# Origin of: "...bread, wine and thou"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 27, 2004, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379 "2004-04-27T23:35:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2004, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/1 "2004-04-27T23:35:33Z")
Where did this saying come from? I know I’m a little bit off (in more than one way), but it’s something like “A loaf of bread, a jug of wine, and thou”. But, where did this come from? (Author and book title - or play title - please!) - Jinx ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2004, 11:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/2 "2004-04-27T23:40:16Z")
It is from “The Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam.” Check here. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![TV\_time](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/f17d59/32.png) [@TV\_time](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TV_time)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2004, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/3 "2004-04-28T00:02:06Z")
Much of what was actually written in English, such as the quote you point to, is credited to the translator (Fitzgerald, I believe, but it is the end of the day and I am pooped and I am too tired to look it up). I mean the essense is there but the tranlator really created the emotional poetry of the piece. TV ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2004, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/4 "2004-04-28T00:04:28Z")
To be exact, it’s from the 1859 Edward FitzGerald translation. This is the Victorian classic translation that went into all the classrooms, so its lines are the most famous. He is said to have taken many liberties with verses to give their flavor into English. There are many other translations, and since I keep hitting dead links I can’t tell whether others think the original Persian said anything resembling this. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2004, 12:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/5 "2004-04-28T00:20:03Z")
Specifically, it’s from the Fitzgerald translation of the Rubaiyat, which was immensely popular in the 19th century (and later). Fitz took some liberties with the poem, rearranging stanzas to give the impression of a passing day that’s _not_ in the original. The Penguin edition of the poem is a more modern translation. But Ftzgerald’s has been so influential, and given so many lines ("…the moving finger writes, and having writ, moves on…") that it’s become a classic in its own right. The fuller quote (as I’m sure the link gives is much more even in that stanza than “a loaf of bread, a jug of wine, and thou”, going on to note that’…and thou beside me in the Wilderness, and wilderness is Paradise enow." Worth the read. As the bit about the wine indicates, Omar Khayyam was not exactly a strict Muslim. He was Persian, not strictly orthodox, and, I as surpised to learn, a mathematician. The IBM timeline of mathematics (it’s in the Chicago Museum of Science asnd Industry, the Boston Museum of Science, and the LA County Museum, among others) gives him a box all to himself as an influential mathematician, although some folks apparently doubt that he really was. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2004, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/6 "2004-04-28T01:59:23Z")
Here’s an earlier thread with some good commentary: > **[Where can I get a good "moving finger?"](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=58491)** > > Anyone know of a good translation of The Rubaiyat of Omar Khayyam? Most of us are familiar with the “classic” translation of Edward FitzGerald, but my understanding is that he took great liberties with the quatrains, even combining and condensing... (And I still haven’t found a good “moving finger.”)😃 ---
**Author:** ![Jinx](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Jinx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jinx)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2004, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/7 "2004-04-28T02:24:26Z")
Not exactly the breakfast of champions now, is it? 😃 Thanks y’all for the replies! - Jinx ---
**Author:** ![Baldwin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/baldwin/32/7264_2.png) [@Baldwin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Baldwin)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2004, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-bread-wine-and-thou/242379/8 "2004-04-28T04:29:19Z")
A friend of mine wrote this variation: _A loaf of bread, a jug of wine, and thou Underneath a palm tree, oh wow. So come on girl, give it all you got And I’ll give you a ruby and a yacht._