# Oregon is south of Washington!
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617
**Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
**Created:** [November 27, 2022, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617 "2022-11-27T04:14:20Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/1 "2022-11-27T04:14:20Z")
So, US geography is perhaps not my strong suit.
I learnt in school about the US-British dispute over the Oregon territory. So that means that the boundary runs between British Columbia and Oregon, right?
But no! There’s this whole other state between BC and Oregon! Why wasn’t I told?!?
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### Author:  [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 4:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/2 "2022-11-27T04:18:58Z")
“Oregon” at the time referred to a huge territory that roughly included modern Oregon, Washington, Idaho, and British Columbia.
> **[Oregon Country](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_Country)**
>
> Oregon Country was a large region of the Pacific Northwest of North America that was subject to a long dispute between the United Kingdom and the United States in the early 19th century. The area, which had been created by the Treaty of 1818, consisted of the land north of 42°N latitude, south of 54°40′N latitude, and west of the Rocky Mountains down to the Pacific Ocean and east to the Continental Divide. Article III of the 1818 treaty gave joint control to both nations for ten years, allowed la...
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### Author:  [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/3 "2022-11-27T04:20:43Z")
I grew up in Oregon, so local Pacific NW geography was perhaps slightly more emphasized than for people in other areas. Perhaps in Canada they just don’t teach that part.
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### Author:  [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 4:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/4 "2022-11-27T04:22:17Z")
The really disturbing thing is I was once at a conference in Seattle and hadn’t picked up that I was in this geographic anomaly.
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### Author:  [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/5 "2022-11-27T05:35:48Z")
The provincial capital of BC is over 30’ south of the 49th parallel. Also, most of the population of the state of Oregon is concentrated in an area that is more northerly than where most of the population of Canada is concentrated.
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### Author:  [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/6 "2022-11-27T05:43:18Z")
Moreover, at one point the British had settlements on the coastline south of Seattle!
> **[Fort Nisqually](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fort_Nisqually)**
>
> Fort Nisqually was an important fur trading and farming post of the Hudson's Bay Company in the Puget Sound area, part of the Hudson's Bay Company's Columbia Department. It was located in what is now DuPont, Washington. Today it is a living history museum located in Tacoma, Washington, USA, within the boundaries of Point Defiance Park. The Fort Nisqually Granary, moved along with the Factor's House from the original site of the second fort to this park, is a U.S. National Historic Landmark. B...
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### Author:  [@Darth\_Sensitive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darth_Sensitive)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/7 "2022-11-27T05:45:27Z")
Your teacher should have told you that, from south to north, they spell C-O-W
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### Author:  [@Bootb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bootb)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/8 "2022-11-27T06:56:56Z")
One of the more obscure features of American history is that territories very often changed at some point during the process of becoming a state. It’s already been mentioned that Oregon territory included what is now Washington state. Here’s a map of Kansas territory. You can see that it originally included much of Colorado.
[ ](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/4/42/Kansasterritory.PNG)
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### Author:  [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 8:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/9 "2022-11-27T08:14:19Z")
[ ](https://www.legendsofamerica.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/06/LouisianaTerritory.jpg)
I’m sure modern Louisiana feels cheated.
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### Author:  [@OttoDaFe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OttoDaFe)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/10 "2022-11-27T08:37:48Z")
Bet they never taught you about the [1859 Pig War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pig_War_(1859)), either. Sheesh.
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### Author:  [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 8:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/11 "2022-11-27T08:43:16Z")
And Utah territory was hacked down:
[ ](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/97/Utah_Territory%2C_vector_image_-_2011.svg/560px-Utah_Territory%2C_vector_image_-_2011.svg.png)
Of course, this was after the Mormons’ proposal for the State of Deseret (note that the final “t” is pronounced) wasn’t accepted, even though it was self governed for two years.
[ ](https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/5/57/State_of_Deseret%2C_vector_image_cropped_-_2011.svg/640px-State_of_Deseret%2C_vector_image_cropped_-_2011.svg.png)
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### Author:  [@Die\_Capacitrix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Die_Capacitrix)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 9:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/12 "2022-11-27T09:17:13Z")
> [@OttoDaFe](#):
>
> Bet they never taught you about the [1859 Pig War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pig_War_(1859)), either.
As a native Washingtonian, I learned about this during Washington State history. 54°40′ or fight!
> **[Oregon boundary dispute](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oregon_boundary_dispute)**
>
> The Oregon boundary dispute or the Oregon Question was a 19th-century territorial dispute over the political division of the Pacific Northwest of North America between several nations that had competing territorial and commercial aspirations in the region.
> Expansionist competition into the region began in the 18th century, with participants including the Russian Empire, Great Britain, Spain, and the United States. After the War of 1812, the Oregon dispute took on increased importance for diploma...
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### Author:  [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 9:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/13 "2022-11-27T09:47:33Z")
To make matters even more confusing, the city of Vancouver is just North past the US border into Canada, and Portland Oregon is bordered on the north by the city of Vancouver.
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### Author:  [@Northern\_Piper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Northern_Piper)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/14 "2022-11-27T10:00:11Z")
> [@OttoDaFe](#):
>
> Bet they never taught you about the [1859 Pig War](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pig_War_(1859)), either
Oh, that we learnt about. War over a pig? Fascinating!
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### Author:  [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 10:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/15 "2022-11-27T10:15:03Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#):
>
> the city of Vancouver is just North past the US border into Canada, and Portland Oregon is bordered on the north by the city of Vancouver.
I recall the Seattle Jack-FM affiliate running a promo once that said they were broadcasting “from Vancouver to Vancouver”.
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### Author:  [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 10:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/16 "2022-11-27T10:54:59Z")
When I was eighteen I rode the bus to Portland O, from California, to go to college there. I asked someone where the ocean was. He just looked at me contemptuously. Despite its name, Portland is eighty miles from the Pacific (the Columbia is navigable all the way there), unlike Portland Maine, dead opposite 3000 miles away on the Atlantic.
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### Author:  [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/17 "2022-11-27T15:21:03Z")
> [@TokyoBayer](#):
>
> And Utah territory was hacked down:
This is the rule rather than the exception. Nearly every state west of the Appalachians started as a much larger territory that was later divided before statehood: Ohio, Indiana, Michigan, Wisconsin, Iowa, Nebraska, Missouri, Mississippi, Arkansas, Kansas, Dakota, Washington, Idaho, …
Even several eastern seaboard states started larger: Massachusetts (which included Maine), New York (which included Vermont), Virginia (which included everything north of North Carolina to the Mississippi river), North Carolina, Georgia, Florida, …
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### Author:  [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/18 "2022-11-27T15:48:47Z")
Well, Oregon’s little nub of a panhandle that includes Astoria, is more north than Vancouver, WA and all of the WA side of the Columbia River, so part of Oregon is north of part of Washington.
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/19 "2022-11-27T16:03:42Z")
> [@Acsenray](#):
>
> Even several eastern seaboard states started larger: Massachusetts (which included Maine), New York (which included Vermont), Virginia (which included everything north of North Carolina to the Mississippi river), North Carolina, Georgia, Florida, …
The land that became Cleveland was once part of Connecticut.
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### Author:  [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)
#### Post date: [November 27, 2022, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oregon-is-south-of-washington/975617/20 "2022-11-27T16:11:05Z")
> [@Chronos](#):
>
> land that became Cleveland was once part of Connecticut.
That’s in my post. See the ellipses?
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