# Order of the Stick - Book 5 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323 "2009-08-31T04:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 272
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2013, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5422 "2013-04-10T18:33:50Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > Seriously, y’all. This is among the best continuing webcomics out there. I’m sorry, but you’re wrong. It’s _the_ best. Seriously. No other serialized web comic generates anything like the kind of philosophical discussions, wide admiration, or heated debates that OOTS does. People are hooked, in a big way. I can say this authoritatively because, well, I am, too. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2013, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5423 "2013-04-10T19:05:51Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > That is pleasant to know. > As an avid follower, I look forward to two more years of a wonderful saga. > > Seriously, y’all. This is among the best continuing webcomics out there. I am pleased and delighted to have discovered it. Agreed. I was reading a scholarly history of the fantasy genre. The author’s primary focus, not surprisingly, was Tolkein. But he also discussed Lewis’ _Chronicles of Narnia_, LeGuin’s Earthsea series, Donaldson’s Thomas Covenant series, Brooks’ Shannara series, Rowling’s Harry Potter series, Holdstock’s _Mythago Wood_, and others. And I was thinking that _The Order of the Stick_ would some day rank among these as a fantasy classic worth scholarly consideration. ---
**Author:** ![John\_DiFool](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_difool/32/19543_2.png) [@John\_DiFool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_DiFool)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2013, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5424 "2013-04-10T19:34:09Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > But then my view of intelligent undead like vampires and liches is that the original living entity’s soul and personality still resides within them, so why wouldn’t their knowledge survive too? If your view of the undead is more like RedCloak’s, then I can see some difficulty in D continuing to cast the stuff he knew when he was alive. Ah, the Buffy the Vampire Slayer vs. Forever Knight dichotomy. Both approaches worked well in both universes, tho I prefer the one where vamps have full free will and thus aren’t automatically evil. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2013, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5425 "2013-04-10T20:06:50Z")
> [@squeegee](#): > > Interesting that Malack a) lies to Tarquin that Belkar got away on his own, then b) offers that he was weakened, apparently in an effort paint him as an uninteresting non-threat to the LG, then b) looked pissed when this backfired and Tarquin told Nale to go after the OOTS to wipe them out, and made Malack help him. I’ll put a couple of quatloos into the “Malack gets pissed off and turns on (or abandons) Nale and crew” column, at least as a slim possibility. I doubt Malack has infinite patience, although his devotion to his Lawful side strikes me as too strong to let him go against whatever agreement he’d made with Tarquin. Still, he’s unlikely to have missed the shifted balance of power in the exploring party; with Sabine and Q’arr gone (as far as they know) and Tarquin and Kilkil elsewhere, it’s now Nale, Zz’drowperson and a fiend versus Malack, Durkferatu and a fiend. Malack may not kill Nale but I doubt he’ll let himself be pushed around either, especially when forced to go against Durkon’s dying wishes. I foresee a power play and Nale getting his feelings hurt. Again. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2013, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5426 "2013-04-10T20:25:18Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > Agreed. I was reading a scholarly history of the fantasy genre. The author’s primary focus, not surprisingly, was Tolkein. But he also discussed Lewis’ _Chronicles of Narnia_, LeGuin’s Earthsea series, Donaldson’s Thomas Covenant series, Brooks’ Shannara series, Rowling’s Harry Potter series, Holdstock’s _Mythago Wood_, and others. And I was thinking that _The Order of the Stick_ would some day rank among these as a fantasy classic worth scholarly consideration. The characterizations and plot clearly are superior to Shannara and Potter. If those are bellwethers of modern fantasy, then it doesn’t take much of a leap of faith (or fan-boyness) to include OOTS in the mix. This is honestly one of the most entertaining diversions I have encountered on the web. And all done with stick figure drawings. Truly amazing. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2013, 9:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5427 "2013-04-10T21:27:02Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > Why is T going to all of this trouble to screw over Nale here, when if he wanted Nale dead or all of Nale’s knowledge, he could have done so fairly quickly back at the palace? Is it just that it makes a more interesting story to see Nale’s convoluted plots in action, rather than his ignominious, painful end on one of the Empire’s torture devices? One suggestion I’ve seen (over at the OOTS forum I think); Tarquin said earlier that his plan was to do the whole archvillain thing and swoop in at the last minute to steal the prize from the heroes. Well, if he thinks this _isn’t_ the last minute yet, then he’s just sending in cannon fodder to whittle down the OP, spring any last defenses, add more conflict and drama to the story, and in the process get Nale & company beaten or killed while he stays back like the mastermind he is. I _do_ find it possibly significant that the only person genuinely on his side that he’s sending is Malack the vampire, who’ll just end up back in his coffin if “killed”, while he _and_ the kobold stay behind in safety. Meanwhile, whatever he did before he left the city shows up/comes to fruition - perhaps he summoned his old group. And only then, after the Order has reached the Gate will Tarquin swoop in with his new reinforcements. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 10, 2013, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5428 "2013-04-10T22:07:17Z")
Actually, as serialized webcomics go, I’d rank _Girl Genius_ and _Schlock Mercenary_ both over _Order of the Stick_, though only slightly. All three are great, but the regularity of the other two gives them an edge. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2013, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5429 "2013-04-11T17:22:17Z")
[New Strip](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0883.html) ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2013, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5430 "2013-04-11T17:28:49Z")
> [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > [New Strip](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0883.html) You’re a page late. And I have to penalize you 50 points for getting my hopes up in vain. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2013, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5431 "2013-04-11T17:34:38Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > You’re a page late. And I have to penalize you 50 points for getting my hopes up in vain. Sorry, didn’t notice strip yesterday. ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2013, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5432 "2013-04-11T18:15:22Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > I’m sorry, but you’re wrong. It’s _the_ best. Seriously. No other serialized web comic generates anything like the kind of philosophical discussions, wide admiration, or heated debates that OOTS does. > > People are hooked, in a big way. I can say this authoritatively because, well, I am, too. I honestly think that Homestuck is a better webcomic, although it has worse fans (on average). ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2013, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5433 "2013-04-11T18:29:17Z")
Well, I don’t really follow the OOTS forum, but the folks here are certainly the best. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2013, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5434 "2013-04-12T16:42:43Z")
> [@Gagundathar](#): > > That is pleasant to know. > As an avid follower, I look forward to two more years of a wonderful saga. 😕 TWO more years? This book alone has been going for three and a half! Okay, less half a year due to Sir Thumb’s time on the Disabled List; that’s still three years. I think we’ve got another five years ahead of us. And I’m looking forward to them as much as you are. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2013, 4:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5435 "2013-04-12T16:54:44Z")
Given Rich’s innate clumsiness, I hope he has the ending written down somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2013, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5436 "2013-04-12T22:57:18Z")
So Elan, two clerics, a wizard and two fiends are descending back into the pyramid. Isn’t it going to be a problem that they have nobody who can find and disarm traps? What am I missing? ---
**Author:** ![shantih](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f6c823/32.png) [@shantih](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shantih)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2013, 11:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5437 "2013-04-12T23:13:19Z")
> [@squeegee](#): > > So Elan, two clerics, a wizard and two fiends are descending back into the pyramid. Isn’t it going to be a problem that they have nobody who can find and disarm traps? What am I missing? You mean, besides which twin is the one with the new and improved Linear Guild? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2013, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5438 "2013-04-12T23:16:48Z")
> [@shantih](#): > > You mean, besides which twin is the one with the new and improved Linear Guild? 😛 Fine, Nale. The question remains. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2013, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5439 "2013-04-12T23:18:42Z")
Without the illusions, all the traps are easy to spot and avoid, and the ones that the really must pass through have been deactivated by Haley already. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2013, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5440 "2013-04-12T23:24:07Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Without the illusions, all the traps are easy to spot and avoid, and the ones that the really must pass through have been deactivated by Haley already. Haley hadn’t deactivated all the traps; the OOTS had just avoided a bunch of them. If you recall from the earlier ambush, Nale managed to trigger a trap in a hallway the OOTS had gone through already. Also, Sabine was the only one on the LG that seemed able to detect or disarm a trap, and she’s currently unavailable. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2013, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/5441 "2013-04-13T00:06:24Z")
They do have a pair of fiends to send ahead for trap-fodder. Meat shields as Nale calls them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=271) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=273)