# Order of the Stick - Book 5 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2009, 4:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323 "2009-08-31T04:09:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 391
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7802 "2013-10-31T00:47:23Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Oops, I guess I did type “unarmed”, there. Insert an H wherever you think most appropriate. Hun-armed with a powerful wood & horn short bow? ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7803 "2013-10-31T01:17:44Z")
Made a joke. Already been made. ---
**Author:** ![dzeiger](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/46a35a/32.png) [@dzeiger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dzeiger)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7804 "2013-10-31T01:32:10Z")
That’s the same dagger he stabbed Nale with next to his hand, isn’t it? ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 4:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7805 "2013-10-31T04:36:02Z")
> [@dzeiger](#): > > That’s the same dagger he stabbed Nale with next to his hand, isn’t it? Appears to be. And the dagger that he felt he could coup de grace Roy with, so I’m guessing it’s no ordinary dagger. Dunno if getting Roy’s blood on it would screw up any potential Resurrection of Nale hijinks. Neat fight. Seems to be following the paradigm in OOTS of villains failing because they get too mad/emotionally addled to fight optimally or smartly: Miko, Tsukiko, Darth V. I would have guessed that three high level/low epic characters could have wiped the floor with the Order, but the fight isn’t too onerous with their grabbing any idiot balls. I do think that Dominating Elan, to then go stick Belkar, would achieve the same effect of dismounting the Order from Pistachios (the Allosaur), without Miron having to use a Polymorph on something with probably a sky-high Fort save. Meh, it’s not as bad of a railroad as other fights Burlew has written in this series. Though when is the friggin’ book going to end already? And how are we going to transition to the next book? Will Lauren get the Order out of her hair by Wormholing them to Kraggor’s? Will they go swimming in the Rift after all? Seems kinda cheap for Tarquin to bite it here, and he’d be an asset against Xykon and the rest, but that seems to be the way Burlew is guiding the plot? Any bets on Tarquin accidentally skewering Elan, forcing him to realize his screwup, and forcing Durkula to burn up the last bit of diamond dust? Oh, and I think that Belkar’s prophecy is going to be subverted with the entire remaining narrative taking less than five or so weeks to complete. In comic time, of course. He won’t die until the very end, if then. And I do think V will play a part in his demise, if only accidentally. ---
**Author:** ![Measure\_for\_Measure](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/measure_for_measure/32/557_2.png) [@Measure\_for\_Measure](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Measure_for_Measure)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 4:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7806 "2013-10-31T04:50:50Z")
For such a formidable guy, I’m surprised Tarquin’s most powerful weapon (that we know about) is a dagger. I mean a +3 dagger still doesn’t do much damage right? What am I missing? > [@Garula](#): > > I have to admit, I get a little giddy whenever Elan has a chance to be useful. He’s always been my favorite character. I find it interesting that while more or less everyone reading this thread are fans of the series, that favorite characters are all over the map. I naively assumed that fans of a story would respond to it in roughly similar ways. Or maybe in one of two or three ways. Not so. Elan, Tarquin, Malack, Belkar and Red Cloak all have their fan base. To tell you the truth, two of the preceding are rave faves of mine while my feelings are more negative towards the others. Not negative as in I wish they weren’t in the story, but negative as in… well I guess I might not want to hang out with them for too long. No that’s not right: I like the Thog character, but I’d probably want to keep my distance from the maniac in practice. I suppose you can view Belkar from the the protagonist’s perspective (what a nuisance!) or just enjoy his comedy in a pure sense. I gotta hope that we all like the Monster in the Dark, but even that one might be a bit of a stretch. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7807 "2013-10-31T04:57:05Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > Seems to be following the paradigm in OOTS of villains failing because they get too mad/emotionally addled to fight optimally or smartly: Miko, Tsukiko, Darth V I’m not sure I accept your premise, except maybe in Darth V’s case. Miko failed (and ultimately died) of being certain of obviously wrong things (Shujo was a traitor, the Gods had a plan for her). Tsukiko died of being an idiot. Neither Tsukiko nor Miko died of losing their cool under fire. ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7808 "2013-10-31T05:16:29Z")
> [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > For such a formidable guy, I’m surprised Tarquin’s most powerful weapon (that we know about) is a dagger We also knwo about the axe that he broke out of storage to fight the OOTS. And subsequently lost, but he didn’t seem to shed a tear over it. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7809 "2013-10-31T05:26:06Z")
> [@squeegee](#): > > We also knwo about the axe that he broke out of storage to fight the OOTS. And subsequently lost, but he didn’t seem to shed a tear over it. And a [whip](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0863.html) that we haven’t seen since. > [@Measure\_for\_Measure](#): > > For such a formidable guy, I’m surprised Tarquin’s most powerful weapon (that we know about) is a dagger. I mean a +3 dagger still doesn’t do much damage right? I recall Burlew’s comment after Nale was killed that it does “1d4 + plot” damage. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 6:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7810 "2013-10-31T06:07:45Z")
> [@Gray\_Ghost](#): > > Seems kinda cheap for Tarquin to bite it here, and he’d be an asset against Xykon and the rest, but that seems to be the way Burlew is guiding the plot? I find it hard to believe that Tarquin would die without us learning what Laurin’s favor was she wanted from him and without any interaction from Sabine. I could be wrong but that’s just my feeling. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7811 "2013-10-31T08:23:06Z")
> [@squeegee](#): > > I’m not sure I accept your premise, except maybe in Darth V’s case. Miko failed (and ultimately died) of being certain of obviously wrong things (Shujo was a traitor, the Gods had a plan for her). Tsukiko died of being an idiot. Neither Tsukiko nor Miko died of losing their cool under fire. Plus, when \*Roy \*lost his cool that one time,[things turned out pretty well.](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0114.html) ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7812 "2013-10-31T09:12:02Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I find it hard to believe that Tarquin would die without us learning what Laurin’s favor was she wanted from him and without any interaction from Sabine. I could be wrong but that’s just my feeling. I agree. Tarquin is making too many enemies to escape now through a quick death (unless he also gets a quick rez). I’m seeing **Miron** dying though - imagine how pissed Laurin and the remainder of their group will be if Tarquin’s family matters get _two_ of their group killed in short order. Laurin’s “favor” will undoubtedly be extremely unpleasant for Tarquin…and that’s all before Sabine gets her turn. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 9:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7813 "2013-10-31T09:38:53Z")
Maybe Laurin’s favour is to give up this nonsense, which she will deem fulfilled as he lays dying. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 11:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7814 "2013-10-31T11:23:54Z")
> [@Guy Rotting](#): > > I agree. Tarquin is making too many enemies to escape now through a quick death (unless he also gets a quick rez). I’m seeing **Miron** dying though - imagine how pissed Laurin and the remainder of their group will be if Tarquin’s family matters get _two_ of their group killed in short order. Laurin’s “favor” will undoubtedly be extremely unpleasant for Tarquin…and that’s all before Sabine gets her turn. Well, it may be the first time that Tarquin’s group has confronted true adversaries. Sure, they’ve been playing the politics/conquest game with each other for a while, but that’s still against NPC and non-class characters. Facing down the OotS is another matter. Laurin, Malack, Tarquin and Miron may be near-Epic level, sure, but the Order is looking to be somewhere around level 14 or so and that’s nothing to sneer at. So for once they’re up against pros…and that’s got to change the game a bit. ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 11:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7815 "2013-10-31T11:53:58Z")
> [@Jonathan Chains](#): > > Well, it may be the first time that Tarquin’s group has confronted true adversaries. You don’t get to the kinds of levels, political power or get the kind of gear these guys are sporting by farming kobolds :). ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7816 "2013-10-31T11:59:04Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > Maybe Laurin’s favour is to give up this nonsense, which she will deem fulfilled as he lays dying. More likely Miron dies, Laurin and Tarquin get smacked around a bit and Laurin zaps the two of them out of there (against Tarquin’s will) before she gets deaded, she tells Catgirl and (can’t remember the last team member) what happened, they gang up on Tarquin who is forced to hand over the reins of the Empire of Blood to one of the others as Laurin’s favor, Tarquin swears revenge on Roy in suitably dramatic fashion, and OotS go off to the next book. This will of course all be proved wrong in the next strip. ETA: Ah - last guy is Fighter Guy, [last seen with Miron “advising” the Weeping King](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0758.html), unless I’ve missed a later appearance. ---
**Author:** ![Jonathan\_Chance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jonathan_chance/32/701_2.png) [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7817 "2013-10-31T14:10:53Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > You don’t get to the kinds of levels, political power or get the kind of gear these guys are sporting by farming kobolds :). Oh, I acknowledge that. But the OotS isn’t exactly chopped liver. At their level they have to be one of the most elite small units in the entire world. Level 14 (approximately) ain’t for just anybody. And Tarquin and company have been doing it manipulatively for a long time now. It’s entirely possible that the OotS is the most dangerous threat they’ve faced in decades. Which is not to say that Xykon and Redcloak aren’t more dangerous. Because they are. But the OotS has experience fighting strong opponents where Tarq and co might not. In terms of power/danger I see it this way: 1. Team Evil (As Rich once wrote, taking over the world is a realistic goal for Xykon.) 2. Team Tarquin 3. OotS With the knowledge that Roy and Company are still actively growing as combat adventurers while Team Targuin and growing as political adventurers. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7818 "2013-10-31T14:42:05Z")
I agree with your ranking, but I think we should always give protagonist points to the OotS. This last sequence has been my favorite, but now I am wondering what is going on with Team Evil. Wasn’t there speculation early that he would pop in when he was least expected? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7819 "2013-10-31T14:47:46Z")
They did. Popped into the gate exploding, summoned the sand elemental and popped off again. They assume OOTS is dead. ---
**Author:** ![Gagundathar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a183cd/32.png) [@Gagundathar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gagundathar)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7820 "2013-10-31T14:49:18Z")
Oh my. Is my face red now. My brains must be somehow less efficient than usually today. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2013, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323/7821 "2013-10-31T14:53:57Z")
[http://www.giantitp.com/index.html#y4gGFEGTKuaFz4luwE9](http://www.giantitp.com/index.html#y4gGFEGTKuaFz4luwE9) Burlew marks ten years of OOTS. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=390) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-5-discussion-thread/508323.md?page=392)