# Order of the Stick General Discussion Thread (Open Spoilers and Speculation) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 2, 2009, 7:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096 "2009-02-02T07:39:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 48
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/941 "2009-05-06T15:26:29Z")
I can so see that happening. ---
**Author:** ![ultrafilter](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/3d9bf3/32.png) [@ultrafilter](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultrafilter)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/942 "2009-05-06T15:31:06Z")
Xykon has charmed the monster before (see Start of Darkness), and could do it again, in which case the monster would probably not ignore V’s attack. It’s difficult to say exactly what would happen without knowing what the monster is, but the fight would not be a guaranteed win for Vaarsuvius. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/943 "2009-05-06T16:21:12Z")
I’m thinking tarrasque. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/944 "2009-05-06T16:23:33Z")
> [@](#): > > Lets see… comes from a jungle (but not neccessarily born there), father is much bigger and eats a lot… anyone? Something from Mesoamerican myth, maybe? The most plausible theory I’ve heard is that it’s a young [tarrasque](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarrasque_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons)). Most of its known characteristics would fit except for its size (tarrasques are huge) and its relative intelligence (tarrasques can’t speak). eta: Like Ogre said. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/945 "2009-05-06T16:28:28Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The most plausible theory I’ve heard is that it’s a young [tarrasque](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarrasque_(Dungeons_%26_Dragons)). Most of its known characteristics would fit except for its size (tarrasques are huge) and its relative intelligence (tarrasques can’t speak). > > eta: Like Ogre said. I wonder if size, rapacity, and dumbness are all developmental traits in tarrasques. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/946 "2009-05-06T16:37:29Z")
I have to admit that a tarrasque crossed my mind, too (you should SEE the trail of destruction!), but isn’t a tarrasque meant to be a unique creature. i.e., there isn’t a “species” of tarrasque so much as there is A tarrasque. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/947 "2009-05-06T16:59:40Z")
> [@](#): > > Nah, remember, it wipes out anyone even VAGUELY related. So we’re talking distant cousins, uncles, aunts, unknown siblings and their descendants. Actually, I think it gets cut off whenever it reaches an already-dead relative. So it might not actually kill anyone but Redcloak himself, since all of his immediate relatives are already dead. And I think that a young Godzilla is a lot more plausible than a young Tarrasque. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/948 "2009-05-06T17:14:42Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Actually, I think it gets cut off whenever it reaches an already-dead relative. So it might not actually kill anyone but Redcloak himself, since all of his immediate relatives are already dead. > > And I think that a young Godzilla is a lot more plausible than a young Tarrasque. Aren’t they essentially the same thing? Rampant engines of pure, mindless destruction? ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/949 "2009-05-06T17:21:59Z")
Oh _crap_. Rich really knows how to create tension and cliffhangers. I was hoping against hope that Redcloak and the MitD wouldn’t be near Xykon when V found him. At least then V stood a good chance. But this is not good. This is not good at all. My hope is that O-Chul has swayed the MitD enough, and perhaps if nothing else, V can save O-Chul at last. Then again … can O-Chul still do stuff like “detect evil” in his current state? He may well not trust the elf if he senses the soul splices. > [@Just\_Some\_Guy](#): > > FWIW I’ve checked the 1e random encounter tables for jungles and there’s nothing remotely like him there. I’m still betting on giant firebreathing space hamster (yes, choie, that one’s real). LOL. You know me too well! (Yes, I assumed you were joking.) Edited to add: The familicide discussion is purely hypothetical, right? The necromancer has left the building. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/950 "2009-05-06T17:31:55Z")
For what it’s worth, here’s some images of what a full-size tarrasque might look like. [here](http://www.aethertraveller.com/images/tarrasque.gif) [here](http://idiscepolidellamanticora.files.wordpress.com/2009/01/20080418_114693_0.jpg) [here](http://www.fierydragon.com/Pix/tarrasque.jpg) [here](http://arcona.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/tarrasque.png?w=291&h=300) [here](http://www.wizards.com/dnd/images/art_preview/20080418_114693_1.jpg) [here](http://d21-gaming.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2007/06/elite_tarrasque.jpg) [here](http://www.francescobarbi.it/rassegna/images/tarrasque.jpg) [here](http://www.wilsonsalmanac.com/images1/tarasque3.gif) [here](http://members.tripod.com/%7Egfriebe/tarasque.jpg) [here](http://www.atelier-du-grimeur.com/images/persos/tarasque.jpg) [here](http://www.scifi.com/destinationtruth/images/quizzes/inset_tarasque.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/951 "2009-05-06T18:15:04Z")
> [@Ogre](#): > > Aren’t they essentially the same thing? Rampant engines of pure, mindless destruction? Strictly speaking, Godzilla would be a reptilian-type kaiju. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/952 "2009-05-06T18:49:24Z")
I like the theory that the monster is some sort of rock creature, based on the evidence that [paper beats rock](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0375.html), while [rock beats blade](http://www.giantitp.com/comics/oots0477.html) ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/953 "2009-05-06T18:55:17Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Strictly speaking, Godzilla would be a reptilian-type kaiju. Sure, but the parallels are unmistakable. Both the tarrasque and Godzilla are unique (or near-unique) “boss” monsters whose origins, motivations, life cycles, _raison d’etre_, etc. are unknown. All we really know is that one day, for some reason, they appear out of the abyss, and start whomping ass. They leave a path of pure, elemental destruction behind them. They soak up massive amounts of punishment, and in the end, they go back to the abyss with all of (remaining) humanity standing there thinking, “WTF was that?!” I think they’re both mythological metaphors for earthquakes, volcanoes, tsunamis, and epidemics. But what do I know? In other words, I think the Japanese would be as willing to call the French tarrasque “kaiju”, if it suddenly appeared in the middle of Tokyo. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/954 "2009-05-06T19:07:32Z")
Possibly. Then again, the only movies in which Godzilla’s a real bad guy are the first Godzilla and the remakes. In most of those rubber-suit movies, Godzilla’s defending Japan. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/955 "2009-05-06T19:10:18Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > Possibly. Then again, the only movies in which Godzilla’s a real bad guy are the first Godzilla and the remakes. In most of those rubber-suit movies, Godzilla’s defending Japan. Bah. BAH. ---
**Author:** ![appleciders](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85f322/32.png) [@appleciders](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/appleciders)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/956 "2009-05-06T19:21:20Z")
Can anyone explain the significance of the _Go_ game allegory that O-Chul made? I don’t play the game well enough to get it. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/957 "2009-05-06T19:29:20Z")
Quoth **Little Nemo** : > [@](#): > > For what it’s worth, here’s some images of what a full-size tarrasque might look like. The last few of those are the original French Tarrasque, though, a much smaller beast which is basically just misunderstood, and was killed by a handful of villagers, not the D&D Tarrasque. And while the D&D Tarrasque is almost certainly inspired by Godzilla, Godzilla is certainly a lot bigger, and probably considerably more powerful as well (G is somewhere between [50 and 100 meters tall](http://www.historyvortex.org/HowBigGodzilla.html), depending on the movie, and breathes radioactive fire and electrocutes with a touch, while T is [url=“[Tarrasque :: d20srd.org](http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/tarrasque.htm)”]50 _feet_ tall, and has no special attacks fancier than biting stuff really hard). ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/958 "2009-05-06T19:39:25Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Quoth **Little Nemo** :The last few of those are the original French Tarrasque, though, a much smaller beast which is basically just misunderstood, and was killed by a handful of villagers, not the D&D Tarrasque. And while the D&D Tarrasque is almost certainly inspired by Godzilla, Godzilla is certainly a lot bigger, and probably considerably more powerful as well (G is somewhere between [50 and 100 meters tall](http://www.historyvortex.org/HowBigGodzilla.html), depending on the movie, and breathes radioactive fire and electrocutes with a touch, while T is [url=“[Tarrasque :: d20srd.org](http://www.d20srd.org/srd/monsters/tarrasque.htm)”]50 _feet_ tall, and has no special attacks fancier than biting stuff really hard). The D&D tarrasque is basically a tank, right? It eats stuff, destroys stuff, and is almost impossible to kill. I do wonder if the tarrasque angle can possibly be correct, given MitD’s already-demonstrated “earthquake stomp”. I don’t think that trick is in the tarrasque’s armory. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/959 "2009-05-06T19:43:46Z")
Can’t be a trarasque - they don’t have an Earthquake attack IFAIK. ---
**Author:** ![Ogre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ecb155/32.png) [@Ogre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ogre)\ **Post date:** [May 6, 2009, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096/960 "2009-05-06T19:57:53Z")
On a quick google, the only critters I’m coming up with that have an earthquake attack are planetars and solars, and earth elementals. I wonder if Big X could have cursed an angel somehow to reduce its intelligence? That would be interesting. The earth elemental would be too obvious, I think. But then we lose the “jungle” lead. I dunno. I don’t really know shit about the inner workings of D&D. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096.md?page=47) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/order-of-the-stick-general-discussion-thread-open-spoilers-and-speculation/484096.md?page=49)