# "Our Kids!" (Ft. Hood Shootings - ed. title\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 7, 2009, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680 "2009-11-07T03:18:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Martin\_Hyde](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/47e85d/32.png) [@Martin\_Hyde](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martin_Hyde)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/61 "2009-11-09T15:14:47Z")
> [@Martini\_Enfield](#): > > And the problem is that no-one has really managed to hang onto it for long. Yes, the British subjugated Afghanistan, but that’s not quite the same thing as being able to assimilate it into their Empire and do anything productive with it. > > The British were largely using Afghanistan as a “Buffer” against the Russians anyway, AIUI. Actually it was held for centuries at a time prior the 19th century; often times divided up and held by many different powers. If “assimilate it into their Empire” is the definition we’re using for conquest then the Mongols barely conquered anyone; by and large making conquered lands some integral part of the imperial power isn’t and has never been the proper metric for determining whether or not a state is under active subjugation. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/62 "2009-11-09T15:29:09Z")
> [@Quasimodem](#): > > No, sorry. You’re telling me one more life is “worth it”, and I am telling you it isn’t. > > End of story. No, we’re telling you that (as Martini Enfield already posted) there are nearly 50,000 US soldiers, 10,000 British soldiers, and 40,000 Coalition forces in Afghanistan and short of just dropping everything and walking away (and maybe even then), there’s no practical, safe, efficient way to effect a complete withdrawal in a short space of time. So your well-meant but emotional idea means that: - many Allied soldiers will be killed in a panicky rushed retreat - lots of military equipment will be handed over to our enemies - terrorists will take heart from our failures **And I’m telling you it’s not worth it.** ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/63 "2009-11-09T15:37:36Z")
Can someone tell me how the Fort Hood shooting has anything to do with pulling our troops out of Afghanistan in the next three days? ---
**Author:** ![Sam\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ecccb3/32.png) [@Sam\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sam_Stone)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/64 "2009-11-09T17:02:03Z")
Absolutely nothing. Nor does it have anything to do with how ‘stressed’ or ‘stretched thin’ the U.S. forces are. But that hasn’t stopped the media from talking about that every time the shooting comes up. This shooting seems to me to be a classic case of a screwed up individual with feelings of persecution and frustration going nuts and killing a bunch of people in a giant tantrum. He could have been a postal worker and done the same thing. The second most likely motivation was that it’s starting to appear like he had embraced a jihadist mindset and was carrying out a terrorist act. It’s not clear yet whether this was the real motivation or just a way for a nutbar to justify his homicidal urges. Yet all the talking heads are going on about how this is a sign of how the military is over-committed and over-stressed. The problem with that is that this guy has never served a day overseas, and in fact has had a pretty cushy time of it in the military, getting his education paid for and then serving as a medical officer on a domestic base. ---
**Author:** ![Quasimodem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/e274bd/32.png) [@Quasimodem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quasimodem)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/65 "2009-11-09T17:30:23Z")
… and apology offered to all military, **Dopers** and anyone else offended by my terminology. As I have said previously, I HATE this section of the Dope, I try to avoid coming in here, and I HATE being “pushed” there, even though it’s my fault, because of the subject matter I choose:). I KNOW it must be tough monitoring where I post, but I WISH someone could just make my posts disappear if this is going to be the result. Yeah, I’m **passionate** about this war and the needless loss of life, but I try to make my points the best I can. I KNOW I won’t always be agreed with, but that doesn’t stop the way I feel. Again, my apologies for my terminology. Q ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [November 9, 2009, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/66 "2009-11-09T21:37:39Z")
I am a retired soldier. I am not sure why that matters. We can and ought to win in Afghanistan. Let me discuss those in reverse order. Afghanistan has been boil in the side of the world for a couple of centuries. Unless you are OK with them treating women like cattle, raising opium, spreading disease and blowing up big Buddahs, elsewise it is time to clean out this global cesspool. I would be willing to fight and die for this cause. So we ought to do it; can we? Look at Vietnam. We lost the military fight, but we changed their culture all to heck. There is no reason we can’t do the same in Afghanistan. It might take fifty years, but we can solve this problem if we desire to. ---
**Author:** ![Snite](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e0b2c6/32.png) [@Snite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snite)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2009, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/67 "2009-11-10T00:28:25Z")
I’m a soldier. I’m not a kid. And the only people to whom I’m a son you have never met. Quit degrading me, you fuck. As to the situation in Afghanistan and Iraq: Whether the invasions were justified or not, they happened. If we leave either there would be a power vacuum filled by the most motivated faction. The most motivated faction in either country is not the government troops. Bad guys take over and then we have a national security problems as the two countries would become havens for terrorists to goup/plan/coordinate/supply. Bad mojo. So what do we do? Right now there is no clear answer but it’s obvious to me that pulling out is not a sound _ **strategy** _. Do I want to go on this upcoming 4th tour of duty? No. Right now is it a necessary evil? Yes. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2009, 1:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/68 "2009-11-10T01:59:11Z")
> [@Snite](#): > > I’m a soldier. I’m not a kid. And the only people to whom I’m a son you have never met. Quit degrading me, you fuck. Do not post personal insults in Great Debates, (or anywhere on the SDMB outside the Pit.) [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2009, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680/69 "2009-11-10T02:01:23Z")
Given the erratic path this thread has traced in a single page, I am going to close it. Anyone who wishes to pick a single approach to the topic(s) and put forth an argument they choose to defend may do so. [/Modding] [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-kids-ft-hood-shootings-ed-title/516680.md?page=3)