BBC NEWS | South Asia | Bangladesh fire leaves 22 dead There have been 2 fires lately in Bangladesh. There are children working in factories with doors chained shut. The attitude that was the robber barons is alive and well. It is just international thanks to CAFTA, NAFTa etc. It is our lot in life to help hold back the profiteers at any cost leaders. A fire in NYC much like these resulted in the Child Labor Laws . Because they are in a far away place we don’t care. (well it bothers me). The child labor and environmental laws should have gone around with the jobs.
Point is corporations by their basic structure will exploit . We can not trust them . They will cut back to increase profits at the expense of safety.
Yet another lucid post by gonzomax that relates to nothing at hand. Yes, some factory owners are dicks. So what?
All corporations are by nature. Lucid enough for you lucy. That is the point apparently beyond your grasp. It is set up that way. Therefore we watch them vigilantly.
xtisme and gonzomax, (and everyone else), this thread will proceed much more smoothly without any personal remarks about other posters.
[/ Moderating ]
Are what?
No, because your sentence makes no sense.
If you would have made a point, perhaps I could have grasped it.
It is set up what way?
I am fine with watching corporations. I think that if a corporation does something you don’t like, you should refuse to buy its products and tell others to do the same thing. If enough people dislike the corporation, it will go out of business.
Renob do you really believe that .? The Big Three made crappy autos forever. They are still standing. It is not a few aberrant corporations acting badly. It is a system that rewards corporations that take advantage of workers , safety and accounting practices. Just read what international reaction has been. The international corporations are causing much anti USA feelings in the world. We are exporting our soulless system all over the world.
Barely. As they faced competition from overseas they improved their product. Even with this improvement, however, they may still fold.
Consumers, and nothing else, “reward” corporations. If corporations are producing a product people like, that corporation succeeds.
Whatever. Our “soulless” system is producing a middle class in India, South Korea, Taiwan, etc. The free market system is improving the standard of living for millions around the globe and is generally recognized as extending the length and quality of life in nations that adopt it. You may not like it, and people who cannot compete may not like it, but you can’t deny that it is making life better for millions.
I hate to get too far off topic (although it seems inevitable in any thread in which gonzomax features heavily), but a large reason for the persistence of the big 3 automakers is governmental favors. Tariffs on foreign autos, subsidies, bailouts, as well as extremely cumbersome regulations that make entry into the market more difficult. This is part and parcel of govt regulation of industry–you can’t just say that govt should do good; you have to look at what it can reasonably be expected to do. Giving govt the power to regulate will often lead to such perverse outcomes.
Tom…normally I have no problem admitting when I’m wrong or have crossed the line. I have to say though that I don’t consider what I said to be insulting in either the spirit or the letter of the board rules. I simply said that he was wrong and asked him to prove himself. Please tell me what about my post you consider to warrent this warning.
-XT
Important thing, that often gets lost amidst the visceral reaction *“OMG, El Salvador? Honduras? Why, they are all barefoot peasants carrying coffee in mules, or hairy rebels up in the hills! The only people who can invest in industry are druglords!!!” * That annoys me, we should be paying attention to whether it’s a good shop or a bad shop, not to where it is.
I believe shipping maintenance to third world countries to save money will result in poorer quality work and cutting corners where it should not be done. It is a relatively new phenomenon and time will tell. Part of the reason is to evade regulation and inspection. That is all.
Some people believe that the earth is flat, or that JFK was killed by a shadowy conspircy, or that the moon landings were a hoax. IOW, people believe all manner of bullshit. Whats you EVIDENCE that this is the case? You say this is a new phenomenon…yet its been going on for quite some time…why haven’t we seen an uptick in problems thus far?
-XT
Not a Warning. Just a suggestion that personal digs are unhelpful. Particularly:
is an observation that is tied more to his posting than his argument.
Ok…fair enough. It was MEANT to reflect his posting in this thread (i.e. he is saying the same thing over an over without backing it up, in spite of facts cited by other posters that seemingly completely refute his assertions), but I can see where it could be taken as an insult. Especially since I happen to believe in the wider interperetation myself anyway. I’ll try and refrain from such things in future. He’s just a mondo frustrating poster.
-XT
XT does that crap so often it is on auto pilot. He always is snotty ,snarky and reeking of arrogance. I filter through it and try to locate what he is trying to say.
I do not accept that the data is in . I believe that the maintenance problems will show themselves in the future. That xt is why I do not simply agree with what you think of as proof.The stats are premature. The TV program I saw showed concern. I simply asked if anyone shared concern about this or the trend to outsource more and more vital and complex jobs. The outsourcing is getting gradually more and more complex. Originally they sent very routine work. Now complete rebuilds are getting shipped out.
I hope the TV program was wrong to be concerned.
Sorry, gonzo, but your theory here is as likely to be proven correct as your theory that oil companies were manipulating prices to influence the election last year. Face it, your conspiracy theories about corporations aren’t supported by facts.
I was going to post this myself. I remember studying this “condition” as far back as 6th grade when we were studying international vs. intranational trade (don’t think I’m all gifted, I’ve never heard intranational trade ever again). My teacher made a significant point about tariffs and trade balancing and what the effects of those eventually lead to. I thought he was full of it, but after college econ, I see now what he’s talking about, and his predictions about the big 3 are becoming even more true.
http://www.democracynow.org/article.pl?sid=04/12/31/1546207 Not through evolution but through deliberate planning is this imaginary group spreading markets band control.
While it doesn’'t bother me (coming from you), you had best watch the personal insults or Tom will be by to spank you again. One spanking per thread is enough for ME…and he seems to be in a spanking mood, as I thought his last one was rather weak (at least from my perspective). 
As for filtering out what I’m trying to say…its to laugh. I’m SAYING…where is the beef? Where is your proof or indictations that this is going to happen? Why don’t you ever respond to what people ask or cite in your threads, instead of simply rambling off on whatever course you already decided to take, regardless of anyone else’s input. Sam Stone has brought cites to your thread…you have ignored them. China Guy made an assertion that this outsourcing has been going on for some time…you ignored him. Others have asked you for something, anything, that indicates that your dire predictions are possible…you have ignored one and all. Why?
Fine…you could have said this earlier. Since the program of outsourcing maintenance has been going on for several years now, exactly how much time do you suppose its going to take before we start seeing a change in the statistics? Why haven’t we seen one yet? Aircraft maintenance is something that is continually ongoing after all, and one would exect that even a year of poor maintenance would be sufficient for problems to start cropping up…and accidents to start piling up. Yet this hasn’t happened. Why?
And for the most part you got your answer…some are concerned, but thus far their concerns are unfounded. I will be concerned when someone shows me there is a reason for concern…that safety has indeed slipped and that maintenance is down. The indication of this will be more frequent maintenance problems and/or higher statistics of accidents. Thus far, at lesat from what I’ve seen so far in THIS thread, neither of those things have come about.
You are asking the equivelent of why am I not afraid of an alien invasion next thursday. The reason I’m not afraid is I’ve seen no evidence that one is imminent. Show me some evidence and I’ll be more concerned. Thus far, as usual, you’ve shown nothing at all…just your usual unsupported assertions.
It was a TV show…take it with a grain of salt. Do your own research and see if there is indeed a problem. Don’t ever take a TV show at face value…in fact, its best to be automatically skeptical about most of them. If you are really interested and concerned, do some google searching on when maintenance first got outsourced by US airlines, and what the safety and maintenance records have been to date. If you feel you’ve put together enough evidence showing a declining safety record, THEN come back here and post it and we’ll see.
-XT
Oh look! A completely irrelevant link, with no context or discussion from gonzomax, about a book by a well known crank. Once again, thanks so much for your thoughtful contributions.