# Order of the Stick - Book 5 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323 "2009-08-31T04:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2010, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/501 "2010-03-12T15:37:35Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > šŸ˜• I donā€™t get it. The title of the strip, ā€œHeā€™s Not Even Supposed to Be Here Today,ā€ is a reference to something that Dante, the main character in Kevin Smithā€™s movie _Clerks_, says a number of times. Kevin Smith recently had a dustup with Southwest Airlines. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2010, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/502 "2010-03-12T16:51:21Z")
I noticed that attackers we see are all either members of the elven team that we saw in #670 or are the leaders of the human underground. Donā€™t these people have any followers? ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2010, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/503 "2010-03-12T17:00:31Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I noticed that attackers we see are all either members of the elven team that we saw in #670 or are the leaders of the human underground. Donā€™t these people have any followers? My understanding has always been that the Resistance is VERY small. The majority of Azurites are either with the fleet on the other side of the world, or (un)dead. Iā€™d be surprised if there were more than 100 or so living rebels in the city. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2010, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/504 "2010-03-12T17:21:19Z")
And the lower-level majority of the resistance mostly works in various logistic efforts to keep the underground community running. For something like a prison raid, it just doesnā€™t make any sense to send anyone but the few high-level characters, since theyā€™re the only ones whoā€™ll be able to accomplish anything. Consider that the only clerics the Resistance has consider Dispel Magic and Create Food and Water (both 3rd-level spells) to be ā€œhigh levelā€. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 12, 2010, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/505 "2010-03-12T17:22:02Z")
Thereā€™s also the civilians theyā€™re resuing from the prison, obviously. Anyway, the leaders are also the highest level characters in the resistance; it makes sense for them to spearpoint a commando raid. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 12:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/506 "2010-03-21T00:13:51Z")
[New comic!](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0707.html) The comic was loading slowly for me where I was, but I knew what would happen before the bottom row loaded. On one hand, I do think the whole thing stunk. OTOH, itā€™s easy to see why Redcloak is on his crusade. OTOOH, if it werenā€™t for the crusade, would the reaction have been the same? Thatā€™s why Burlewā€™s writing rocks. ---
**Author:** ![JoseB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/joseb/32/1530_2.png) [@JoseB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoseB)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/507 "2010-03-21T00:19:27Z")
Yiaiks! That was _harsh_ā€¦ ā€¦although, of course, I can see that the elvish commanderā€™s decision might be correct from a strictly tactical/military point of view, it still is _harsh_. Yes, it is practically sure that the hobgoblin in question is a plant, but there is always this nagging thingā€¦ what if he wasnā€™t? (and, well, it looks peculiar for goblinoids to put their own in jail together with their hated enemiesā€¦) Gray and gray morality, for sure. ---
**Author:** ![Leaper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/4bbf92/32.png) [@Leaper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaper)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/508 "2010-03-21T00:22:59Z")
Lemme guess: you go by the same handle [on the GitP forums, donā€™t you?](http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8119024&postcount=9) šŸ˜ƒ ---
**Author:** ![JoseB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/joseb/32/1530_2.png) [@JoseB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoseB)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 1:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/509 "2010-03-21T01:03:46Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > Lemme guess: you go by the same handle [on the GitP forums, donā€™t you?](http://www.giantitp.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8119024&postcount=9) > > šŸ˜ƒ Guilty as charged! šŸ™‚ Why change handles, if I already have a perfectly serviceable one? šŸ™‚ ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/510 "2010-03-21T01:16:33Z")
I figured out the punchline about halfway down. My brother and I want to know: what the heck does the strip title mean? ---
**Author:** ![JoseB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/joseb/32/1530_2.png) [@JoseB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JoseB)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/511 "2010-03-21T01:24:08Z")
> [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](#): > > I figured out the punchline about halfway down. > > My brother and I want to know: what the heck does the strip title mean? Possibly a reference to the different variants of Elves in D&D? ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 1:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/512 "2010-03-21T01:28:03Z")
> [@JoseB](#): > > Possibly a reference to the different variants of Elves in D&D? Wouldnā€™t goblinoid races make more sense? Itā€™s not one of the better strip titles, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/513 "2010-03-21T02:19:44Z")
> [@Leaper](#): > > OTOH, itā€™s easy to see why Redcloak is on his crusade. OTOOH, if it werenā€™t for the crusade, would the reaction have been the same? Yes; ( Start of Darkness spoilers ): [Spoiler]Redcloakā€™s crusade against humans in general and paladins specifically is rather directly due to their ruthless extermination of his fellow goblins, down to the children. And the general state of warfare between goblins and humans exists because the humans refused the peace offer of the ā€œDark Oneā€ back when he was mortal. And in turn the hostility that existed before then largely was due to goblins and the other humanoids being put in the world solely as XP fodder. When you get right down to it, humans, elves and the rest are in a way the vampires in this scenario, feeding on the goblins ( by killing them for XP ) to grow stronger.[/Spoiler] ---
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/514 "2010-03-21T02:25:46Z")
Back to the previous strip, do you think the last panel of would make a good t-shirt? I know itā€™s entirely unintelligible out of context, but the sheer randomness is why I love it. ā€œUh, I may have skimmed the orientation packetā€, and then thereā€™s these knights waltzing away in the backgroundā€¦ gorgeously surreal. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/515 "2010-03-21T05:06:55Z")
> [@ultrafilter](#): > > Wouldnā€™t goblinoid races make more sense? Itā€™s not one of the better strip titles, anyway. No. Itā€™s in response to the last sentence. ā€œElves are awesome.ā€ ā€œThatā€™s probably why there are, like, 17 types.ā€ ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/516 "2010-03-21T05:25:21Z")
> [@JoseB](#): > > ā€¦although, of course, I can see that the elvish commanderā€™s decision might be correct from a strictly tactical/military point of view, it still is _harsh_. Yes, it is practically sure that the hobgoblin in question is a plant, but there is always this nagging thingā€¦ what if he wasnā€™t? Not really. Just because heā€™s a criminal among goblins doesnā€™t mean he wouldnā€™t also be a criminal among humans. ---
**Author:** ![AClockworkMelon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aclockworkmelon/32/10803_2.png) [@AClockworkMelon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AClockworkMelon)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 5:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/517 "2010-03-21T05:30:33Z")
I havenā€™t read Order of the Stick in a long timeā€¦ the last thing I remember is a paladin chick andā€¦ a city of paladins or something? Iā€™m in for a long, long read, arenā€™t I? šŸ˜› ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 10:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/518 "2010-03-21T10:01:02Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > I havenā€™t read Order of the Stick in a long timeā€¦ the last thing I remember is a paladin chick andā€¦ a city of paladins or something? > > Iā€™m in for a long, long read, arenā€™t I? šŸ˜› Oh, yes. Very long. ---
**Author:** ![Hal\_Briston](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a9a28c/32.png) [@Hal\_Briston](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hal_Briston)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 12:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/519 "2010-03-21T12:53:23Z")
> [@AClockworkMelon](#): > > Iā€™m in for a long, long read, arenā€™t I? šŸ˜› Quite. Enjoy the travels. šŸ™‚ ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2010, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/520 "2010-03-21T15:26:46Z")
So, are goblins unredeemable? Is that an action of a good character? Or should Good avoid being Stupid? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=27)