# OTC Self-defense Sprays Don't Work! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [March 13, 2022, 2:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967 "2022-03-13T02:38:07Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Jim\_B](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jim_b/32/4338_2.png) [@Jim\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_B)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/21 "2022-03-13T18:34:31Z")
Well, all I have to say is, in your state, does the public and the police carry two different types of mace, i.e., self-defense spray? If they do, you’ve proven my point 😉 🙂 . And to answer someone’s question, in my state most self-defense sprays are pepper sprays. Last that I heard, the police carry an amalgam of pepper and tear gas sprays. Which is why theirs is so effective. That is what the reporter said, in the case I cited. He even let a cop spray him with one. And it didn’t seem to be too pleasant of an experience, I can tell you. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/22 "2022-03-13T19:12:34Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#): > > That is what the reporter said, in the case I cited. You haven’t cited anything. ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_B](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jim_b/32/4338_2.png) [@Jim\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_B)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/23 "2022-03-13T20:27:01Z")
@D_Anconia Okay, then I will go back in time, record the news episode on my smartphone, and bring it back here. Would that satisfy you 🙂 ? I remember exactly what happened on TV then, and I am relating exactly 🙂 . ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 10:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/24 "2022-03-13T22:15:35Z")
> [@ZipperJJ](#): > > Don’t those sprays expire? I suspect the potency goes away after an amount of time. Actually, no. The active ingredient can become intensified in the carrier (water or an oil base). The problem with old OC spray is the propellant can weaken making them inoperable and useless. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/25 "2022-03-13T22:20:30Z")
It’s MPSIMS, so I suppose it doesn’t matter. Just pointing out that “I saw it on the tee-vee” is not a cite. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/26 "2022-03-13T22:25:13Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > > [@DPRK](#): > > > > Sometimes they contain CS > > I didn’t know that. I’m surprised that would be legal for civilians (and I see you can get it right on amazon, because of course you can). > > When I kept seeing OTC spray, I was assuming he meant OC spray (pepper spray). What I was curious about is if he was thinking of CN spray (The original, actual Mace), but I didn’t think that had really been around since the 90’s. It always depends on the jurisdiction. Tear gas is not legal for non-LEOs here in Wisconsin but may be in other states. When I first got on the job in ‘82 only postal carriers had pepper spray (Halt) for animal attacks. We had a tear gas spray (don’t remember if it was CS or CN) that came in the same type dispenser as OC. But you didn’t spray a subject in the face, you sprayed them in the chest and it dispersed upwards to the mouth, nose and eyes. Having sprayed people with both I can attest OC is more effective. And the OP is full of beans. There are plenty of over the counter sprays that are very effective. Keep your eye on the Scoville Heat Units, not the percentage. You want at least 1 million, 2 million is better. Get sprayed with a dose of Fox Labs 3 million and tell me OTC spray doesn’t work. When you’re done screaming that is! ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/27 "2022-03-13T22:30:34Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#): > > Well, all I have to say is, in your state, does the public and the police carry two different types of mace, i.e., self-defense spray? If they do, you’ve proven my point 😉 🙂 . > > And to answer someone’s question, in my state most self-defense sprays are pepper sprays. Last that I heard, the police carry an amalgam of pepper and tear gas sprays. Which is why theirs is so effective. That is what the reporter said, in the case I cited. He even let a cop spray him with one. And it didn’t seem to be too pleasant of an experience, I can tell you. I don’t know any department around here that carries the teargas blend. Some studies came out decades ago that they can cause facial nerve damage which is why so many went to pepper based products. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [March 13, 2022, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/28 "2022-03-13T22:40:05Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#): > > @D_Anconia Okay, then I will go back in time, record the news episode on my smartphone, and bring it back here. Would that satisfy you 🙂 ? How about giving the call letters of the TV station so that we can do the 30 seconds of googling that you could have done to 99% likely find the video on the station’s web site or on Youtube? ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_B](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jim_b/32/4338_2.png) [@Jim\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_B)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/29 "2022-03-14T01:23:28Z")
@Darren_Garrison WJBK local Fox 2, metro Detroit. EDIT: Oh, and it was about twenty years ago 🙂 . ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/30 "2022-03-14T01:26:47Z")
Well, that is _certainly_ pertinent to what is on the market today, isn’t it? 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/31 "2022-03-14T01:26:56Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#): > > EDIT: Oh, and it was about twenty years ago 🙂 . So, your research on the topic which you felt compelled to start here, now, is a segment on your local TV news which you believe that you “remember exactly”, from **twenty years ago**? I lack the words. ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_B](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jim_b/32/4338_2.png) [@Jim\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_B)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 1:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/32 "2022-03-14T01:36:12Z")
I don’t think life has changed that much in twenty years, especially in regards to self-defense sprays. And as someone already pointed out, this is just MPSIMS 😉 🙂 . ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/33 "2022-03-14T01:40:33Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#): > > I don’t think life has changed that much in twenty years, especially in regards to self-defense sprays. How do you know this? The only “research” you did on your own topic was recalling a twenty-year-old segment on your local TV news. > [@Jim\_B](#): > > And as someone already pointed out, this is just MPSIMS 😉 🙂 . Your initial post started out with: > [@](#): > > Really, a rather important piece of information for those who carry them. > > Self-defense sprays don’t work! Because only the police (in the USA) are allowed to have the good stuff. ‘The good stuff’ is subsequently classified as a weapon. And if you were to carry that with you, you’d probably get in more trouble than the criminal you sprayed it with. It clearly comes across as something that you felt was very important, urgent information to share, not just “mundane pointless stuff.” ---
**Author:** ![Joey\_P](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/919ad9/32.png) [@Joey\_P](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Joey_P)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/34 "2022-03-14T02:39:25Z")
This > [@Jim\_B](#): > > Okay, then I will go back in time, record the news episode on my smartphone, and bring it back here. Would that satisfy you 🙂 ? and this > [@Jim\_B](#): > > I remember exactly what happened on TV then, and I am relating exactly are just about the definition of “I don’t have a cite”. It’s the equivalent of citing a “friend of a friend”. It might be true, but it’s not a cite and most people aren’t going to accept it proof. > [@Jim\_B](#): > > EDIT: Oh, and it was about twenty years ago PK has mentioned in an unrelated comment that pepper spray has gotten better over time. Also, it can be purchased in a variety of percentages. What percentage of OC did the person in the news report get sprayed with? Have the laws regarding strength changed since 2002? ---
**Author:** ![ekedolphin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ekedolphin/32/10003_2.png) [@ekedolphin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ekedolphin)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/35 "2022-03-14T02:46:29Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > what about collapsing batons? Are they legal? > **[Using a Baton for Self-Defense: What You Need to Know](https://www.thehomesecuritysuperstore.com/blogs/the-home-security-superstore-blog/using-a-baton-for-self-defense-what-you-need-to-know)** > > Gone are the days of the billy club-toting copper, walking the street beat while twirling his wooden nightstick. Nevertheless, the baton is still very much in use by police, military, and security personnel. And why not? A stick of any kind,... > California is the only state where expandable batons are illegal to both own and carry. In Massachusetts, New York, and Washington D.C. batons are illegal to carry, but legal to own for home use. There are no federal laws against carrying expandable batons. Questionable Content (which takes place in Massachusetts) did this: [![](https://www.questionablecontent.net/comics/1575.png) ](https://www.questionablecontent.net/comics/1575.png) [![](https://www.questionablecontent.net/comics/1576.png) ](https://www.questionablecontent.net/comics/1576.png) ---
**Author:** ![Jim\_B](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jim_b/32/4338_2.png) [@Jim\_B](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jim_B)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/36 "2022-03-14T03:23:49Z")
@Joey_P I saw it clear as day on TV, and I remember it well. How is that analogous to ‘friend of a friend’ 🙂 ? I’d call it direct information. And people here don’t believe that I saw it on TV? Are you saying people here are accusing me of lying 🙂 ? Above is basically a summary of what you said, at least as I understood it. How do you interpret it 🙂 ? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/37 "2022-03-14T03:33:31Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#): > > I saw it clear as day on TV, and I remember it well. How is that analogous to ‘friend of a friend’ 🙂 ? I’d call it direct information. > > And people here don’t believe that I saw it on TV? Are you saying people here are accusing me of lying 🙂 ? Please see the never-ending “[Alternate Ending to ‘Big’?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/anyone-else-remember-the-alternate-ending-to-big/103864/1041)” thread for more on how the passage of time can mess with memories, even memories that people are _absolutely bloody certain_ are accurate. I’m sorry, but even if you _think_ you remember well a twenty-year-old clip from a random TV newscast, you may not, in fact, remember all the details. It’s not that people don’t necessarily believe you saw it on TV, it’s that (as I figure you are well aware by this point) the standard for proof on the SDMB is typically that you provide actual links to the information that you have seen or read, if at all possible. In retrospect, given what your “evidence” is, it probably would have been better to title your thread “Do OTC Self-Defense Sprays Work?”, and word your OP like, “I remember seeing on TV, years ago…was that accurate? Have things changed since then?” Instead, you worded your OP as a flat-out statement: > [@Jim\_B](#): > > Self-defense sprays don’t work! ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/38 "2022-03-14T03:37:46Z")
[quote=“Joey\_P, post:34, topic:960967, full:true”] This > [@Jim\_B](#): > > Okay, then I will go back in time, record the news episode on my smartphone, and bring it back here. Would that satisfy you 🙂 ? and this > [@Jim\_B](#): > > Also, it can be purchased in a variety of percentages. What percentage of OC did the person in the news report get sprayed with? Have the laws regarding strength changed since 2002? As I said in a previous post the percentage is irrelevant compared to the Scoville Heat Unit rating. For example, a 5% concentration with 2 million SHU is going to be more effective than a 10% concentration with only 500K SHU. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/39 "2022-03-14T03:40:56Z")
> [@pkbites](#): > > For example, a 5% concentration with 2 million SHU is going to be more effective than a 10% concentration with only 500K SHU. But isn’t the concentration what _determines_ the Scoville number? > **[Measuring Pepper Spray on the Scoville scale of chili pepper hotness](https://boingboing.net/2011/11/21/measuring-pepper-spray-on-the.html)** > > If you're heading out to an Occupation today AND you're a fan of tasty, tasty chili peppers, you'll want to read Deborah Blum's "About Pepper" essay in Scientific American. The… ---
**Author:** ![nelliebly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/nelliebly/32/5422_2.png) [@nelliebly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nelliebly)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2022, 4:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967/40 "2022-03-14T04:01:25Z")
Jim, as long as you’ve been on here, how is it you’re _still_ resisting even a few minutes of simple research? You recall clear as day (you think) something from an entire generation ago but don’t do even a quick Google search? You want us to accept that your memory is pristine and that your (old) sources are unimpeachable? And when we don’t–because this _is_ the Straight Dope–you go to accusations that we think we’re lying? _Oy_. Hey, I saw back in the day that wearing a copper bracelet is effective against arthritis. I did, really! I can even tell you where: it was a copy of Grit (then a weekly newspaper) at my grandparents-in-law’s house. If you tell me it doesn’t, does that make me a liar, or just someone foolish enough and stubborn enough to insist that something I read a long time ago must have been true and hasn’t been disproven since? Of course I don’t believe copper bracelets banish arthritis because even back then, I doubted it, but I just now spent–I timed it–14 seconds to do more research and read the pertinent part of [this article](https://www.webmd.com/rheumatoid-arthritis/news/20130918/copper-bracelets-rheumatoid-arthritis#:~:text=Sept.,been%20popular%20since%20the%201970s.) proving they don’t. See? Easy. _Do your research_. And FYI, MPSIMS does not mean posts that aren’t recently researched and evidence-based won’t be doubted. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/otc-self-defense-sprays-dont-work/960967.md?page=3)