# Our local school library shocked to find Dragonball graphic novel is kind of graphic
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [October 8, 2009, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047 "2009-10-08T14:00:43Z")
**Posts on this page:** 15
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/1 "2009-10-08T14:00:43Z")
Story here
[Graphic novel, removed from Wicomico school, is no kid’s comic book](http://www.delmarvanow.com/article/20091008/NEWS01/910080338/Novel-removed-from-Wicomico-school-is-no-kid-s-comic-book)
[Here’s the naughty parts they objected to (warning frothy blogger site)](http://www.delmarvadealings.com/2009/10/06/wicomico-schools-peddles-smut-to-children/). They are pretty racy for a book in kids library in the US.
> [@](#):
>
> SALISBURY – Don’t let the bright-eyed, youthful heroes dancing through the pages fool you: Japanese graphic novels are often geared toward adults.
> “In Japanese culture, it’s well understood that they are adult (-oriented) books, when in America, we still have the notion of a comic book as a kid’s genre,” said Adam Wood, an assistant professor at Salisbury University who has used graphic novels to help teach his American literature course.
> Wicomico County schools removed all copies of Akira Toriyama’s “Dragon Ball” series from its library shelves Wednesday, said schools spokeswoman Tracy Sahler. A committee of administrators and people from outside the school system will review the texts in question, but it’s Superintendent John Fredericksen who has the final say about their future, Sahler said. At Tuesday’s County Council meeting, Councilman Joe Holloway drew attention to the issue. He distributed photocopies of scenes in the first book in which children appear naked or appear in sexual situations – illustrations that Holloway called "disgusting
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### Author:  [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 2:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/2 "2009-10-08T14:23:20Z")
I walked in on a collection of librarians at my high school perusing Maurice Sendak’s **In the Night Kitchen** \* and debating whether to place it in the school library. Because, you know, the hero is naked at one point and you can see his boy parts.
I think the stuff in the OP would make their heads explode.
Heck, I’m surprised it’s in there. I don’t follow Dragonball (Is this the same as the ubiquitous Dragonball Z?), but I wouldn’t have expected that.
\*I think they were considering it for one of the elementary schools, not the high school.
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### Author:  [@Tapioca\_Dextrin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapioca_Dextrin)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/3 "2009-10-08T14:30:00Z")
At least there wasn’t any [tentacle porn](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tentacle_erotica).
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### Author:  [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 2:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/4 "2009-10-08T14:45:53Z")
This article from 2000 says that Dragon Ball is already censored:
> **[Viz explains censorship in Dragonball Manga](https://www.animenewsnetwork.com/news/2000-08-21/viz-explains-censorship-in-dragonball-manga)**
>
> A while ago we reported that Viz had acknowledged that they were censoring the Dragonball comic. The Next Dimension reports that the letter column of the...
(It also compares it to Sendak’s “In the Night Kitchen”, as I did). Do they have an older copy, or is even the “cvensored” version a bit racy?
> [@](#):
>
> A while ago we reported that Viz had acknowledged that they were censoring the Dragon Ball comic. The Next Dimension reports that the letter column of the latest issue of Dragon Ball contains this letter from the editor:
>
> These are only a few of the letters we’ve received about the censorship in the recent issues of Dragon Ball. Thanks to everyone who wrote in. We know that it’s caused great dissapointment-to us as well as to readers-so here’s the story. It wasn’t the result of an editorial shift. Back in late 1999, a few parents bought Dragon Ball comics for their children at a major chain store and objected to some of the slightly sexual humor in the first issues. They complained to the management, a few news stories were written about it… and presto, Dragon Ball comics ceased being distributed outside of comics stores.
>
> Many anime fans in the '80s dreamed about anime hitting it big in the mainstream, and unfortunately, one of the problems with “mainstream success” in America is that when something like anime or manga becomes popular, it becomes a target for a lot of people who like to pick things apart for objectionable content and make sure that things “for children” (i.e., all animation and comics, in their minds) are as “safe” and harmless as possible. Explaining that Japanese culture has different standards, or that Goku’s nudity in a children’s book like Maurice Sendak’s in The Night Kitchen isn’t easy. Of course, even in Japan, the Dragon Ball manga’s main audience is 12 years old through teenagers. But since it’s on the Cartoon Network and in Burger King ads, some people think it must be suitable for preschoolers… as if there’s no middle line between Pokémon and “For Ages 18 and Older”. It’ll be a while before the “cartoons are for kids” attitude of many people in the U.S. turns into a true acceptance that anime can mean many different things… and probably, it will always be the fact that anime and manga isn’t designed with a U.S. audience in mind that makes it interesting.
>
> The upshot of this was some tough decisions, in which getting Dragon Ball into a wide audience was balanced against keeping it true to the original. And with Shueisha and Toriyama’s approval, Viz has had to make some concessions to that perceived audience (and their retailers and distributors) the way other licensors such as FUNimation do.
> We are trying to keep the changes minimal, since we’d rather not make them at all. All the Dragon Ball changes are approved first by Akira Toriyama, and he has made some suggestions, such as covering Goku’s privates with objects instead of making him look as if he’s neutered (where it’s possible). Mostly this has involved changing some dirty jokes and nudity in Dragon Ball; DBZ has comparatively little censorship, as we don’t plan to cut any violence. The Dragon Ball Vol. 1 graphic novel, which comes out this month, is the “edited” version, although the unedited original comics of Vol. 1 and Vol. 2 are still available.
This and other refs answer my question about Dragon Ball vs. Dragon Ball Z, which is apparently a continuiation in manga, although they applied the csame title to the manga in the US to increase confusion.
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### Author:  [@Giles](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Giles)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/5 "2009-10-08T14:46:28Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#):
>
> … (Is this the same as the ubiquitous Dragonball Z?) …
It’s all one franchise and the same main characters, but different continuities. In the manga (called graphic novel in the OP) there’s Dragon Ball and Dragon Ball Z; in the anime there’s Dragon Ball, Dragon Ball Z, Dragon Ball GT and Dragon Ball Kai. There are also video games and collectible cards (of course).
And some of it is only explainable as being an adaptation of [Journey to the West](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Journey_to_the_West), which is one of the classics of Chinese literature, though that might be a bit over the heads of the Wicomico County School Board.
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### Author:  [@Kamino\_Neko](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kamino_Neko)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/6 "2009-10-08T15:12:06Z")
> [@Giles](#):
>
> It’s all one franchise and the same main characters, but different continuities.
No, it’s the same continuity. Z follows on from Dragonball - the title of the manga doesn’t even change in Japan. It’s only changed in Viz\*'s translation to match with the anime. The manga and anime are different continuities from each other, due to filler added to the latter, but within each Z is just a specific title for the later part of the series.
The tone of the story changes - it’s more humour when Goku’s a kid, it’s more action when he grows up - but it’s not a different series.
To the OP, I’m boggled by it being called ‘adult oriented’ - it’s a shonen title - aimed at older kids and teenagers (boys, the girl-aimed equivalent is shojo). The Japanese just have different ideas of what’s appropriate for that audience.
- To any brits reading this - Viz Media is an American publisher, owned by two Japanese publishers, and unrelated to the British comic of the same name.
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 7:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/7 "2009-10-08T19:49:17Z")
Huh, I didn’t know that there was a manga, too. I’ll bet it has more drawings per episode than the cartoon does.
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### Author:  [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/8 "2009-10-08T21:31:06Z")
Why didn’t they have Dragonball Z comics when I was a kid back in the 60’s? It would have been miles ahead of getting mysterious urges and startling physiological responses from looking at Betty and Veronica in Archie comics.
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### Author:  [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)
#### Post date: [October 8, 2009, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/9 "2009-10-08T21:42:11Z")
Is it typical nowadays for school libraries to include graphic novels?
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### Author:  [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)
#### Post date: [October 9, 2009, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/10 "2009-10-09T00:22:39Z")
Back when my mom was an elementary school teacher, she kept a few comic books in her room, along with the rest of her personal collection of kids’ books. Her philosophy was that anything that got children reading was a good thing. I don’t know about the school library, though.
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### Author:  [@Jragon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jragon)
#### Post date: [October 9, 2009, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/11 "2009-10-09T01:34:43Z")
> [@Tengu](#):
>
> To the OP, I’m boggled by it being called ‘adult oriented’ - it’s a shonen title - aimed at older kids and teenagers (boys, the girl-aimed equivalent is shojo). The Japanese just have different ideas of what’s appropriate for that audience.
Yeah, Dragonball is like the poster boy (manga… thing) for shounen. I’ve heard the “aimed more at adults” argument before, and while it’s true some animation/manga are aimed at that audience (Seinen like, say, Elfen Leid or Berserk Or Josei like… er… I’ll get back to you) it’s a cultural difference of what’s considered appropriate for a given audience.
Though for an elementary school you could pretty easily argue Shounen is above that age group, I believe Shounen is 10+ in its material, which covers some of 4th and most of 5th grade I think. You could argue that Elementary School Libraries would do better to stock Kodomo for their kids. And lest anyone think Kodomo is too hard to find things people would recognize consider that both Pokemon and Astro Boy are often listed as Kodomo.
Edit - Tom, my high school (that I only graduated from a year or two ago) had a graphic novel section, albeit it was a bit small it had an okay mix of donated manga and things like Watchmen. Can’t speak for the younger age group schools though.
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### Author:  [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2009, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/12 "2009-10-10T21:17:59Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#):
>
> Is it typical nowadays for school libraries to include graphic novels?
I can’t say if it’s typical, but back in the 80’s my elementary school library had some hardcover collections of comics, such as Origins Of Marvel Comics, Bring On The Bad Guys, and Batman: From the 30’s to the 70’s. So it’s certainly not new to have such things.
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### Author:  [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2009, 9:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/13 "2009-10-10T21:24:17Z")
I checked the library listings, and apparently ouir town library has this manga. I don’t know of the schools do. It’s listed under “YA (Young Adult)”
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### Author:  [@JR\_Brown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JR_Brown)
#### Post date: [October 10, 2009, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/14 "2009-10-10T22:26:51Z")
Part of the problem, as [this essay](http://blog.newsarama.com/2009/10/09/maryland-county-councilman-wants-county-government-to-consider-gokus-penis-local-paper-has-the-shocking-details/) (mildly NSFW soapy seminunidy) explains, is that the volume in question is rated “Teen” by Viz, which means they consider it appropriate for ages 13+. So by putting it in an elementary/middle school library, the school may not be following the publisher’s age ratings.
In any case, it’s a few mildly raunchy jokes about boobs and ladyparts and a toddler boy running around pantsless. Most 9-year-olds have seen more explicit stuff on bathroom walls.
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### Author:  [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)
#### Post date: [October 11, 2009, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/our-local-school-library-shocked-to-find-dragonball-graphic-novel-is-kind-of-graphic/513047/15 "2009-10-11T03:00:13Z")
> [@Jragon](#):
>
> Edit - Tom, my high school (that I only graduated from a year or two ago) had a graphic novel section, albeit it was a bit small it had an okay mix of donated manga and things like Watchmen. Can’t speak for the younger age group schools though.
Don’t I feel old? I can’t speak for anyone younger, but I recall in the 1970s, our elementary school library included an anthology of _Tales from the Crypt_.
Watershed moment, lifting that off the shelf.