# Order of the Stick - Book 6 Discussion Thread **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [March 3, 2014, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755 "2014-03-03T16:07:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 304
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2019, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6063 "2019-08-18T23:17:29Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Which make for an interesting question: one if I took one small piece and reversed it – can I still reverse the rest later or is the person dead now? I’m speculating that you couldn’t do a partial reversal. The spell turned the person into stone as a single action. Cancelling the spell would turn all of the statute back into all of the person - even if the statute had been broken up since the spell was cast. At that point, some people might discover that the stones they used for building a chimney or wall used to be a person. I’m assuming chaotic evil wizards use this effect for practical jokes. ---
**Author:** ![chorpler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chorpler/32/2888_2.png) [@chorpler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chorpler)\ **Post date:** [August 18, 2019, 11:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6064 "2019-08-18T23:47:21Z")
> [@DesertDog](#): > > (spoiler cut 'cause the tag does not work in a quoted post) > > Please tell methe medusa’s name was Alcor. That would be good, but it was Melissa. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6065 "2019-08-19T00:38:26Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > I’m speculating that you couldn’t do a partial reversal. The spell turned the person into stone as a single action. Cancelling the spell would turn all of the statute back into all of the person - even if the statute had been broken up since the spell was cast. Makes sense. Never really came up in the opposite sense – if a statued person lost some chips, no one worried if the missing chips became little lumps of flesh somewhere but maybe they did. So now, what’s the range? If I take a part and travel a continent away, is the remainder still affected? What if I travel to another plane of existence? I suppose a fair DM ruling would just be that you needed to have 50.01%+ of the stone for the spell to be successful. At that point, I could ignore whether or not the remaining 49-odd percent was transmuted back or not. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6066 "2019-08-19T03:15:26Z")
Of course, Stone to Flesh also works on ordinary, natural stone that was never fleshy (before now). So if you need all of the statue-bits for the reversal form to work, that might be a way to discover that the stone you have _isn’t_ natural. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 7:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6067 "2019-08-19T07:08:31Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > spoiler for _Snips Snails and Dragon Tales_. > > There’s a Durkon story where he encounters a medusa. Slight diversionary rant here: I HATE that DnD did this to Medusa when the perfectly generic name gorgon already exists. Like what they did to Pegasus, but compounded by them naming their khalkotaurus expy “gorgon” for an idiocy-in-naming twofer ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6068 "2019-08-19T08:23:18Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Slight diversionary rant here It could have been worse. Just be glad they didn’t decide to rename dragons as puffs. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6069 "2019-08-19T08:37:25Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > It could have been worse. Just be glad they didn’t decide to rename dragons as puffs. Naah, this is Gygax we’re talking about - he’d have called them _smaugs_. I believe his motto was “_First_ rip off Tolkien, then look around” Until he was forced to go with _fafnirs_ [for legal reasons](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halfling_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons)). ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 12:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6070 "2019-08-19T12:10:46Z")
You can’t blame gorgons on Gygax. Medieval bestiaries had a “gorgon” as something resembled an armor-plated bull with noxious breath. In fact, rather a lot of D&D traces back to those medieval bestiaries. One imagines that they were popular among much the same demographic as play D&D nowadays. Nerds have always been with us. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6071 "2019-08-19T13:19:20Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > You can’t blame gorgons on Gygax. You’re right I can’t blame him for first _coming up with_ the idea of a bull-shaped monster called gorgon. I can certainly blame him for including it under that name, one entry under “Medusae”, and changing the breath from poison to petrifying. That’s all on him. > [@](#): > > Medieval bestiaries Topsel isn’t mediaeval, and AFAIK he’s the only period one who had a bull-shaped gorgon. I’m happy to be shown otherwise. [/quote] In fact, rather a lot of D&D traces back to those medieval bestiaries. [/quote] That doesn’t absolve Gygax of blame for not doing his research. And I mean, c’mon, ultimately he was just lazy - “Nick it from White or _Fantastic Bestiary_ and call it done”. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6072 "2019-08-19T13:26:07Z")
Stupid quotes! ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6073 "2019-08-19T13:26:52Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Of course, Stone to Flesh also works on ordinary, natural stone that was never fleshy (before now). So if you need all of the statue-bits for the reversal form to work, that might be a way to discover that the stone you have _isn’t_ natural. True that (although I wouldn’t expect it to come up often). In that case, I’d likely rule that a petrified character who loses 50%+ of their body is dead and _Stone to Flesh_ only restores life (if at all) to the major portion. It occurs to me that I almost never used _Stone to Flesh_ effects in my games or see it used in games I play. I suspect because it’s either an effect where it’s easily mitigated (either by player spells or the inevitable reversal scroll in a handy chest nearby) or it just wrecks the character for a single failed save. In neither case is it especially fun. But the net result is that I never spent much time considering what happens to a busted up statue-guy’s soul in the meanwhile. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6074 "2019-08-19T13:42:59Z")
OK, **MrDibble** , it sounds like you know more about this than I, so I will bow to your expertise. But I’m still waiting for D&D stats for a bonnacon. Maybe even the devs have their limits. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [August 19, 2019, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6075 "2019-08-19T15:00:34Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > OK, **MrDibble** , it sounds like you know more about this than I, so I will bow to your expertise. > > But I’m still waiting for D&D stats for a bonnacon. Maybe even the devs have their limits. If you play 3.5 (or Pathfinder, probably), [you’re covered](https://www.dandwiki.com/wiki/Bonnacon_(3.5e_Creature)). In dung, probably, but still… ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2019, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6076 "2019-08-20T13:18:57Z")
**1176**. [1176 Die or Die Trying - Giant in the Playground Games](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots1176.html) ---
**Author:** ![Gray\_Ghost](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/c0e974/32.png) [@Gray\_Ghost](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gray_Ghost)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2019, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6077 "2019-08-20T13:25:33Z")
I’ve not seen a God fade away like that before. Hel is a major god in their pantheon too. If she completely fades out, that’s it for her, right? She can’t come back? Does another god take on her duties then? Or do they have to wait until enough worshippers start thinking that there needs to be something like a God of Death? Loki’s demeanor is worrisome too. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2019, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6078 "2019-08-20T14:38:42Z")
We don’t know enough about how the Stickworld deities work to guess at what happens if a deity stops existing, etc (especially from a major pantheon) but Loki is probably upset about both his daughter being obviously unwell and her desire to destroy him in the next world. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2019, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6079 "2019-08-20T14:49:12Z")
Loki: _tricks Hel into giving up her ability to make clerics_ Hel: _reacts negatively_ Loki: _surprised pikachu face_ ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2019, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6080 "2019-08-20T14:59:45Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > We don’t know enough about how the Stickworld deities work to guess at what happens if a deity stops existing, etc (especially from a major pantheon) but Loki is probably upset about both his daughter being obviously unwell and her desire to destroy him in the next world. I think he also sees the truth in what she’s saying. They still can’t stop the Snarl. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2019, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6081 "2019-08-20T15:10:15Z")
> [@Inner\_Stickler](#): > > Loki: _tricks Hel into giving up her ability to make clerics_ > Hel: _reacts negatively_ > Loki: _surprised pikachu face_ Haha. Although maybe he didn’t realize just how negatively it would affect her health. Although we learned that Odin got screwed up when his people stopped worshiping him last go-around so it couldn’t have been a real surprise. Maybe we’ll get more exposition in a week! > [@Alessan](#): > > I think he also sees the truth in what she’s saying. They still can’t stop the Snarl. Maybe. But I assume he’s on the “Convince the Dark One” train so he’s got some reason to hope. ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2019, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755/6082 "2019-08-20T15:19:41Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > Haha. Although maybe he didn’t realize just how negatively it would affect her health. Although we learned that Odin got screwed up when his people stopped worshiping him last go-around so it couldn’t have been a real surprise. Maybe we’ll get more exposition in a week! I’m sure. I was just amused at the idea that Loki, a CE god, would be genuinely surprised that someone doesn’t love getting backstabbed. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755.md?page=303) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-book-6-discussion-thread/682755.md?page=305)