# Opinions or beliefs that you suspect some people secretly hold **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 15, 2016, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396 "2016-06-15T03:48:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/21 "2016-06-15T17:12:10Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > I believe that most people are significantly more racist than they’re willing to publicly admit. Everyone’s a little bit racist, sometimes Doesn’t mean we go around committing hate crimes Look around and you will find No one’s really color blind [/Princeton & Kate Monster, AvenueQ] ---
**Author:** ![Riemann](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/riemann/32/3133_2.png) [@Riemann](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Riemann)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/22 "2016-06-15T18:21:24Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > \*\* > 1#. \*\*I believe that a substantial number of people - on the political right and left - secretly desire eugenics-based population reduction. I don’t mean that they want genocide of the “Shove them in a gas chamber with Zyklon B” variety so much as I mean that if they had a magic button that would make “undesirable” people in the world disappear, they’d press it. > > So, for instance, some liberals would push a button to make conservatives, pro-lifers, creationists, MRAs, etc. disappear, while some conservatives would push a button to make liberals, gays, pro-choicers, blacks, etc. disappear. And some liberals \*and \*conservatives would push a button to make Down Syndrome or low-IQ or ugly people disappear. If I understand you correctly, I would _openly_ embrace this. As far as I’m concerned this isn’t about eugenics, because I don’t want to get rid of any trait that’s genetically determined. Most of the characteristics that you describe are political and social attitudes that are largely culturally determined. So, if you’re describing a desire to magically accelerate the amelioration of undesirable human cultural values, then I’m all for it. The broad trend through history is that humans have become less violent, more tolerant and more rational. Cultural shifts happen in part by changing hearts in minds with better ideas, but also in part through the death of each older generation with their inferior moral ideas. Some children will reject their parents’ inferior values anyway, and we will make progress with each generation. But in some fantasy world where I’m omnipotent ruler, if I could magically make the most evil of today’s bigots suddenly and painlessly vanish to accelerate the process, sure why not. It’s not difficult to make human beings. Let’s replace them with some better ones. In a sense, this isn’t even that much of a fantasy: to the extent that the Second World War was about opposing Nazi ideology (and I know this is an overly-idealistic view of matters), we set out to kill or imprison those with the most poisonous cultural values. To take a topical example, the modern world is in the early stages (considered globally) of a change in attitudes toward sexual orientation and gender identity that is as fundamental as the historical changes in attitudes toward slavery. As the hypothetical omnipotent ruler, I would not presume to try to tell each new generation of human beings what to think. But I’d sure as hell relish the opportunity to have every member of the next generation grow up in a cultural environment where they learn to form opinions based on tolerance, compassion and respect for evidence. A few of those new humans might still decide that bigotry is the way to go, but I’d bet that cutting the cord of culturally-transmitted bigotry would send anti-LGBT attitudes the way of slavery. ---
**Author:** ![iamthewalrus\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/258eb7/32.png) [@iamthewalrus\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iamthewalrus_3)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/23 "2016-06-15T23:14:03Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > \*\*3#. \*\* I believe that a substantial number of people would prefer tyranny over democracy if that tyranny were to their political liking - namely, that some conservatives hanker for a right-wing regime and some liberals hanker for a left-wing regime. Probably true. If you make it specific enough, I think it’s not even a secret belief. How many people wouldn’t accept the position of God-King for life? Tyranny be me would be exactly to my political liking. ---
**Author:** ![Linty\_Fresh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Linty\_Fresh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Linty_Fresh)\ **Post date:** [June 15, 2016, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/24 "2016-06-15T23:33:29Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > I guess because I’m open about my atheistic views, many people have confided in me that they attend church out of habit, because they don’t want to displease relatives, or because they have no other social life. Yeah, I agree with this. A well-run church is a powerful social tool, and it can get a lot of stuff done, both for better and for worse. It also offers structure, and if you’re, say, a recovering addict from a troubled childhood, that structure can really help. This is the reason why I don’t have a problem with organized religion in general, even as an atheist. My wife and I are childless by choice. I believe that the slight majority of Americans who have children regret it just a little. Or maybe a lot, but they’ll never ever admit it. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/25 "2016-06-16T00:37:29Z")
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > Probably true. If you make it specific enough, I think it’s not even a secret belief. > > How many people wouldn’t accept the position of God-King for life? Tyranny be me would be exactly to my political liking. Yeah. Although what I was getting at was more to the effect of - many people have an innate desire to persecute those they dislike or disagree with. I think many people, if given the power, would gladly imprison or execute people of opposing political beliefs or a dislikable personality. I don’t think modern-day American society is, in terms of inward beliefs, all that different from the guillotine era of the French Revolution. People have been persecuting and jailing and executing each other for millennia. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/26 "2016-06-16T00:38:53Z")
> [@pullin](#): > > I suspect the number of “butts in pews” on Sunday far exceeds the number of real believers. No way to prove this, but I’d wager that for a significant number of people, religion is a real life version of “The Emperor’s New Clothes.” > Disclaimer: Atheist here - No dog in this fight. Definitely agree. There are many people, especially in America, who claim to be Christians but aren’t. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 1:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/27 "2016-06-16T01:46:24Z")
Whatever nasty and highly unacceptable beliefs you cynically believe _some_ people secretly hold, there are no doubt some people around who actually _do_ hold those beliefs. And if there are people around who actually do hold those nasty and highly unacceptable beliefs, then no doubt there will be some who do so openly and make no secret of it. Proof by example: Westboro Baptist Church. Not to mention [this guy](https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/acts-of-faith/wp/2016/06/14/pastor-refuses-to-mourn-orlando-victims-the-tragedy-is-that-more-of-them-didnt-die/), of whom you’ve probably read recently. (Warning: NSFA – Not Suitable for America.) ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Ace](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/6bbea6/32.png) [@Johnny\_Ace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Ace)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/28 "2016-06-16T01:53:53Z")
> [@iamthewalrus\_3](#): > > Probably true. If you make it specific enough, I think it’s not even a secret belief. > > How many people wouldn’t accept the position of God-King for life? Tyranny be me would be exactly to my political liking. The Aztecs did that. Only problem was, life was one year. ---
**Author:** ![spamforbrains](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e274bd/32.png) [@spamforbrains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/spamforbrains)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 2:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/29 "2016-06-16T02:04:01Z")
> [@](#): > > I believe that there are white men who, when put into a room with men of non-white ethnicity and women of all ethnicities, would believe that they are the only fully human being in a room full of animals. I believe this to be the reason behind intractable racism and sexism. Fully agree. Not all white men, but a certain percentage of them, perhaps as much as one-third think non-white people are subhuman. And a quite significant number of men of any color think women aren’t human, percentage varying by culture but never even approaching zero in any culture. In the US, based on their behavior, I think well over 50% of men don’t think women are actually people. I think most people don’t really believe in anything much or understand much and kind of just get by day to day by reacting to momentary stimuli, doing what comes easiest at that moment, and following old habits. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/30 "2016-06-16T02:25:19Z")
I think most people’s views are motivated by fear and pain more than they would ever admit. I’ve seen people, particularly the ones with the most abhorrent views, bend over backward to appear unaffected and unemotional. I know I’m more emotional than the average human, but I’m not buying the ‘‘I’m so calm and rational’’ facade. For one thing, the evidence doesn’t support it. Social psych research indicates that humans make ethical judgments based on gut instinct and rationalize post-facto. Humans filter information by clinging extra hard to stuff that reinforces our values and rejecting the stuff that doesn’t. The only thing that has ever been conclusively demonstrated to change our views is experience. That’s why I’m always trying to scratch at the facade and get to the emotional core of whatever argument a person is making. It’s just really frustrating to me when people deny that there is one, as if that would make them somehow weak, instead of human. Before experiencing the internet, I would put the number of men who view women as subhuman as like 5%. Now I’d say maybe 15%. But definitely not the majority. The majority are just confused by the conflict between the social construction of what it means to be a ‘‘woman’’ and the actual reality (which is that we’re basically the same, just growing up with a different set of expectations and social norms and _that_ is what makes us different.) Some figure that out faster than others. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 5:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/31 "2016-06-16T05:04:23Z")
> [@Linty\_Fresh](#): > > My wife and I are childless by choice. I believe that the slight majority of Americans who have children regret it just a little. Or maybe a lot, but they’ll never ever admit it. People who do regret having children aren’t as secretive as they think they are. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/32 "2016-06-16T14:24:07Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > Oh, I definitely know that, and I’m Christian. There are also a lot of people who do it to impress the neighbors, or to see and be seen (although maybe not as much of that now as in past generations). I know many people who do it while the children are small, as part of the whole “teach them our culture” thing, and/or because they want to avoid those situations where some families that never set foot in church have the kids take first Communion. “My children will choose whether to take Communion or not, and whether to have the party or not, but I want them to know that it’s about the bread, not the banquet”. ---
**Author:** ![inedible\_knapsack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/49beb7/32.png) [@inedible\_knapsack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/inedible_knapsack)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/33 "2016-06-16T18:51:13Z")
I agree with **Spice Weasel** ’s fear/pain motivation theory, and with all the assertions that many people of faith don’t truly have any faith. I disagree that a significant number of white men consider other races or women “sub-human.” Racism and sexism today are more complex than they were, say, 200 years ago, whether we want to admit it or not. I’d say that _some_ white men secretly feel that their place in the world, their manhood, their identity, their culture, are being threatened. This is a new and scary feeling for white guys, and fear being an unacceptable feeling for men, they translate it to anger. I’ve heard a few racist tirades, and it seems to me that most of them are just afraid of being blamed for all the world’s ills (even if white guys are responsible for all the world’s ills, for which a pretty good case can be made). In short, the common, simplistic refrain that white men believe themselves to be superior by nature and therefore resent women and minorities rings hollow. It seems more likely that lower class white men, those who have watched their opportunities and overall societal value shrink over the last couple of generations, do not relish also being accused of making life hard for everyone else because they happen to be white and male. I’ve even heard a few white guys comment that they never cared about race until the Black Lives Matter movement, at which point they realized that they were being targeted. ---
**Author:** ![Lowdown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c57346/32.png) [@Lowdown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lowdown)\ **Post date:** [June 16, 2016, 7:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/34 "2016-06-16T19:18:50Z")
I would be all over #1. I’d spam the hell out of that button! I do not consider it a secret. See you later anti-vaxxers, hipsters, hippies, gun nuts, homophobes, patchouli-wearers, morbidly obese people, hip-hop listeners, and people who don’t use turn signals! \ \\\\\\\\\ ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/35 "2016-06-17T19:12:12Z")
I wonder how many “Muslims” in the Middle East aren’t Muslims but can’t leave because of the apostasy-means-death penalty. ---
**Author:** ![drewder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/57b2e6/32.png) [@drewder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drewder)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/36 "2016-06-17T22:54:25Z")
> [@pullin](#): > > I suspect the number of “butts in pews” on Sunday far exceeds the number of real believers. No way to prove this, but I’d wager that for a significant number of people, religion is a real life version of “The Emperor’s New Clothes.” > Disclaimer: Atheist here - No dog in this fight. I suspect this is a belief held by most atheists. It’s basically the idea that religious people are all hypocrites and secretly have no more belief in God than they do ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [June 17, 2016, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/37 "2016-06-17T23:33:59Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > \*\*2#. \*\* I believe that a substantial number of people care more about animals than humans, and would save an animal life over a human life, or even many human lives. I don’t think this is a “secret” belief at all - look at the brouhaha in the news over Cecil the Lion and the outrage on social media whenever anything hunting related comes up (particularly outside the US). I think a significant number of people openly, genuinely think animals are far more important than people. And that’s without getting into people who treat their pets like literal children. > [@Lowdown](#): > > I would be all over #1. I’d spam the hell out of that button! I do not consider it a secret. > > See you later anti-vaxxers, hipsters, hippies, **gun nuts** , homophobes, patchouli-wearers, morbidly obese people, hip-hop listeners, and people who don’t use turn signals! \ (Bolding mine) Look, I get you’re (at least partially) joking here, but one of the big issues with the “Disappear people I don’t like” school of thought (and I admit it has a lot of attractive elements) is that eventually you run into someone who fits into your “Undesirable Element” category who is otherwise a good person. It’s easy to dismiss gun enthusiasts and backwards rednecks, for example, but it’s not accurate. You’d be surprised how many doctors, accountants, emergency services workers, mums, dads and otherwise completely “normal”, educated people have a strong interest in firearms. “Sure, well, Bob’s a life-saving heart surgeon who often works pro-bono in impoverished areas, but he also owns several guns and he likes hunting, so off to Room 101 with him!” is, I would suggest, I pretty good example of the law of unintended consequences. Anyway, getting back on track, I think rather a lot of people who want anything remotely fun banned (alcohol, porn, guns, drugs, tobacco, consensual sex acts etc) are also labouring under the misapprehension that if such a ban happens, they will have an exception to the ban, because of reasons. It’s less about “making the world safer/better” and more about “not wanting other people to have more fun than they are”. ---
**Author:** ![P-man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/p-man/32/3606_2.png) [@P-man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/P-man)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2016, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/38 "2016-06-18T02:40:49Z")
> [@drewder](#): > > I suspect this is a belief held by most atheists. It’s basically the idea that religious people are all hypocrites and secretly have no more belief in God than they do I identify as Christian but, although I believe in a ground of being that I refer to as God, certainly wouldn’t say I know for sure. Also, if it were proven to me that Jesus never existed it wouldn’t change how I live my life. I see where you’re coming from, though. I’m sure a lot of people say they’re Christian out of fear. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2016, 3:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/39 "2016-06-18T03:29:41Z")
Forced sterilization of people who have multiple children they cannot support. Nobody would ever say it above a whisper, but I would bet a very significant minority would be in favor of it. ---
**Author:** ![Textual\_Innuendo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/898d66/32.png) [@Textual\_Innuendo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Textual_Innuendo)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2016, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396/40 "2016-06-18T21:04:14Z")
Not even much of a secret, but people believe you can reliably and usefully judge economic success, moral characteristics, personal habits, amount of willpower, trustworthiness, careers, educational status, and more based on purely superficial appearance characteristics. Everything from your weight to hair style/color to clothes to tattoos to nail polish and more, enough people think that A) these somehow matter, and B) they are reliable indicators of all of the above, that they DO in fact matter, despite B) being patently false. It’s maddening and infuriating, and all the more so because I know I do it myself, despite having reams of experience and direct evidence that it’s not true. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/opinions-or-beliefs-that-you-suspect-some-people-secretly-hold/757396.md?page=3)