# Origin of Middlesex **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 11, 2013, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038 "2013-12-11T01:49:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![dolphinboy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dolphinboy/32/330_2.png) [@dolphinboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dolphinboy)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/1 "2013-12-11T01:49:05Z")
Mods please move to General Questions… I know where it is, but I don’t get the explanation of where the word comes from. According to this site [What is the origin of the word middlesex? - Answers](http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_is_the_origin_of_the_word_middlesex) the word Middlesex comes from the word Saxon. Southern England was occupied by Saxon tribes and divided into Wessex (West Saxons), Sussex (South Saxons), Essex (East Saxons) and Middlesex (the central Saxons). So how does the word Saxon become -sex? Why not Middlesax? ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/2 "2013-12-11T01:56:22Z")
Vowels are about the least stable part of a word, as it changes in time. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/3 "2013-12-11T02:20:47Z")
In Old English, Saxon was also spelled _Seaxe_, pl. _Seaxan_. The name probably deriving from the [Seax](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seax). So, you can drop a letter in either direction… ---
**Author:** ![Revenant\_Threshold](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f1d935/32.png) [@Revenant\_Threshold](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revenant_Threshold)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/4 "2013-12-11T02:58:10Z")
As a native Middlesexian (Middlesaxon?) I can say that i’ve heard it pronounced in many an accent and find it very easy to believe that it could just be a shift in pronounciation. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/5 "2013-12-11T03:19:23Z")
An earlier thread that may be of interest: [Essex, Sussex, and Wessex... why not "Nossex"? - Factual Questions - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=422765) ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/6 "2013-12-11T13:26:08Z")
Forget about that. I ant to know why there’s no Nossex (North Saxon). ---
**Author:** ![Ellen\_Cherry](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellen_cherry/32/3600_2.png) [@Ellen\_Cherry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ellen_Cherry)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/7 "2013-12-11T14:07:44Z")
Moving from Cafe Society to General Questions. ---
**Author:** ![Colophon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f05b48/32.png) [@Colophon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colophon)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/8 "2013-12-11T15:14:15Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Forget about that. I ant to know why there’s no Nossex (North Saxon). The Nossex tribe swiftly died out, for obvious reasons. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/9 "2013-12-11T15:16:41Z")
> [@Colophon](#): > > The Nossex tribe swiftly died out, for obvious reasons. **Rick** made the same joke in the thread to which I provided a link. Great minds think alike! ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/10 "2013-12-11T15:23:09Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > Forget about that. I ant to know why there’s no Nossex (North Saxon). > [@Colophon](#): > > The Nossex tribe swiftly died out, for obvious reasons. Haven’t you heard of [No Sex Please, We’re British](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Sex_Please,_We%27re_British)? ---
**Author:** ![Inner\_Stickler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inner_stickler/32/318_2.png) [@Inner\_Stickler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inner_Stickler)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/11 "2013-12-11T16:15:50Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > So, you can drop a letter in either direction… The transition to Middle english from Old english basically squashed all diphthongs into monophthongs and /ea/ turned into /a/. We can see it at work in other words like weax and healf which became wax and half. As to why the diphthong /ea/ became /a/, I do not know. ---
**Author:** ![robert\_columbia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e79b87/32.png) [@robert\_columbia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/robert_columbia)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/12 "2013-12-11T16:43:15Z")
> [@Tamerlane](#): > > In Old English, Saxon was also spelled _Seaxe_, pl. _Seaxan_. The name probably deriving from the [Seax](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seax). > > So, you can drop a letter in either direction… Anyone want to have a picnic at Seax-on-the-Beach? ---
**Author:** ![sylmar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b782af/32.png) [@sylmar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sylmar)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 5:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/13 "2013-12-11T17:31:49Z")
nm…ninja’d ---
**Author:** ![njtt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ecd19e/32.png) [@njtt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/njtt)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 8:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/14 "2013-12-11T20:15:13Z")
Of course, neither Wessex nor Middlesex exist any more as counties (though the latter may still be used in postal addresses. Sussex still exists, but in “reality”, [The Only Way is Essex](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Only_Way_Is_Essex). “[Good evening, I’m from Essex, In case you couldn’t tell…](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2KC7kO6Nwsw)” Not actually very proud of the “reality” show, but the song is good. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/15 "2013-12-11T20:30:07Z")
> [@Revenant\_Threshold](#): > > As a native Middlesexian (Middlesaxon?)… …Middlesexual? ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/16 "2013-12-11T21:06:14Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Of course, neither Wessex nor Middlesex exist any more as counties (though the latter may still be used in postal addresses. I used to live in Middlesex, but I think it disappeared (mainly into Greater London) around 1965. However there are still Middlesex County cricket and chess teams… ---
**Author:** ![OldGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/3bc359/32.png) [@OldGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OldGuy)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2013, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/17 "2013-12-11T21:23:10Z")
> [@njtt](#): > > Of course, neither Wessex nor Middlesex exist any more as counties (though the latter may still be used in postal addresses. Not in England, perhaps, but there are Middlesex counties in Massachusetts, Connecticut, and New Jersey and perhaps other US States. ---
**Author:** ![Marion\_Wormer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d07c76/32.png) [@Marion\_Wormer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marion_Wormer)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 12:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/18 "2013-12-12T00:07:18Z")
I always thought it was ‘sex’ as in ‘section’. Middlesex would be the section west of Essex (east section), north of Sussex (south section) and east of Wessex (west section). But apparently, I’m wrong. ---
**Author:** ![casdave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c6cbf5/32.png) [@casdave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/casdave)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 9:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/19 "2013-12-12T09:31:50Z")
Strange how few of those diphthongs have carried over in isolated cases in local dialects. If you happen from around Barnsley way then you will pronounce ‘Tea’ using both the ‘e’ and the ‘a’ separately, it then sounds like ‘taiya’. There are a few other words that they do in the same way. ---
**Author:** ![Princhester](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3e96dc/32.png) [@Princhester](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Princhester)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2013, 10:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038/20 "2013-12-12T10:37:07Z")
> [@dolphinboy](#): > > So how does the word Saxon become -sex? Why not Middlesax? When Cholmondely can come to bepronounced “chumley” and Leicester can come to be pronounced “lester” and lieutenant can come to be pronounced “leftenant” jumping from sax to sex doesn’t even begin to be inexplicable. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-middlesex/676038.md?page=2)