# Order of the Stick - Book 5 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323 "2009-08-31T04:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 356
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7102 "2013-09-02T15:54:10Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > She’s a necrophiliac. Umm… I’m not sure that’s the correct term. She went for the **un** dead as opposed to the merely dead. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7103 "2013-09-02T15:58:52Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > Umm… I’m not sure that’s the correct term. She went for the **un** dead as opposed to the merely dead. Dude, she _fucks corpses._ I don’t think we really need separate terms to decribe if the corpse was moving around at the time or not. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7104 "2013-09-02T16:21:29Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Dude, she _fucks corpses._ I don’t think we really need separate terms to decribe if the corpse was moving around at the time or not. Sure, but I’m not sure I’d consider her “love for the undead” to make me characterize her as “significantly further 'round the bend” than **Xykon** , for crying out loud. Unless I misunderstood what you meant – I thought you meant “significantly more evil” as opposed to “significantly more nuts.” Since, after all, she has [perfectly logical and reasonable reasons](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0700.html) for her feelings toward the undead. Heh heh … man, when even the Monster in the Dark can see the problems with your argument, that should be a sign that your thought processes might not be quite right. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7105 "2013-09-02T16:25:25Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Dude, she _fucks corpses._ I don’t think we really need separate terms to decribe if the corpse was moving around at the time or not. Oh, and also, it seems to me that there’s a big difference between sex with, say, a vampire, which there are lots of novels and TV shows and movies written about, and sex with “that crypt thing” that is “just a skeleton.” (From the [same strip I referenced in the last post](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0700.html).) Maybe we DO need separate terms to discuss necrophilia as opposed to good old-fashioned all-American undead lovin’. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7106 "2013-09-02T16:51:32Z")
> [@chorpler](#): > > Sure, but I’m not sure I’d consider her “love for the undead” to make me characterize her as “significantly further 'round the bend” than **Xykon** , for crying out loud. Unless I misunderstood what you meant – I thought you meant “significantly more evil” as opposed to “significantly more nuts.” Since, after all, she has [perfectly logical and reasonable reasons](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0700.html) for her feelings toward the undead. > > Heh heh … man, when even the Monster in the Dark can see the problems with your argument, that should be a sign that your thought processes might not be quite right. I was going more for “significantly more depraved.” She creeped out a lich. That takes some doing. > [@chorpler](#): > > Oh, and also, it seems to me that there’s a big difference between sex with, say, a vampire, which there are lots of novels and TV shows and movies written about, and sex with “that crypt thing” that is “just a skeleton.” (From the [same strip I referenced in the last post](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0700.html).) Maybe we DO need separate terms to discuss necrophilia as opposed to good old-fashioned all-American undead lovin’. I’m personally okay with classifying Buffy, Bella, and Sooki as necrophiliacs. But if you want to get technical about it, a necrophiliac is attracted to death. People attracted to vampires aren’t attracted to them _because_ they’re dead. They’re usually attracted to them because they look eternally young. (Where’s the legion of squealing girl fans for Count Orloff?) Tsukiko, by contrast, was specifically attracted to the corpse-like aspect of the undead. Also, how does consent work here? If Tsukiko had sex with undead who were not free willed, is she also a rapist? ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7107 "2013-09-02T17:58:38Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Also, how does consent work here? If Tsukiko had sex with undead who were not free willed, is she also a rapist? It isn’t rape because they’re not sentient beings. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 6:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7108 "2013-09-02T18:14:49Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > It isn’t rape because they’re not sentient beings. Free willed and sentient aren’t the same thing. Up until a few strips ago, Durkon wasn’t free-willed, but he was still sentient. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 6:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7109 "2013-09-02T18:53:22Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Free willed and sentient aren’t the same thing. Up until a few strips ago, Durkon wasn’t free-willed, but he was still sentient. Good point - I was thinking more in terms of skeletons, zombies and ghouls. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7110 "2013-09-02T19:41:51Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Yeah, I recall a comment I heard about her at the time; that she was basically the equivalent of a Mean Girl from high school who somehow fell in with Colombian drug lords and still thought she was scary. [Ahem.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=14702338&postcount=3287) ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7111 "2013-09-02T19:49:38Z")
Looking for that post, I came across an interesting post ultrafilter had made. He said the Tarquin wouldn’t want Nale to be killed by anyone except himself or maybe Elan. And I think ultrafilter was right. It wasn’t so much that Tarquin loved Nale as a son; it was more like he saw Nale as his favorite toy. Sure, he liked playing with Nale but he didn’t like it when anyone else did (hence his dislike for Sabine, who was thwarting his control over Nale and exerting her own influence over him). He stopped Malak and others from killing Nale. But when it became clear that Nale was going to be killed, he did it himself rather than let anyone else do it. Imagine living a lifetime under that type of control and you can see where Nale got his hatred from. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7112 "2013-09-02T19:51:06Z")
Hey, that was almost 4000 posts ago. He should get a pass. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7113 "2013-09-02T20:10:48Z")
I dunno, I saw it as more of a Lenny and George type of thing. Tarquin does genuinely love both of his sons, and thus, when one of them needed killing, saw it as his responsibility to do the unfortunate necessary deed. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 8:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7114 "2013-09-02T20:29:34Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Good point - I was thinking more in terms of skeletons, zombies and ghouls. Nitpick: Ghouls are both intelligent and free willed. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 9:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7115 "2013-09-02T21:14:15Z")
> [@Jonathan\_Chance](#): > > Hey, that was almost 4000 posts ago. He should get a pass. Huh? I’m agreeing with ultrafilter and crediting him with spotting that aspect of Tarquin’s character so early. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7116 "2013-09-02T21:17:32Z")
No, Der Trihs should get a pass on not remembering who came up with the mean girl description for Tsukiko. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 11:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7117 "2013-09-02T23:42:27Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > No, Der Trihs should get a pass on not remembering who came up with the mean girl description for Tsukiko. _And_ over a year ago - actually I wasn’t at all sure if it had even been on this board. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7118 "2013-09-03T00:10:52Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > No, Der Trihs should get a pass on not remembering who came up with the mean girl description for Tsukiko. I demand hearings to determine exactly what **Der Trihs** knew, and when! ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 1:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7119 "2013-09-03T01:06:02Z")
And DOWN the rabbit hole we go! ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 1:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7120 "2013-09-03T01:43:48Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > No, Der Trihs should get a pass on not remembering who came up with the mean girl description for Tsukiko. I agree. But when he mentioned it, I remembered it was my line so I wanted to jump in and hog the credit. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7121 "2013-09-03T02:14:44Z")
Lm [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=355) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=357)