# OPRAH- It's Not Because You Were Black! Get the Hell Over It! (lame)
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207
**Category:** The BBQ Pit
**Created:** [June 28, 2005, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207 "2005-06-28T15:19:50Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 4
### Author:  [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/61 "2005-06-28T23:01:49Z")
Now that I think of it, didn’t the late Pope want to “beautify” Mother Teresa? Maybe the first step was sending the wrinkled old bat to Hermes . . .
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### Author:  [@Belowjob2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Belowjob2.0)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/62 "2005-06-28T23:04:43Z")
I just love it when people chime in to say that racism is all in black peoples’ heads. Oprah must be imagining things. She’s got no right to complain. (And if she doesn’t shut up, we’ll put her in her place.)
How does that Elvis Costello song go? "I used to be disgusted, but now I try to be amused… "
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### Author:  [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/63 "2005-06-28T23:11:36Z")
> [@Eve](#):
>
> Now that I think of it, didn’t the late Pope want to “beautify” Mother Teresa?
No, that was _Queer Eye for the Straight Guy_. Carson and Kyan thought it’d be a great idea for sweeps week, but unfortunately neither one was really “up” on current events.
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### Author:  [@Garfield226](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Garfield226)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/64 "2005-06-28T23:18:06Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#):
>
> I just love it when people chime in to say that racism is all in black peoples’ heads. Oprah must be imagining things. She’s got no right to complain. (And if she doesn’t shut up, we’ll put her in her place.)
Wow…I must have missed that post. Care to point it out?
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### Author:  [@Dead\_Badger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Badger)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/65 "2005-06-28T23:19:41Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#):
>
> I just love it when people chime in to say that racism is all in black peoples’ heads. Oprah must be imagining things. She’s got no right to complain. (And if she doesn’t shut up, we’ll put her in her place.)
Is this a whoosh? Who on earth said anything remotely resembling this shite?
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### Author:  [@MovieMogul](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MovieMogul)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/66 "2005-06-28T23:20:02Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#):
>
> I just love it when people chime in to say that racism is all in black peoples’ heads.
I’m sure it’ll be easy to point out where anybody in this thread made such a sweeping generalization.
> [@](#):
>
> (And if she doesn’t shut up, we’ll put her in her place.)
Ditto this.
Essentially, Oprah must think that she is so gosh-darned famous in every corner of the world that the only conceivable reason why people wouldn’t fall all over themselves to bask in her magnanimous presence is because they hate her, and the only way anyone could hate Oprah is if they hated all black people.
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### Author:  [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/67 "2005-06-28T23:22:35Z")
> [@Gangster Octopus](#):
>
> I agree, it is at this point I find the Occam’s Razor on my swiss army knife very handy.
Ockham did not intend his razor to cut false dichotomies.
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### Author:  [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/68 "2005-06-28T23:33:42Z")
> [@SkipMagic](#):
>
> The clerks recognizing Oprah is the assertion of Oprah’s spokeswoman (in your linked article). I’m not saying she’s wrong, but I haven’t seen where Hermes agrees with that.
Personnally, I’m _very surprised_ that she could have been recognized, since I stand by my comment that she’s virtually unkown, at best.
Now, maybe Hermes staff in given training in recognizing celebrities, or maybe even they just tell people they recognize them even when they don’t jut to avoid pissing them off…
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### Author:  [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)
#### Post date: [June 28, 2005, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/69 "2005-06-28T23:37:39Z")
> [@ScoobyTX](#):
>
> I can’t imagine that Oprah would be taken to be North African. .
I made the same comment in the other thread. She doesn’t look north-african to me…
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### Author:  [@Eve](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eve)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 1:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/70 "2005-06-29T01:13:44Z")
Well, Hermes might as well close up shop; no matter what actually happened, they are now labeled the KKK of Paris. From the AP:
> [@](#):
>
> Whether Oprah Winfrey was turned away from a bit of after-hours shopping in Paris because of a racist employee or a special event, news of the confrontation outside a luxury store has evoked empathy and anger from many American minorities. In living rooms and Internet chat rooms, the Winfrey case has sparked discussion of what many see as a chronic problem for minorities: poor treatment and sometimes outright suspicion of minority shoppers no matter how well-educated or rich they are - particularly in high-end stores.
>
> “The presumption in America is that if you have the wealth, you’ll get equality - but where’s Oprah’s equality?” asked Bruce D. Haynes, a sociologist at the University of California, Davis. “It picks up on every inkling of discrimination that a black person might experience in daily life.” He added: “Many people are saying, 'I don’t have the money, but Oprah represents what I could be … She’s like the black Donald Trump. And if it can happen to Oprah, it could happen to anyone.”
>
> Michael Leake, a black pharmaceutical salesman in Toledo, Ohio, knows this experience all too well. “It happens all the time,” he said. “That’s just life.” Hermes, in its treatment of Winfrey and its response, “blew it to a degree that’s hard to imagine,” he said. “It’s clearly bigoted. … Think about what this did to their business. Think about all those people who have been oppressed (by this kind of behavior) who are going to be sympathetic to Oprah and not go back there.” . . . “Puffy sends his people ahead to stores and shuts them down so he can shop privately, so this kind of thing doesn’t happen,” Wilbekin said. “I’ve worked with young people who wanted to be stylists and work in fashion and they’ve never gone into a high-end boutique … because they were afraid. They didn’t think they were allowed. What flashes in my mind are images of water fountains that say ‘whites only.’”
_Well_. So much for Hermes.
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### Author:  [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 1:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/71 "2005-06-29T01:20:25Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#):
>
> So Oprah being denied entrance to a CLOSED store is somehow more humiliating and horrid than a [young boy sent against his will to an “ex gay” camp?](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=320390)
>
> You know, **brickbacon** , you’re a real piece of work.
Are you fucking retarded? When did I ever make such a comparison? Why do you keep following me around distorting everything I say?
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### Author:  [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/72 "2005-06-29T01:23:15Z")
> [@Miller](#):
>
> I’m hardly an expert on the subject (thank God) but I’m pretty sure that’s almost entirely incorrect.
Devastating and horrifying are two words that come to mind. I’ve never heard someone say that being molested is really humiliating. I could be wrong, but I doubt that would be the word they’d use to sum up that experience.
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### Author:  [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/73 "2005-06-29T01:33:05Z")
> [@Belowjob2.0](#):
>
> (And if she doesn’t shut up, we’ll put her in her place.)
Beverly Hills?
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### Author:  [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/74 "2005-06-29T01:47:03Z")
> [@brickbacon](#):
>
> Are you fucking retarded? When did I ever make such a comparison? Why do you keep following me around distorting everything I say?
You didn’t make it-I did. You’re all up in arms about Oprah being the victim of racism because she wasn’t allowed to enter a store that had closed fifteen minutes before her arrival. But in another thread, when we call people evil for wanting to make their children feel ashamed of being gay, and send them to “straight camps” against their will, WE’RE jumping to conclusions and exaggerating. Because see, it COULD work.
If we’re not allowed to make judgments about Zac’s parents, how come you’re allowed to decide that Hermes is racist because they dare to turn customers away after they’re closed?
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### Author:  [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/75 "2005-06-29T01:48:21Z")
> [@brickbacon](#):
>
> Devastating and horrifying are two words that come to mind. I’ve never heard someone say that being molested is really humiliating. I could be wrong, but I doubt that would be the word they’d use to sum up that experience.
And you’d be wrong. Molestation IS humiliating. You feel ashamed, violated, and afraid to admit it happened.
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### Author:  [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/76 "2005-06-29T02:03:51Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#):
>
> You didn’t make it-I did. You’re all up in arms about Oprah being the victim of racism because she wasn’t allowed to enter a store that had closed fifteen minutes before her arrival. But in another thread, when we call people evil for wanting to make their children feel ashamed of being gay, and send them to “straight camps” against their will, WE’RE jumping to conclusions and exaggerating. Because see, it COULD work.
>
> If we’re not allowed to make judgments about Zac’s parents, how come you’re allowed to decide that Hermes is racist because they dare to turn customers away after they’re closed?
Up in arms? I advocated the same attitude in both threads. We haven’t heard the whole story. I never said Hermes was racist. I said their story is less plausible than Oprah’s in my opinion. I think people are jumping to conclusions when they assume his parents have malicious intent and that they are evil. You don’t know the people and you don’t know their kid. Try to read more carefully.
> [@Guinastasia](#):
>
> And you’d be wrong. Molestation IS humiliating. You feel ashamed, violated, and afraid to admit it happened.
Yes, because you are the spokesperson for every molestation victim. You need to get a grip on reality. Yes, being molested is humiliating, but I doubt that would be the first words one would use to descibe it.
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### Author:  [@The\_Hook](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Hook)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/77 "2005-06-29T02:13:27Z")
Now, you see, Oprah cannot _not_ be recognized. Everyone loves her. Everyone knows her. What happened, then, was that the clerks were obviously racist for not recognizing Oprah because, “all blacks look alike”. They obviously must’ve thought that and thus not recognized her. Because… how can you not recognize Oprah? How? _HOW? **HOW???** _😛
Actually, they did recognize Oprah. The clerks were just too afraid she might have brought Tom Cruise and they didn’t want anyone stomping all over the place. 😃
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### Author:  [@Duck\_Duck\_Goose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duck_Duck_Goose)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 2:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/78 "2005-06-29T02:40:38Z")
> [@brickbacon](#):
>
> Devastating and horrifying are two words that come to mind. I’ve never heard someone say that being molested is really humiliating. I could be wrong, but I doubt that would be the word they’d use to sum up that experience.
[Um…](http://www.ydub.org.nz/SITE_Default/SITE_y-be/Sexual_Abuse/default.asp)
> [@](#):
>
> \*\*Everybody reacts differently when they’ve been abused. There’s no right or wrong way to react. Sexual abuse causes many different feelings and reactions such as:
>
> ```
> * humiliation, feeling horrible, disgust, powerlessness
>
> ```
>
> …\*\*
[Ummm…](http://www.crimelibrary.com/criminal_mind/psychology/pedophiles/3.html?sect=2)
> [@](#):
>
> **After engaging in sexual acts with an adult, a complex set of emotions engulfs the victim. These emotions include humiliation, attachment to the offender and fear of exposure…**
Point taken about “worst experience” as opposed to “most humiliating experience”, but my point still stands: During 34 years of clawing her way to the top of the entertainment industry, surely she must have had to swallow humiliations far more severe than merely failing to have her celebrity-ness properly recognized by some store employees.
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### Author:  [@Wolfian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wolfian)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/79 "2005-06-29T02:46:11Z")
> [@Eve](#):
>
> Well, Hermes might as well close up shop; no matter what actually happened, they are now labeled the KKK of Paris. From the AP:
God damnit. And when the real racist shit happens people can point to this and cry Chicken Little. I think that’s what **BelowJob2.0** was getting at, but **BJ2.0** (Cumming to a theatre near you.) seems to think that this is a case of racism. I disagree for reasons already cited.
Oprah, you aren’t helping yourself. You aren’t helping us (Black people as a whole). Tell your staffers to STFU and tell the truth: you couldn’t get into Hermes because your head was too big.
**The Hook** , Tom and Oprah are [feuding](http://tcruiseko.ytmnd.com/). 😃
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### Author:  [@Ashes\_Ashes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ashes_Ashes)
#### Post date: [June 29, 2005, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oprah-its-not-because-you-were-black-get-the-hell-over-it-lame/310207/80 "2005-06-29T03:02:36Z")
The first article I read was similar to the one **Eve** posted above, except it mentioned they were setting up for a special event only. If this is so, they were correct to turn her away. Not only could Oprah have been injured by the setting up activities (Oprah beaned by ice sculpture, tonight on channel 3 news) setting them up for disaster, and/or they wouldn’t have been able to provide her with even a half-way decent shopping experience. Likely she’d have left in a huff because all the clerks were busy and it was noisy and chaotic. The clerks know this because they’ve probably been through special events before, Oprah’s opinion on the matter is much less well-informed.
If people were in there shopping, as I read elsewhere somebody in her posse claimed, why does she think she can come play as well? Those people shopping evidently set up after hours shopping and they might not appreciate the store allowing a bunch of strange people, who’ve not been cleared by security, in as well. It’s a serious security issue for some people, shopping after hours. The clerks would also know better than to ask the other patrons if Oprah could come play, too. It’s just not done.
With either scenario the Hermes clerks were damned if they did and they were damned if they didn’t. I believe they made the most fair and prudent choice.
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