# Order of the Stick - Book 5 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323 "2009-08-31T04:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 211
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2012, 11:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4202 "2012-05-01T23:55:03Z")
> [@E-Sabbath](#): > > I rather like how Tarquin clearly expected Elan to be the big badass. Tarquin still thinks Elan is the leader of the Order, I think. ---
**Author:** ![cckerberos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@cckerberos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cckerberos)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4203 "2012-05-02T00:13:30Z")
> [@Lightray](#): > > We’ve seen her use a knife (Crystal’s, when she gacked Crystal). And she used a sap at some point in the whole Greysky Thieves’ Guild plotline, I think. Plus, she’s stabbed Sabine with arrows sans bow at least once. Also, [this comic](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0200.html). ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 10:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4204 "2012-05-02T10:30:05Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > To clarify: I know Deflect Arrows is a feat like any other, it’s just that on the whole it’s a shit feat. I’m not so sure: remember that with [Manyshot](http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Manyshot), only the first arrow carries critical and precision (e.g. Sneak Attack) damage. And despite the name, it also applies to thrown spears, javelins, darts, and more. And it’s definitely not shit when you take it as a prerequisite. It’s a requirement for two badass Epic feats: [Infinite Deflection](http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Infinite_Deflection) and [Reflect Arrows](http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Reflect_Arrows). ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 11:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4205 "2012-05-02T11:17:30Z")
I don’t know about anyone else but in some of these battle comics I always have a bit of dissonance between my D&D brain and my realistic brain. Normally a guy who just took three arrows, a dagger to the leg and a sword through the torso would be in bad shape, but then we saw Roy’s head being used to knock down a building and he walked away from that. Hit points are invisible, and hit points in the service of a narrative doubly so. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 11:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4206 "2012-05-02T11:25:56Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > And it’s definitely not shit when you take it as a prerequisite. It’s a requirement for two badass Epic feats: [Infinite Deflection](http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Infinite_Deflection) and [Reflect Arrows](http://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/SRD:Reflect_Arrows). In the Epic levels you’re fighting legions of dragons or duelling gods, the ranged attacks you might take are giant boulders flung by Cloud Giants, and of course spellcasters doublecast Disintegrations at you (not to mention, the friendly ones can most definitely shield you from arrows entirely anyway), so… ---
**Author:** ![Enderw24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ba9def/32.png) [@Enderw24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Enderw24)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4207 "2012-05-02T13:59:34Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Normally a guy who just took three arrows, a dagger to the leg To the leg? Yes. To the knee? Your adventuring days are over. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4208 "2012-05-02T15:25:37Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > In the Epic levels… the ranged attacks you might take are giant boulders flung by Cloud Giants, And you’re Enlarged so you can catch them and chuck them right back. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4209 "2012-05-02T16:05:15Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > They also serve, who only stand and distract the bad guy. Elan participated. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4210 "2012-05-02T17:52:52Z")
> [@](#): > > I don’t know about anyone else but in some of these battle comics I always have a bit of dissonance between my D&D brain and my realistic brain. Normally a guy who just took three arrows, a dagger to the leg and a sword through the torso would be in bad shape, but then we saw Roy’s head being used to knock down a building and he walked away from that. Hit points are invisible, and hit points in the service of a narrative doubly so. Does reality strain your suspension of disbelief, too? Because there really are real badasses in the real world who really do shrug off damage like that. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4211 "2012-05-02T18:11:02Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Does reality strain your suspension of disbelief, too? Because there really are real badasses in the real world who really do shrug off damage like that. Cite? There are people who can knock down a building with their head, and walk away afterwards? Who? ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4212 "2012-05-02T18:49:57Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Cite? There are people who can knock down a building with their head, and walk away afterwards? Who? George Washington. ---
**Author:** ![Saltire](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saltire/32/553_2.png) [@Saltire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saltire)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2012, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4213 "2012-05-02T19:56:01Z")
> [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](#): > > After shrugging off the “Hold Person” spell, he punnily reached forward to hold a person (namely, Durkon) and spun around in place like an Olympic hammer-thrower, causing the guy he’d grabbed to build up momentum before a fine bit of dwarf-tossing. Same combat move our hero does in SUPERMAN II, if that helps you. Seems to have grabbed, swung, and tossed that dwarf by gripping him by the beard. Ouch! ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4214 "2012-05-03T19:25:56Z")
Ten bucks says that’s not Tarquin they’re fighting. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4215 "2012-05-03T19:30:16Z")
> [@Agent\_Foxtrot](#): > > Ten bucks says that’s not Tarquin they’re fighting. Huh? Nale, Malack and the kobold accountant all address him as they would Tarquin (“Dad”, “Tarquin” and “Sir”, respectively). ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4216 "2012-05-03T19:30:45Z")
> [@Agent\_Foxtrot](#): > > Ten bucks says that’s not Tarquin they’re fighting. You think its someone pretending to be Tarquin pretending to be Thog? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4217 "2012-05-03T19:34:50Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > You think its someone pretending to be Tarquin pretending to be Thog? Hell, I don’t even know who would be a CANDIDATE for that possibility right now. I mean, theoretically, it could be one of the Evil Inc. triumvirate, but that’s a REALLY long shot. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4218 "2012-05-03T19:53:24Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Hell, I don’t even know who would be a CANDIDATE for that possibility right now. Foxtrot could be figuring it’s one of Girard’s illusions, but that seems unlikely. ---
**Author:** ![Agent\_Foxtrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc29f/32.png) [@Agent\_Foxtrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Agent_Foxtrot)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 8:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4219 "2012-05-03T20:17:30Z")
The helmet serves a dual purpose: a disguise against OOTS, and a disguise against the _reader_. Tarquin, as excellent a fighter as he may be, is far too smart to put himself in a combat situation where he isn’t guaranteed to win. He has no reason to throw his life away. He also has no reason to trust the Linear Guild, so he’s not going to engage one-vs.-five against several high-level combatants and just trust that the Linear Guild isn’t going to screw it up or stab him in the back, even with Malack there to keep them honest. In fact, I think he even knew that he wasn’t going to win one-vs.-five, which makes it all the more likely that it’s not him under that helmet. I think the Linear Guild is about to be just as surprised as the OOTS at what’s going to happen next. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4220 "2012-05-03T20:32:52Z")
> [@Agent\_Foxtrot](#): > > The helmet serves a dual purpose: a disguise against OOTS, and a disguise against the _reader_. > > Tarquin, as excellent a fighter as he may be, is far too smart to put himself in a combat situation where he isn’t guaranteed to win. He has no reason to throw his life away. He also has no reason to trust the Linear Guild, so he’s not going to engage one-vs.-five against several high-level combatants and just trust that the Linear Guild isn’t going to screw it up or stab him in the back, even with Malack there to keep them honest. > > In fact, I think he even knew that he wasn’t going to win one-vs.-five, which makes it all the more likely that it’s not him under that helmet. > > I think the Linear Guild is about to be just as surprised as the OOTS at what’s going to happen next. So who IS it? “Tarquin” has been interacting with a) a son who’s known him his entire life and b) a “business partner” who’s known him for YEARS right up until he launched himself into this combat, and neither one appears to have the slightest inkling that it wasn’t Tarquin they were speaking with the whole time. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [May 3, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/4221 "2012-05-03T20:34:54Z")
> [@Agent\_Foxtrot](#): > > Tarquin, as excellent a fighter as he may be, is far too smart to put himself in a combat situation where he isn’t guaranteed to win. He has no reason to throw his life away. He also has no reason to trust the Linear Guild, so he’s not going to engage one-vs.-five against several high-level combatants and just trust that the Linear Guild isn’t going to screw it up or stab him in the back, even with Malack there to keep them honest. Malack’s there to bring him back from the dead if he ‘throws his life away’ – which Tarquin doesn’t figure has a chance of happening unless it makes for a really terrific story. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=210) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=212)