# Order of the Stick - Book 5 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323 "2009-08-31T04:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 169
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3362 "2012-01-26T20:55:11Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > That’s just an example description, it doesn’t mean all banshees are elves, any more than an [animated object](http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listings/constructs/animated-object) has to be a cage. I don’t think you read down far enough – later it says “A banshee is the enraged spirit of an elven woman who either betrayed those she loved or was herself betrayed” and constantly talks about them as being elves. ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3363 "2012-01-26T21:14:00Z")
> [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](#): > > So how come Xykon accidentally paralyzed Right-Eye in SoD? He didn’t even know what he did- Redcloak’s next words were something like “Now let’s discuss your paralyzing touch.” Wasn’t that something like ten seconds after he became a lich? I think there’s a fairly obvious explanation here. ---
**Author:** ![Ura-Maru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/51bf81/32.png) [@Ura-Maru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ura-Maru)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3364 "2012-01-26T21:23:52Z")
Old school (1e) Banshees (Banshai? Banshices?) were the spirits of ‘an evil female elf–a very rare thing.’ (phrasing might be slightly off) That was a long time ago, though, and the background detail probably went the way of racial classes. Which is to say, it may hung around thematically, but not be a rule anymore. Can’t check, though, not in the SRD and I don’t have easy access to 3.x Monster Manuels. Pathfinder changed the fluff on a lot of things, so even if [del]Pathfinder banshain . . . banshicies . . . [/del] a banshee in Pathfinder universe has to have been an elf, it doesn’t mean it’ll work that way in OotS. Still, elves have their own, _better than everyone else’s_, version of a lich, it wouldn’t be a shock if they had their own, _better than everyone else’s_ version of a spectre, too. Frickin’ elves. (Or ‘fricken’ eladrin,’ depending on edition) – And in SoD, he’d be a lich for what, like 10 minutes? When you’re new at this kind of thing, your spellike abilites start popping out all the time. Any stray thought or visable flesh can set them off. After you’re out of undead high school (metaphorically speaking) you pick up a certain amount of control of those areas. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 9:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3365 "2012-01-26T21:29:17Z")
> [@Ura-Maru](#): > > Still, elves have their own, _better than everyone else’s_, version of a lich, it wouldn’t be a shock if they had their own, _better than everyone else’s_ version of a spectre, too. > > Frickin’ elves. (Or ‘fricken’ eladrin,’ depending on edition) Brother. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3366 "2012-01-26T21:30:28Z")
> [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](#): > > So how come Xykon accidentally paralyzed Right-Eye in SoD? He didn’t even know what he did- Redcloak’s next words were something like “Now let’s discuss your paralyzing touch.” Because it’s funny. ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3367 "2012-01-26T21:35:44Z")
> [@Ura-Maru](#): > > And in SoD, he’d be a lich for what, like 10 minutes? When you’re new at this kind of thing, your spellike abilites start popping out all the time. Any stray thought or visable flesh can set them off. After you’re out of undead high school (metaphorically speaking) you pick up a certain amount of control of those areas. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![hdc\_bst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/9f8e36/32.png) [@hdc\_bst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hdc_bst)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3368 "2012-01-26T23:50:49Z")
There’s a new [strip](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0831.html). It seems Rich Burlew is in better health now, at least if his rate of production is any indication. Anyone familiar with the rules care to explain how well protected Red Cloak’s box is now? ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [January 26, 2012, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3369 "2012-01-26T23:52:55Z")
> [@hdc\_bst](#): > > There’s a new [strip](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0831.html). Posted yesterday. > [@Knorf](#): > > [831](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0831.html). > > Can I just say I’m glad Rich Burlew is writing this strip and not, say, **Kobal2**? I’ve never read anyone so pompous about their own predictions for the course of a serialized story. It’s worse when he gets some of them right. But not all of them are. > > Anyway I guess that this is one thing that’s so very good about this strip–Burlew keeps everyone guessing. ---
**Author:** ![hdc\_bst](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/9f8e36/32.png) [@hdc\_bst](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hdc_bst)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3370 "2012-01-27T00:13:46Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Posted yesterday. :o Boy this thread moves fast. So to catch me up, what we saw wasn’t RC hiding the true phylactery, but finishing the construction of his faux-phylactery? ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3371 "2012-01-27T00:49:34Z")
> [@hdc\_bst](#): > > :o Boy this thread moves fast. So to catch me up, what we saw wasn’t RC hiding the true phylactery, but finishing the construction of his faux-phylactery? Correct – or, rather, he was putting the same non-detection and damage-resistance spells on the fake, presumably so that Xykon won’t be able to crush it in his bare phalanges and say “What kind of scam you tryin’ to pull here, Red-Eye?” ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3372 "2012-01-27T01:29:05Z")
Hmm…I just realized–this is almost the end of book 5 (6?), isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 1:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3373 "2012-01-27T01:54:25Z")
> [@Trepa\_Mayfield](#): > > Hmm…I just realized–this is almost the end of book 5 (6?), isn’t it? Yeah, should be around 850 or so. It sure looks like book five is setting up the big confrontation at Girard’s gate, but that leaves a whole 'nother gate untouched. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3374 "2012-01-27T02:01:43Z")
> [@Trepa\_Mayfield](#): > > Hmm…I just realized–this is almost the end of book 5 (6?), isn’t it? The books normally contain about 180 strips. There are 158 strips so far in the current arc. And this will be the fifth book in the main story. ---
**Author:** ![cckerberos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@cckerberos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cckerberos)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 3:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3375 "2012-01-27T03:04:02Z")
I’m debating what to do about the Kickstarter offers. I’d like to order the books that I don’t have yet, but they’re significantly more expensive than they would be elsewhere (even taking the extra $10 donation into account). ---
**Author:** ![Tabby\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tabby\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tabby_Cat)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3376 "2012-01-27T03:33:24Z")
I just wish Rich would put the books out as e-books. I just can’t justify putting more paper in my house, and international shipping costs to boot. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 3:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3377 "2012-01-27T03:50:03Z")
> [@](#): > > Quoth **Grumman** : > > Well, he’s a 17th level caster with a Wisdom of at least 19 (or else he wouldn’t be able to cast Implosion). That means he’s got at least the following: > > 6 cantrips > 6+1 first level spells > 6+1 second level spells > 6+1 third level spells > 6+1 fourth level spells > 4+1 fifth level spells > 4+1 sixth level spells > 3+1 seventh level spells > 2+1 eighth level spells > 1+1 ninth level spells Actually, Wis at least 20, based on the save DCs in the Ultimate Cleric Duel, which means he gets an extra 5th and 1st above what you listed. What we’ve seen him cast so far today: Implosion: 9th-level domain slot Probably Summon Monster VIII for the osmium elemental: 8th, except he might have extended it in a 9th-level slot. 2x Greater Planar Ally for the Horned Devils: 8th Earthquake: 8th-level domain slot Disintegrate: 7th-level domain slot 4x Planar Ally for the Bearded Devils (each spell gets two): 6th Word of Recall: 6th Dispel Magic (counterspelling Tsukiko’s Shout): 3rd Problematic spells: Hardening: It’s a Sorc/Wiz spell, not Cleric. But it’s level 6 on the Sorc/Wiz list. Greater Obscure Object: I can’t find this spell anywhere. But ordinary Obscure Object is a 3rd-level cleric spell. Superior Resistance: A 6th-level cleric spell, but it targets a creature, not an object, and the effect (+6 to saves) wouldn’t really be very useful for an object, anyway. Starting from his presumed spells per day, and ignoring the problematic ones for now, it looks like he cast one too many 6th-level spells, but this could mean that he used a pair of Lesser Planar Ally spells in place of one Planar Ally, or that he has 22 Wis and therefore a bonus 6th-level spell (either is plausible). Assuming 22 Wis, then what he has left is 3+0 seventh-level 0+1 sixth-level (domain spell could be Harm or Hold Monster) 5+1 fifth-level 6+1 fourth-level 5+1 third-level 6+1 second-level 7+1 first-level 6 0th-level Minus whatever he used to get the anomalous spell effects, of course, and possibly plus more if his Wis is 24 or higher (quite plausible). ---
**Author:** ![Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f08c70/32.png) [@Crowbar\_of\_Irony\_3](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crowbar_of_Irony_3)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3378 "2012-01-27T04:18:29Z")
> [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](#): > > So how come Xykon accidentally paralyzed Right-Eye in SoD? He didn’t even know what he did- Redcloak’s next words were something like “Now let’s discuss your paralyzing touch.” I see it as he was lifting up Jirx and choking him, like what he did to V ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 4:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3379 "2012-01-27T04:19:38Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Starting from his presumed spells per day, and ignoring the problematic ones for now, it looks like he cast one too many 6th-level spells, but this could mean that he used a pair of Lesser Planar Ally spells in place of one Planar Ally, or that he has 22 Wis and therefore a bonus 6th-level spell (either is plausible). Or that he prepared a 6th level spell in a 7th level spell slot. ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3380 "2012-01-27T05:06:19Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Actually, Wis at least 20, based on the save DCs in the Ultimate Cleric Duel, which means he gets an extra 5th and 1st above what you listed. > > What we’ve seen him cast so far today: > Implosion: 9th-level domain slot > Probably Summon Monster VIII for the osmium elemental: 8th, except he might have extended it in a 9th-level slot. He cast implosion twice: [826 Minimal Resistance - Giant in the Playground Games](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0826.html) So he couldn’t have previously used up a 9th level spot. ---
**Author:** ![Tabby\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tabby\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tabby_Cat)\ **Post date:** [January 27, 2012, 5:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/3381 "2012-01-27T05:42:03Z")
Doesn’t each cast of implosion work on more than 1 target? Anyway, we’re probably reading too much into it. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=168) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=170)