the news but vastly outnumbers offensive uses. Unfortunately this is not necessarily a good thing. Without gun control, you have offensive gun use. Here in the UK we have almost zero defensive gun uses. You’re not allowed a handgun and can only have a shotgun for other reasons (e.g. shooting vermin in the country.) We also have zero school shootings. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/56 "2020-02-21T10:37:56Z")
> [@MacTech](#): > > Unless you qualify under the conditions of a “Disqualified person”, current laws are sufficient, other than that, Shall Not Be Infringed! This. In fact, I’ll go one step further and say the current laws are too restrictive when it comes to gun rights. I would _love_ to get rid of NFA 34 and GCA 68, and once again buy a Thompson submachine gun mail-order through Sears. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/57 "2020-02-21T13:39:30Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > In fact, I’ll go one step further and say the current laws are too restrictive when it comes to gun rights. I would _love_ to get rid of NFA 34 and GCA 68, and once again buy a Thompson submachine gun mail-order through Sears. What would you use it for? (I’m asking because the thread asks “What downsides do you think restricting guns have?” What are the downsides to you of not being able to order and own a Thompson submachine gun?) ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 1:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/58 "2020-02-21T13:55:40Z")
> [@glee](#): > > Unfortunately this is not necessarily a good thing. > Without gun control, you have offensive gun use. > > Here in the UK we have almost zero defensive gun uses. You’re not allowed a handgun and can only have a shotgun for other reasons (e.g. shooting vermin in the country.) > We also have zero school shootings. You do seem to have a [problem with knives,](https://www.google.com/search?q=london+attack+knife&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-b-1-ab) though. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 1:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/59 "2020-02-21T13:57:29Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > What would you use it for? > > (I’m asking because the thread asks “What downsides do you think restricting guns have?” What are the downsides to you of not being able to order and own a Thompson submachine gun?) It would be fun as hell to shoot, although I couldn’t afford to very often. Downside? Gangsters don’t have them any more is as upside. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [February 21, 2020, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047/60 "2020-02-21T14:02:14Z")
> [@Lumpy](#): > > You’re saying that anything- anything whatsoever- should be obeyed if it somehow gets duly passed as a law? If gun nuts want “We obey laws we like and disobey laws we don’t” as their party platform, that’s fine. Whateverness. But in that case, might it be a teensy bit hypocritical to call their party the Law-and-Order Party? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinion-poll-what-downsides-do-you-think-restricting-guns-have/848047.md?page=4)