# Origin of Ginger **URL:** \ **Category:** Cecil's Columns/Staff Reports\ **Created:** [May 2, 2001, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087 "2001-05-02T15:05:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2001, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/1 "2001-05-02T15:05:31Z")
[http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mgingerbread.html](http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mgingerbread.html) \*Good job on the history of ginger, Dex. Just wanted to note a fine point of etymology … > [@](#): > > The name itself, _zingiber_, means horn-shaped in Sanskrit, based on the shape of the rhizomes (rootstalks). _Zingiber_ is the Greek form of the word, from Arabic _zanjabîl_, from Sanskrit _s’ringivera_. Actually, the Sanskrit word itself is derived from a loanword from Dravidian. The Proto-Dravidian word for ginger was \*_ciñci_, and _vêr_ means ‘root’ (in Tamil, the word for ginger is now _iñci_, and _vêr_ still means root). Sanskrit borrowed the compound \*_ciñci vêr_, ‘ginger root’. In Sanskrit they made what is known as a “folk etymology” by merging this unfamiliar word from another language with a similar-sounding word in Sanskrit that seemed to make sense. _S’ringa_ is the Sanskrit word for ‘horn’ (from Proto-Indo-European \*ker-no-, related to English _horn_, Latin _cornu_, and _Cernunnos_, the ancient Celtic Horned God; it’s also connected with Semitic words for horn: compare Arabic _qarn_, Hebrew _qeren_). The ginger rhizome does branch in a way that vaguely resembles antlers, but the original Dravidian word is unrelated to the Indo-European words for horn. Another Dravidian “root” word 😉 in English is _vetiver_ from Tamil _veTTi vêr_, ‘dug-up root’ (_veTTi_ is from the verbal root _veL-_ meaning ‘to cut, chop, dig’). They dig it up because it’s so useful. ---
**Author:** ![binaryfairy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a183cd/32.png) [@binaryfairy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/binaryfairy)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/2 "2013-09-02T05:22:39Z")
Very interesting and thorough article! Anyone have info on the Thai drink mentioned? I couldn’t find anything searching online for khing sot. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2013, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/3 "2013-09-02T05:35:49Z")
> [@binaryfairy](#): > > Very interesting and thorough article! Anyone have info on the Thai drink mentioned? I couldn’t find anything searching online for khing sot. Thanks! [These](https://www.google.com/search?q=%22khing+sot%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a) are the only links I can find. Khing sot seems to be more of a ginger syrup used for cooking than ginger drink. ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_Coyne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c6cbf5/32.png) [@Tim\_Coyne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_Coyne)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/4 "2013-09-03T02:23:22Z")
Thought she was on a three hour tour ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 6:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/5 "2013-09-03T06:14:13Z")
Now, in 2013, the internet comes up with new information: “Grantham Gingerbread” is a type of cookie/biscuit/pastry invented in the “early 1700’s” and re-popularized in 2011. [http://granthamgingerbread.com/pages/front-page](http://granthamgingerbread.com/pages/front-page) ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 11:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/6 "2013-09-03T11:38:49Z")
Sigh. That Staff Report was from a lonnnnng time ago, I guess I’ll have to track down whether it needs to be amended. Thanks for the info, **Johanna.** ---
**Author:** ![Powers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Powers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Powers)\ **Post date:** [September 3, 2013, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/7 "2013-09-03T13:26:48Z")
> [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](#): > > Sigh. That Staff Report was from a lonnnnng time ago, I guess I’ll have to track down whether it needs to be amended. Thanks for the info, **Johanna.** It’s too bad you didn’t see her post 12 years ago. =) Powers &8^] ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2013, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/8 "2013-09-05T05:51:15Z")
> [@binaryfairy](#): > > Very interesting and thorough article! Anyone have info on the Thai drink mentioned? I couldn’t find anything searching online for khing sot. Thanks! > [@Czarcasm](#): > > [These](https://www.google.com/search?q=%22khing+sot%22&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a) are the only links I can find. Khing sot seems to be more of a ginger syrup used for cooking than ginger drink. Try searching without the H: “king sot” in parentheses to keep those together along with the word ginger. [I came up with this on Google](https://www.google.co.th/?gws_rd=cr&ei=CRooUoPXNIyJrAf394GoDA#q=%22king+sot%22+ginger). _King_ literally means “fresh ginger,” _king_ meaning “ginger.” It’s pronounced closer to a G sound, which is why it’s usually not transliterated with the H, which would give the K a K sound. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2013, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/9 "2013-09-05T06:04:30Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Try searching without the H: “king sot” in parentheses to keep those together along with the word ginger. [I came up with this on Google](https://www.google.co.th/?gws_rd=cr&ei=CRooUoPXNIyJrAf394GoDA#q=%22king+sot%22+ginger). _King_ literally means “fresh ginger,” _king_ meaning “ginger.” It’s pronounced closer to a G sound, which is why it’s usually not transliterated with the H, which would give the K a K sound. Ah, and one more thing. Upon conferring with my Thai wife to be sure I was correct, the actual drink is called _namking_ or _nam king_. Googling “nam king” + ginger + drink gets you [this](https://www.google.co.th/?gws_rd=cr&ei=CRooUoPXNIyJrAf394GoDA#q=%22nam+king%22+ginger+drink). Adding the H gets you [a substantial albeit fewer number of hits](https://www.google.co.th/?gws_rd=cr&ei=CRooUoPXNIyJrAf394GoDA#q=%22nam+khing%22+ginger+drink&spell=1). And I see sometimes _sot_ is rendered _sod_ due to the vagaries of transliteration. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2013, 9:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/10 "2013-09-05T09:19:23Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Try searching without the H: “king sot” in parentheses to keep those together along with the word ginger. [I came up with this on Google](https://www.google.co.th/?gws_rd=cr&ei=CRooUoPXNIyJrAf394GoDA#q=%22king+sot%22+ginger). **_King_ literally means “fresh ginger,” _king_ meaning “ginger.”** It’s pronounced closer to a G sound, which is why it’s usually not transliterated with the H, which would give the K a K sound. Well, I screwed _that_ up. I meant to say: _King **sot** _ literally means “fresh ginger,” _king_ meaning “ginger.” ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2013, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/11 "2013-09-05T16:38:43Z")
From the OP: > [@](#): > > S’ringa is the Sanskrit word for ‘horn’ (from Proto-Indo-European \*ker-no-… OK, I can see how one gets from \*ker-no- to cornu, but how does one get from \*ker-no- to s’ringa? I mean, they both have an n and an r in them, and k is similar to g, but they’re in a completely different order. And where does the s come from? ---
**Author:** ![newme](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/e0b2c6/32.png) [@newme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/newme)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2013, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/12 "2013-09-05T22:48:15Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > OK, I can see how one gets from \*ker-no- to cornu, but how does one get from \*ker-no- to s’ringa? I mean, they both have an n and an r in them, and k is similar to g, but they’re in a completely different order. And where does the s come from? \*ker-no- has 3 consonants, k r n. /r/ stayed the same. /n/ became /ŋ/ or /ŋg/ /k/ became \, which I believe is pronounced like the English \ How can a /k/ become an \, you may ask? The same way a ‘hard c’ in Latin became \ in Italian and a ‘soft c’ or /s/ in Spanish. Latin _Caesar_ (pronounced like English _kaiser_) Italian _Cesare_ (pronounced like chez ah ray) Spanish \*César (_pronounced say zar_) \*In English, /k/ has become \ in certain circumstances. We have verb-noun word pairs where the verb has a /k/ or /g/ sound and the noun has a \ sound: _Bake a batch. Make a match. Stick a stitch. Dig a ditch. Cook in a kitchen._ It’s not hard to imagine a sequence where /k/ becomes \ which becomes \ over time. ---
**Author:** ![Powers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/edb3f5/32.png) [@Powers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Powers)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2013, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/13 "2013-09-11T17:00:38Z")
> [@newme](#): > > _Bake a batch. > Make a match. > Stick a stitch. > Dig a ditch. > Cook in a kitchen._ How is it that I’ve spoken English for 35 years and never noticed these correlations before? Powers &8^] ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 5:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/14 "2013-10-12T05:58:06Z")
> [@Powers](#): > > It’s too bad you didn’t see her post 12 years ago. =) Hey, he finally noticed! Cool. 🆒 > [@newme](#): > > \*ker-no- has 3 consonants, k r n. > /r/ stayed the same. > /n/ became /ŋ/ or /ŋg/ > /k/ became \, which I believe is pronounced like the English \ > > How can a /k/ become an \, you may ask? The same way a ‘hard c’ in Latin became \ in Italian and a ‘soft c’ or /s/ in Spanish. > > Latin _Caesar_ (pronounced like English _kaiser_) > Italian _Cesare_ (pronounced like chez ah ray) > Spanish \*César (_pronounced say zar_) > > \*In English, /k/ has become \ in certain circumstances. We have verb-noun word pairs where the verb has a /k/ or /g/ sound and the noun has a \ sound: > > _Bake a batch. > Make a match. > Stick a stitch. > Dig a ditch. > Cook in a kitchen._ > > It’s not hard to imagine a sequence where /k/ becomes \ which becomes \ over time. A significantly excellent answer in the best Straight Dope tradition. Thanks! ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/15 "2013-10-12T09:32:29Z")
I’ll add to the praise of newme’s elucidation. I, too, was never aware of those pairs. I’ll just add one point which the language mavens here know well: that the “k/s” pairing is so distinctive that scholars of Indo-European languages for many decades considered it THE way to divide them into two groups, popularly known by respective words for “hundred” (_satem_ in Sanskrit, and _centum_ – pronounced ‘kentum’ – in Latin. And with “hundred,” there’s the same Germanic “h” from “cornu/horn”). ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 10:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/16 "2013-10-12T10:17:52Z")
Re: “bake” a “batch,” etc…It occurs to me that Latin sort of did this, too. Verbs with roots ending in the “k” sound (e.g., _fac-ere_ to make, do) usually had a past participle with -kt- (_factus_ made, done, hence “thing made or done”). I’m pretty sure -kt- would evolve into palatized sounds like “ch” even more easily than -k- … See, for example, how Spanish _dig-, dic-_ “say” (the “c” in _dic-_ sounds like an “s”) has the past participle/noun form _dicho_ (a “saying”), from Latin _dictus_. As for more English pairs… Do you _lock_ a _latch_? I believe you do! Do you _Snookie_ some _snatch_? Hmm…maybe not. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 11:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/17 "2013-10-12T11:48:50Z")
One more: You _speak_ a _speech_. ---
**Author:** ![Peremensoe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ce7236/32.png) [@Peremensoe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peremensoe)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 12:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/18 "2013-10-12T12:14:51Z")
Break - breach Drink - drench Seek - search Snag - snatch? 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [October 12, 2013, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/19 "2013-10-12T15:41:33Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > As for more English pairs… Do you _lock_ a _latch_? I believe you do! Do you _Snookie_ some _snatch_? Hmm…maybe not. 🙂 You sneak some snatch. 🙂 This is new to me as well, and I’ve got a shelf full of books on language history. Nice. ---
**Author:** ![C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/b2d939/32.png) [@C\_K\_Dexter\_Haven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/C_K_Dexter_Haven)\ **Post date:** [October 15, 2013, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087/20 "2013-10-15T17:06:09Z")
> [@Powers](#): > > It’s too bad you didn’t see her post 12 years ago. =) Ouch. Sorry 'bout that, and I didn’t even notice that it was a resurrected thread. Life’s been way too hectic for me to have had a chance to look into that old staff report for revision, but it is on my to-do list. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-ginger/64087.md?page=2)