# Order of the Stick - Book 5 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323 "2009-08-31T04:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 139
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2762 "2011-11-21T15:44:16Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > At least, so says Tarquin. In a story that diverts the Order’s attention away from him and towards one of his adversaries. With Detect Lie and Sense Motive running and no indication from either of them that he’s lying? ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2763 "2011-11-21T15:47:43Z")
I wonder if there’s any significance to the panel showing a disguised Zz’driti at the cocktail party where Penelope was talking about the Windy Canyon discovery? I also wonder what role the now 15 year old daughter is going to play in this story? As far as the Order beating Nale/Sabine to Orrin’s lair, how fast can Sabine fly carrying Nale? I don’t think the Order currently has a mode of transportation that can beat it, especially with V still stuck in the land of Ranch dressing. I guess Durkon could Wind Walk, with or without a Control Weather, but I don’t think he can bring the rest of the party along? Glad to see that Burlew’s evidently feeling better. As far as the ‘did Tarquin kill her or not’, I’m not seeing any affirmative statement from T saying he didn’t. The Order is inferring that Nale killed her. And, I know that T’s an evil badass, but if he were that much in love with Penelope, wouldn’t he still be a touch broken up only a few weeks after her death? ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2764 "2011-11-21T16:09:04Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > With Detect Lie and Sense Motive running and no indication from either of them that he’s lying? As Elan pointed out, you can use an artful version of the truth to deceive people over the big picture. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2765 "2011-11-21T16:20:27Z")
Did the off-camera exposition Elan referred to include the update on Vaarsuvius? Because the last time Elan and Haley saw V, the fight with Zz’driti was still in progress. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2766 "2011-11-21T16:56:06Z")
…and it’s been 154 strips since we’ve seen Xykon. As far as we know. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2767 "2011-11-21T17:01:52Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > And, I know that T’s an evil badass, but if he were that much in love with Penelope, wouldn’t he still be a touch broken up only a few weeks after her death? Well, she was his _ninth_ wife. By now he probably has the emotional attachment one would give a goldfish. 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2768 "2011-11-21T17:45:27Z")
Duhn duhn duhnnnnn! Also, did you see the new shop stuff? The “[Fantasy Fantasy](http://www.cafepress.com/orderofthestick/8296606)” one cracks me up. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2769 "2011-11-21T18:47:10Z")
> [@](#): > > With Detect Lie and Sense Motive running and no indication from either of them that he’s lying? Maybe he has the same PrC that Daimyo Kubota did, that lets you get past magical lie-detection. Still, I think he’s telling the truth. He knows Elan’s party is out to save the world, and he doesn’t want the world destroyed any more than anyone else does-- That’s where he keeps his empire. He wants them to succeed, and so is genuinely helping them. ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [November 21, 2011, 10:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2770 "2011-11-21T22:34:38Z")
If the time frame had been different, I would be wondering about that red-haired baby girl and Haley, but it’s only been 15 years since that baby was born. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2771 "2011-11-22T13:26:48Z")
> [@shantih](#): > > If the time frame had been different, I would be wondering about that red-haired baby girl and Haley, but it’s only been 15 years since that baby was born. I was wondering the same thing. Is there any possibility whatsoever that Haley’s dad is actually Girard (or whatever his name is)? ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2772 "2011-11-22T14:00:23Z")
> [@shantih](#): > > If the time frame had been different, I would be wondering about that red-haired baby girl and Haley, but it’s only been 15 years since that baby was born. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > I was wondering the same thing. Is there any possibility whatsoever that Haley’s dad is actually Girard (or whatever his name is)? Sigh. No possibility at all. [Word Of God.](http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=12254291#post12254291) ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2773 "2011-11-22T16:50:09Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Sigh. No possibility at all. > [Word Of God.](http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showthread.php?p=12254291#post12254291) That’s actually what I had figured. There’s nothing to indicate that Ian isn’t Haley’s real father. Furthermore, there is already something mysterious about Haley’s past: we don’t really know what happened to her mother, and there have been hints that her mother wasn’t just a normal woman. Her mother was known in Greysky City. ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [November 22, 2011, 5:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2774 "2011-11-22T17:29:59Z")
> [@shantih](#): > > That’s actually what I had figured. There’s nothing to indicate that Ian isn’t Haley’s real father. Furthermore, there is already something mysterious about Haley’s past: we don’t really know what happened to her mother, and there have been hints that her mother wasn’t just a normal woman. Her mother was known in Greysky City. Whoops, I was called away from the computer before I could expand on that last point. Haley’s mother’s name was Mia and she was known in Greysky City, which is another point in favor of her not having a connection to this red-haired baby girl of 15 years ago. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [November 23, 2011, 12:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2775 "2011-11-23T00:25:06Z")
I wasn’t suggesting the baby was Haley; rather, I was suggesting that Girard is in disguise as Ian, and that he fathered Haley while in that disguise. We know Girard is the master of illusions; why not a simple change self spell to infiltrate an enemy’s camp? But it’s a stretch, especially after the Giant’s post. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2776 "2011-12-02T03:16:16Z")
[New! 817 is up.](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0817.html) Roy is now on the hook if anything happens to Elan, which it probably will now. ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2777 "2011-12-02T03:30:50Z")
And a thousand people on the GitP forums say, “I knew it!” ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 4:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2778 "2011-12-02T04:53:51Z")
I loved the exchange in the antepenultimate frame… ---
**Author:** ![SCSimmons](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e495f1/32.png) [@SCSimmons](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SCSimmons)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2779 "2011-12-02T15:26:06Z")
I liked the introductions, myself. “Hi, I’m Elan! What’s your name, Roy?” " … Roy." And Tarquin smiles on, oblivious. Definitely runs in the family. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2780 "2011-12-02T17:50:18Z")
> [@SCSimmons](#): > > And Tarquin smiles on, oblivious. Are you sure? ---
**Author:** ![Lynn\_Bodoni](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e47c2d/32.png) [@Lynn\_Bodoni](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lynn_Bodoni)\ **Post date:** [December 2, 2011, 8:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/2781 "2011-12-02T20:45:20Z")
I think that Tarquin knows, but is willing to play along for now. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=138) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=140)