# Ought skiplagging be permitted? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 19, 2023, 12:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795 "2023-08-19T12:06:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/41 "2023-08-20T20:06:34Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Automated yes, but I assume the gate agent is going to have to look up your reservation to find out whether you checked anything. They’re not going to know which of a couple hundred passengers checked bags. This is probably the real reason the airlines dont like this - security. If someone on a two leg itinerary on one plane checks a bag but gets off the plane halfway thru the trip, how would anyone know? How do they know who exited? A bag in the belly of an airliner without the bag’s owner on board is a big no-no, no? On a flight last December a woman a couple rows in front of me had a seizure as we were taxi-ing away from the gate. One of the flight attendants presses a button and the pilot stopped the plane, and we eventually returned to the gate, and the woman, now partially recovered but still dazed, was evacuated by paramedics. But we sat for a while longer as they searched the overhead bins for her carry-on bags, and presumably in the cargo hold for checked luggage to be removed. Evidently she was alone so it was a chore to determine what was hers vs other people still on the plane. ---
**Author:** ![Arcite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/67e7ee/32.png) [@Arcite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arcite)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/42 "2023-08-20T20:42:44Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > When you fail to board the second leg of the flight, the gate agent (or another airline employee) will want to check if you’ve got any checked bags on board, because, hypothetically, you might have left a bomb in them. > [@LSLGuy](#): > > Which usually means a gate agent comes aboard to be sure passenger _X_ really isn’t on board, while some ramp dudes dig passenger _X_’s bag(s) out of the belly. Is all of this really true? People miss second legs of itineraries all the time, most commonly because the first leg was delayed. Once, in the pre-smartphone era, when you had to check the screens for your gate, I missed one because the crappy CRT monitor’s right edge was cut off, so I thought it said., e.g., A2 rather than A22, and I waited at A2 until it was too late and missed the flight. Another time I was in a hub, the 2nd flight kept getting delayed, so I called the airline and they rebooked me on a different route, and my checked luggage didn’t get to my destination until 24 hours later. You mean to tell me every time something like this happens, they freaking out about who is or isn’t on the plane, and rummaging through the cargo hold? ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/43 "2023-08-20T20:54:48Z")
There are detailed rules from the TSA about when checked baggage must be removed for a missing passenger and when it can ride unaccompanied to some destination. They don’t share all the details with me and if they did I couldn’t share them with you. But bottom line: sometimes bags for non-travelers must be pulled and sometimes they need not be pulled. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/44 "2023-08-20T20:56:55Z")
If I miss the second leg of my flight because the first leg was delayed, chances are good that my checked luggage will also miss the connecting flight. Happened to me in Denver not two weeks ago. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/45 "2023-08-20T21:26:59Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The smart skiplagger doesn’t check a bag. Not due to security concerns but because they really don’t want their underwear in some other city where they aren’t. If you’re enterprising/devious enough to save a few bucks by skiplagging, I wouldn’t be too surprised if there was some way for them to make money as a courier by checking a bag to city C, even though they’ll be getting off at city B. One thing I don’t think has been mentioned yet is whether the second leg of the trip is on the same plane as the first. It’s been ages since I’ve done that, but I think they used to give the passengers the option to stay on, or get off and stretch their legs in the terminal. I’ve never seen an airline that tracked passengers leaving a plane. If you booked a two-leg trip that you knew was going to be on the same plane, and got off at the intermediate city, would the airline even notice? ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/46 "2023-08-20T22:09:12Z")
> [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > I’ve never seen an airline that tracked passengers leaving a plane. If you booked a two-leg trip that you knew was going to be on the same plane, and got off at the intermediate city, would the airline even notice? In the US, Southwest is about the only big-jet airline that doesn’t deboard completely at each stop. So is about the only one where someone could leave at an intermediate stop and not be noticed. OTOH, Southwest counts heads after everyone is off and before anyone new is allowed on. The FA’s know what the count should be. I do not know what procedures they go through if the count is long (meaning in effect someone is unexpectedly stowing away for the next leg), or the count is short (meaning someone has gotten off early unexpectedly). But there is a federal regulation that the airline must know the exact passenger list at all times, so once a headcount discrepancy is noticed, they’d have to do something to reconcile the difference before boarding anyone new. We in more conventional airlines get into a vaguely similar situation when we have an extended departure delay and folks are wanting to leave the plane either for good or just to eat, pee, whatever. We can (must actually) let them off, but they’re scanned leaving the jetbridge into the terminal and if/when they return they’re re-scanned getting on. So we always have an accurate list of who’s where. In any large operation (we move a half million people per _day_) onesy-twosy accounting mistakes happen. But overall the system has a real good grip on who’s where when. ---
**Author:** ![fedman1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e495f1/32.png) [@fedman1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fedman1)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/47 "2023-08-20T22:31:36Z")
my question is did they buy roundtrip or one way? If one way, then don’t they have to buy new ticket to get home? ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/48 "2023-08-20T22:42:12Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > In the US, Southwest is about the only big-jet airline that doesn’t deboard completely at each stop. So is about the only one where someone could leave at an intermediate stop and not be noticed. I’m not sure I understand this. Most of my experience with stops is on SWA, and they count before you are allowed to change seats, but I’m pretty sure you are allowed off. Is deboarding on other airlines required? I’m pretty sure I’ve been on flights where you are not supposed to get off because the turnaround time is so short, and ones where it is possible. I can’t think of any where sneaking off wouldn’t be permitted. I don’t think they can prevent your from taking your carry-on bag off. Now they scan boarding passes when you reboard so they eventually know if anyone has bailed out, but you don’t have to be at the head of the line. BTW, this was the case I was thinking about. Getting bumped for being late for a plane change seems reasonable. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/49 "2023-08-20T23:03:29Z")
Most US airlines do not arrange flights that just go from city to city to city like a railroad used to. Instead they go from a “spoke” city to a “hub” city. Where everyone deboards to get on a different plane to then fly from the “hub” to whichever “spoke” city they’re really going to. Or just to leave the airport if their destination was that hub. But most passengers are passing through whichever hub with no care which place they’re changing planes; just that they are. Only a small minority are actually staying in the hub city. Even if someone flew into the hub on flight 123 that was operated by aircraft ABC and was going then to fly out to their real destination on flight 456 that was, by wild coincidence, also being operated by aircraft ABC, they’d still need to deboard. There are no provisions for leaving passengers on the plane. The whole crew may be leaving, the cleaners need to clean and the security team needs to inspect. None of which processes can complete with passengers on board. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [August 20, 2023, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/50 "2023-08-20T23:04:37Z")
FWIW: > **[American Airlines Becomes Latest Airline To Sue Skiplagged](https://simpleflying.com/american-airlines-skiplagged-lawsuit/)** > > Recently the airline barred a teenager from flying with the carrier for three years for trying to use skiplag tickets. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/51 "2023-08-21T00:01:05Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > The smart skiplagger doesn’t check a bag. Right. From the linked article in the OP: > It is important to note that this practice will not work if the traveler wants to travel with checked baggage. Just for grins, I spent ten minutes on Google Flights, looking at possibilities for skiplagging. I arbitrarily picked November 1, flying one-way from Wichita to Atlanta. The cheapest flight is on Delta, leaving at 5:55 am. Cost is $209. Then I chose a one-way from Wichita to Miami on November 1. Surprise, surprise. Cheapest flight is on Delta, leaving at 5:55 am with a 2 hour layover in Atlanta. Cost is $129. It would be damn tempting to save 80 bucks. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/52 "2023-08-21T00:30:56Z")
> [@LSLGuy](#): > > > [@Robot\_Arm](#): > > > > I’ve never seen an airline that tracked passengers leaving a plane. If you booked a two-leg trip that you knew was going to be on the same plane, and got off at the intermediate city, would the airline even notice? > > In the US, Southwest is about the only big-jet airline that doesn’t deboard completely at each stop. So is about the only one where someone could leave at an intermediate stop and not be noticed. > > OTOH, Southwest counts heads after everyone is off and before anyone new is allowed on. The FA’s know what the count should be. I do not know what procedures they go through if the count is long (meaning in effect someone is unexpectedly stowing away for the next leg), or the count is short (meaning someone has gotten off early unexpectedly). I’m pretty sure that Southwest prices each leg separately so that skiplagging wouldn’t work. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/53 "2023-08-21T00:43:46Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > The airlines strongly oppose this practice, and may penalize people they catch doing it by cancelling their frequent flier miles I would speculate that this is the real issue here. Airlines don’t really have any problem with skiplagging passengers. Why should they care is a passenger decides not to use a flight after paying for it? But by pretending that this a serious concern, airlines are hoping to be able to get away with punishing skiplaggers by cancelling their frequent flier miles. Which would be a financial bonus for the airlines. ---
**Author:** ![ASL\_v2.0](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asl_v2.0/32/3525_2.png) [@ASL\_v2.0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ASL_v2.0)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/54 "2023-08-21T00:48:43Z")
Hidden city ticketing screws with the airlines’ algorithms. Why isn’t that explanation enough? To that end, as others have opined, I think it should be exactly as permitted as the airlines themselves will tolerate. And if they don’t tolerate it, they have plenty of remedies available under contract law, particularly as they themselves draft the contracts. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 12:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/55 "2023-08-21T00:56:08Z")
The same automated system that tells the gate agent that you haven’t checked in will also tell them whether you’ve checked any bags. It has to, because those two situations would throw very different alerts. The gate agent would know that you skipped the flight and that you didn’t check any bags because the automated system would give the “skipped flight without bags” alert, instead of the “skipped flight with bags” alert. > [@snowthx](#): > > This is probably the real reason the airlines dont like this - security. If someone on a two leg itinerary on one plane checks a bag but gets off the plane halfway thru the trip, how would anyone know? How do they know who exited? A bag in the belly of an airliner without the bag’s owner on board is a big no-no, no? I’m not sure I’ve ever been on the same plane for multiple legs, but don’t they still make everyone get off, and then get back on? ---
**Author:** ![snowthx](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowthx/32/10660_2.png) [@snowthx](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/snowthx)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/56 "2023-08-21T01:26:07Z")
Not on Southwest. Once people exit the plane, thru-passengers remain seated until they do a count, then let everyone change seats if they want (no assigned seats). Then the new passengers board. I think if you are a thru- passenger they want you to stay on the plane since it makes getting the plane back in the air quicker. ---
**Author:** ![kitap](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b9e5f3/32.png) [@kitap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kitap)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/57 "2023-08-21T04:04:24Z")
If it’s roundtrip they’ll cancel the rest of the ticket. If you don’t know that, you’re in for a nasty surprise. ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/58 "2023-08-21T11:21:00Z")
I’ve read this and the other thread, and several articles, and I’m still having difficulty seeing the airlines’ complaints as anything other than complaining over a missed opportunity to squeeze every last penny out of passengers. If they wanted a simple solution, all they would need to do is allow persons buying the flight with the stopover to acknowledge that they would not be using the 2d leg. Then the airline wold be free to resell the 2d leg, not ave any security/luggage concerns, and effectively sell the same seat twice. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 12:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/59 "2023-08-21T12:05:20Z")
> [@Dinsdale](#): > > If they wanted a simple solution, all they would need to do is allow persons buying the flight with the stopover to acknowledge that they would not be using the 2d leg. Then the airline wold be free to resell the 2d leg, not ave any security/luggage concerns, and effectively sell the same seat twice. But the only reason they’re not able to sell the second leg in the first place is because someone broke the rules. From their point of view, it’s not a solution at all, just a capitulation. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [August 21, 2023, 12:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795/60 "2023-08-21T12:20:37Z")
I think that may depend on the timing, because I know I was able to exit and reboard a Southwest flight while some people stayed on the plane, but we were given around an hour before we had to be back on board. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ought-skiplagging-be-permitted/988795.md?page=4)