# Origin of stereotype that women faint at sight of mice **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 4, 2005, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007 "2005-12-04T06:34:28Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![KRC](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/45deac/32.png) [@KRC](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KRC)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 6:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/1 "2005-12-04T06:34:28Z")
Anyone who remembers the Tom and Jerry cartoons remembers the woman standing on the chair while yelling hysterically at Tom to get the evil mouse. And as recently as 1967 nature writer Leonard Lee Rue III commented on how “this tiny creature has the power to reduce womankind to a state of helplessness…” There is a common belief that a woman will, for some reason, throw hissy fits if she sees a mouse. I don’t. I’ve never seen another woman do it, and this town is full of mice. Most people don’t like them but that’s it. You just deal. Was this just some old Victorian thing that was expected of women? I’m very curious about the origin of this belief. ---
**Author:** ![cainxinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7bcc69/32.png) [@cainxinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cainxinth)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 8:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/2 "2005-12-04T08:18:15Z")
I’m friendly with the girl who lives in the apartment below mine. She saw a mouse once and asked me to set some traps for her. By which I mean, she freaked the hell out and screamed, “Do something! Do something!” ---
**Author:** ![Strinka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strinka/32/512_2.png) [@Strinka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strinka)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 8:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/3 "2005-12-04T08:30:00Z")
My sister freaks out at mice. But she has a reason. When she was young, she found a dead mouse in the cupboard, which scarred her for life. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/4 "2005-12-04T08:47:25Z")
My wife has a moderate freak out over mice. She has kittens if she ever sees a cockroach. I am required to do something immediately. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/5 "2005-12-04T08:48:25Z")
A girlfriend of mine in college who was and is very intelligent and very assertive (not in a bad way either) would not touch the mousetrap in her apartment after it caught a mouse. I had to pick it up and throw it away. The weird thing was that the mouse ate the bait, didn’t spring the trap, then walked across the trap for no good reason and got caught. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 9:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/6 "2005-12-04T09:49:05Z")
Question is, are women really afraid of mice more than men, or are we all just acting how we percieve society expects us to? Women are expected to be afraid of mice, so the ones who are, are quite happy to let you know about it. Men are supposed to be manly and protect our women folk, so even if we are afraid of mice, we push on and try not to let anyone notice. ---
**Author:** ![Ice\_Wolf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/dfb087/32.png) [@Ice\_Wolf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ice_Wolf)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/7 "2005-12-04T09:52:34Z")
Seeing the little beggers just means I have to go get the traps out again. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 9:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/8 "2005-12-04T09:57:08Z")
> [@KRC](#): > > I don’t. I’ve never seen another woman do it, and this town is full of mice. Most people don’t like them but that’s it. You just deal. I’ve seen any number of women get irrationally freaked out by insects, especially spiders. Never mice. (Unfortunately, sometimes I’m not much better, and when I’m asked to be manly and kill a spider, I look like I’ve been asked to slay a dragon.) I wonder if the idea of “women are scared by small creatures” got narrowed down to mice for some reason. Then again, perhaps it dates back to plague-ridden medieval Europe, when you had good reason to be scared of household rodents. ---
**Author:** ![Jman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jman/32/4416_2.png) [@Jman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jman)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/9 "2005-12-04T10:41:54Z")
I’ve seen plenty of women get freaked out by mice. I’ve also seen lots who would walk up to one and pick it up. The funniest episode was when I was on an Army field training exercise, and a rat came in (it was fairly large, about 5 or 6 inches long not including the tail). While no one was really eager to go say hi to it, two female officer friends of mine went crazy nuts. Irrational panic, immediately up on chairs. It was really funny. Not afraid of combat, and two of the finest officers in our battalion, but the rat scared the piss out of 'em. Evaluating it honestly, though, I think that the amount of people who are scared of mice/rats/spiders/etc. is probably relatively similar accross gender lines, it’s just that the reaction to the fear is different, either because of social norms or just plain old variance in behavior. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/10 "2005-12-04T14:58:58Z")
Supposedly when the first “Phantom of the Opera” movie was released, they distributed smelling salts to the audience for in case someone fainted. These days there’s an accident on the road and everyone (men and women) will be out there looking to see if there’s a head rolling down the road. Society has changed significantly in the last 50 years. ---
**Author:** ![phouka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c5a1d2/32.png) [@phouka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/phouka)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/11 "2005-12-04T15:09:34Z")
Best explanation I’ve ever come across was in a fantasy novel where the main character remembered the fuss of a mouse getting into her petticoats, and her friends having to shake out her entire dress to dislodge the thing. I’m sorry, but the thought of a small, fast, mobile, plague carrying _vermin_ loose in my clothing gives me some damn acute heebie jeebies. I like to think of myself as a calm, capable woman, but if I were wearing a long dress, I’d be up on a chair as well. ---
**Author:** ![Hombre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecb155/32.png) [@Hombre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hombre)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/12 "2005-12-04T15:10:20Z")
> [@KRC](#): > > Anyone who remembers the Tom and Jerry cartoons remembers the woman standing on the chair while yelling hysterically at Tom to get the evil mouse. And as recently as 1967 nature writer Leonard Lee Rue III commented on how “this tiny creature has the power to reduce womankind to a state of helplessness…” > There is a common belief that a woman will, for some reason, throw hissy fits if she sees a mouse. > > I don’t. I’ve never seen another woman do it, and this town is full of mice. Most people don’t like them but that’s it. You just deal. > > Was this just some old Victorian thing that was expected of women? I’m very curious about the origin of this belief. I’m guessing you answered your own question. A lot of these types of beliefs are the result of cartoons. Logic conceit is usually suspended watching cartoons (running off of a cliff and not falling _until_ the character realizes he is in mid-air). At that point standards are set. Take, for example, the fact that cartoons used dial phones long after they were out of common use. ---
**Author:** ![jimmmy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/73ab20/32.png) [@jimmmy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimmmy)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/13 "2005-12-04T16:40:36Z")
> [@Hombre](#): > > I’m guessing you answered your own question. A lot of these types of beliefs are the result of cartoons. Logic conceit is usually suspended watching cartoons (running off of a cliff and not falling _until_ the character realizes he is in mid-air). At that point standards are set. Take, for example, the fact that cartoons used dial phones long after they were out of common use. … or that Elephants are [deathly afraid](http://www.mindlesscrap.com/stumpme/10-01.htm) to the point of hysteria, of mice. So I agree that was where many silly universal ideas came from. However, there is a paper from 1918 **The Joys of Being a Woman and other Papers by Winifred (Margaretta) Kirkland (1872-1943)** where she actually says it is to a woman’s [advantage](http://www.t0.or.at/msguide/ws-gd2.htm) to evoke the Chivalrous response by "[hopping on a chair at the sight of a mouse](http://etext.lib.virginia.edu/etcbin/toccer-new2?id=KirJoys.sgm&images=images/modeng&data=/texts/english/modeng/parsed&tag=public&part=1&division=div1) ---
**Author:** ![MLS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MLS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MLS)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/14 "2005-12-04T16:48:10Z")
\*\*phouka’s \*\* explanation is the best. The stereotype dates back to the era of long skirts. ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/15 "2005-12-04T17:16:43Z")
Well I’m a woman who considers myself capable of handling most situations in a calm rational manner, but I automatically scream when I see a mouse. Years ago, I had a mouse in my apartment. Every night, I think around 10:00 or 11:00 p.m., it would run across my living room floor. I knew it was coming, and yet _every single time_ I would scream. Just some kind of uncontrollable response. I don’t fear mice at all in a controlled setting, but their sudden appearance completely throws me. Eventually my landlord set a trap and caught the mouse, but I have no doubt that if I ever saw a mouse again, I would scream. I also automatically scream if I am suddenly plunged into darkness. It drove my sister nuts while we were traveling through Europe, where there are heavy shutters on the windows. I’d be in bed, and when she flipped off the lightswitch, “Eeeeek.” I’d be perfectly fine, and not truly scared, it just happened. That’s also caused me embarassment a few times on subway trains when the lights suddenly went out for some reason. I’ve had to apologize to fellow passengers: “Sorry, I just scream when the lights go out.” I don’t think my reaction in either the mouse or lights out case comes from cartoons. It’s just how my nervous system responds to a sudden perceived threat. I do think the long skirts idea has some merit, but I also think that some people (women?) have an automatic scream response in certain circumstances. ---
**Author:** ![BobT](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e8cbc/32.png) [@BobT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobT)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/16 "2005-12-04T20:08:18Z")
I should add that while I had no trouble picking up the dead mouse for my former girlfriend, I would also flee inside homes or cross the street to get away from a grasshopper, so I’m not without sin and am not casting any stones. ---
**Author:** ![Hombre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ecb155/32.png) [@Hombre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hombre)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/17 "2005-12-04T20:50:29Z")
> [@MLS](#): > > \*\*phouka’s \*\* explanation is the best. The stereotype dates back to the era of long skirts. Maybe. However it’s not like it was genetically passed down from them. The stereotype I’m most familiar with is the mid to shortish skirted woman on a chair. IMO, you see this mostly in cartoons and sit-coms. Interesting theory though, it does sound creepy. Maybe **KRC** could tell us where she knows this stereotype from? > [@SpoilerVirgin](#): > > I don’t think my reaction in either the mouse or lights out case comes from cartoons. It’s just how my nervous system responds to a sudden perceived threat. I do think the long skirts idea has some merit, but I also think that some people (women?) have an automatic scream response in certain circumstances. Probably not but the OP talked about the _ **stereotype** _ of women fainting or climbing onto a chair. Not screaming - which I’m sure is not all that uncommon. Even for some men. ---
**Author:** ![Hedda\_Rosa](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hedda_rosa/32/1204_2.png) [@Hedda\_Rosa](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hedda_Rosa)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/18 "2005-12-04T21:30:45Z")
I clicked into this thread to say “long skirts” too. Having a mouse climbing around up there would give me the shrieking hysterics, though as a modern jeans-wearing woman they don’t bother me at all. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/19 "2005-12-04T22:25:10Z")
You people must have some really slow mice. Brooklyn mice run like hell. A tiny furry critter unexpectedly zipping out of nowhere, running over your foot, and then dashing beneath the fridge? _I_ am screaming. – meaning to say, it’s not any sort of horror in the facing down of a small mammal, it’s the _surprise_ that makes women scream. And me. ---
**Author:** ![ryobserver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b2d939/32.png) [@ryobserver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ryobserver)\ **Post date:** [December 4, 2005, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007/20 "2005-12-04T23:32:29Z")
Critter fear is also dependent on situation. I once watched a graduate student talk a lab mouse through an examination as if it were a baby: “It’s OK, I’m just going to feel your spleen, it won’t hurt a bit…There, that wasn’t so bad, was it?” Yet this same woman refused to enter her own kitchen for a week after seeing a mouse run through it. Personally, I think mice are kind of cute, and I still jump if I see one in my home. (In general, I startle easily.) And never mind cute, I have no trouble at all setting out the traps if they get into my food. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/origin-of-stereotype-that-women-faint-at-sight-of-mice/334007.md?page=2)