# Oxford comma question. **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [January 17, 2016, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438 "2016-01-17T21:05:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/1 "2016-01-17T21:05:53Z")
Is the Oxford commma used at Cambridge? ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/2 "2016-01-17T21:43:26Z")
Ha. Oxford comma is the term for now standard British usage. It does seem to have originated by association with Oxford printers. It is also called the serial comma. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 9:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/3 "2016-01-17T21:45:52Z")
Can’t say for sure if it’s used in the classroom, but in her book _Between You and Me_ professional proofreader/grammarian [Mary Norris](http://www.newyorker.com/contributors/mary-norris) claims with considerable glee that the serial comma is NOT used by Oxford’s business and marketing departments. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2016, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/4 "2016-01-17T21:56:38Z")
[4 Copy Editors Killed In Ongoing AP Style, Chicago Manual Gang Violence](http://www.theonion.com/article/4-copy-editors-killed-in-ongoing-ap-style-chicago--30806) > [@](#): > > Officials also stated that an innocent 35-year-old passerby who found himself caught up in a long-winded dispute over use of the serial, or Oxford, comma had died of a self-inflicted gunshot wound. ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 8:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/5 "2016-01-18T08:20:40Z")
I never heard the phrase “Oxford comma” until quite recently (and I went to Cambridge). I can’t even remember being taught a formula or rule for commas, but no-one’s ever contradicted my usage. ---
**Author:** ![Hari\_Seldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hari_seldon/32/5173_2.png) [@Hari\_Seldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hari_Seldon)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/6 "2016-01-18T14:14:57Z")
I didn’t think an Onion cite was allowed in post #4 on GQ. I call foul. ---
**Author:** ![whitetho](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whitetho/32/1059_2.png) [@whitetho](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/whitetho)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/7 "2016-01-18T14:32:49Z")
Fortunately I don’t need to use it because my parents _really were_ “Ayn Rand and God”. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/8 "2016-01-18T15:02:42Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > I didn’t think an Onion cite was allowed in post #4 on GQ. I call foul. As an erstwhile professional editor myself, I don’t think the Onion is exaggerating all that much.😉 In any case, I’m sure the OP itself is tongue-in-cheek. ETA: Given this, this is probably better suited to MPSIMS. ---
**Author:** ![Channing\_Idaho\_Banks](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/channing_idaho_banks/32/250_2.png) [@Channing\_Idaho\_Banks](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Channing_Idaho_Banks)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/9 "2016-01-18T16:05:22Z")
> [@PatrickLondon](#): > > I never heard the phrase “Oxford comma” until quite recently (and I went to Cambridge). I can’t even remember being taught a formula or rule for commas, but no-one’s ever contradicted my usage. I was going to say, I didn’t think the English worried about commas any more. ---
**Author:** ![GrumpyBunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/bc8723/32.png) [@GrumpyBunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrumpyBunny)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/10 "2016-01-18T19:02:29Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > As an erstwhile professional editor myself, I don’t think the Onion is exaggerating all that much.😉 Nope. During my years writing/editing, I had lively conversations about the Oxford comma many times. And I don’t want to remember discussing the semicolon with half-literate rednecks. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![APB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/8e8cbc/32.png) [@APB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/APB)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/11 "2016-01-18T19:29:43Z")
The actual answer to the OP is that Cambridge’s resistance is weakening. True, the [Cambridge University Press style guide](https://authornet.cambridge.org/information/academic/downloads/General%20style%20guidelines.pdf) merely demands consistency, although it does so rather grudgingly and the text of the style guide itself doesn’t use them. But other Cambridge style guides, such as those for [specific academic journals](http://journals.cambridge.org/images/fileUpload/documents/AFH_ifc.pdf) or [specific university faculties](http://www.hist.cam.ac.uk/undergraduate/style-guide), do now insist on them. This, needless to say, is a sign that Western Civilisation (or should that be western civilisation?) is doomed. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 8:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/12 "2016-01-18T20:42:09Z")
> [@GrumpyBunny](#): > > Nope. During my years writing/editing, I had lively conversations about the Oxford comma many times. And I don’t want to remember discussing the semicolon with half-literate rednecks. :smack: You think that’s bad, I have to deal with bilingual texts with English and Spanish translations side-by-side. Usually you can just go with one style guide for each language, but sometimes having two different conventions alongside one another makes it look like one is an error. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 18, 2016, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/13 "2016-01-18T23:11:02Z")
> [@whitetho](#): > > Fortunately I don’t need to use it because my parents _really were_ “Ayn Rand and God”. There actually is a counter example where the Oxford comma obfuscates the meaning in a similar manner to omitting it, but I’m blanking on it. Having spent my 20s in the journalism industry following AP style, we did not use the serial comma, but I’ve long since preferred its use to omitting it (which is what the Chicago Manual of Style prefers, anyway. I don’t really think of this as a US English vs UK English sort of difference, but rather a US journalism style vs rest of the world’s English sort of thing. Most Americans I know use the serial comma, too, unless they grew up writing for American journalistic publications.) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2016, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/14 "2016-01-19T02:34:50Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > There actually is a counter example where the Oxford comma obfuscates the meaning in a similar manner to omitting it, but I’m blanking on it. Having spent my 20s in the journalism industry following AP style, we did not use the serial comma, but I’ve long since preferred its use to omitting it (which is what the Chicago Manual of Style prefers, anyway. I don’t really think of this as a US English vs UK English sort of difference, but rather a US journalism style vs rest of the world’s English sort of thing. Most Americans I know use the serial comma, too, unless they grew up writing for American journalistic publications.) I’d really like to see that counterexample, because this is the first time I’ve heard that one exists. It’s hard to imagine. The point, though, is that anybody with imagination and a basic grasp on English can think up a zillion examples where the lack of a comma obfuscates comprehension so one counterexample means nothing. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2016, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/15 "2016-01-19T03:23:55Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > I’d really like to see that counterexample, because this is the first time I’ve heard that one exists. It’s hard to imagine. The point, though, is that anybody with imagination and a basic grasp on English can think up a zillion examples where the lack of a comma obfuscates comprehension so one counterexample means nothing. When it’s unclear whether the terms are separate items or can be read as one in apposition to another, using a serial comma can create confusion. _To my mother, Ayn Rand, and God._ Using a serial comma creates confusion, for while it’s possible for one’s mother to be Ayn Rand, it isn’t possible for one’s mother to be Ayn Rand and God. However, the _AP Stylebook_ doesn’t say never use a comma with a conjunction; it merely says “do not put a comma before the conjunction in a simple series.” If omitting the final comma will screw things up, then use a comma. The Stylebook also refers the reader to consult Webster’s New World Dictionary, of which I don’t have a copy handy. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2016, 3:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/16 "2016-01-19T03:48:47Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > When it’s unclear whether the terms are separate items or can be read as one in apposition to another, using a serial comma can create confusion. Yes, that’s what I was thinking of–when the comma can be used to set off an appositive. There’s some arguments and examples against the [Oxford comma here](http://www.businessinsider.com/do-you-need-the-oxford-comma-2013-9). Like I said, I prefer the Oxford comma to the AP stylistic choice to avoid it, but ambiguity can be created either way. Personally, I just think the Oxford comma reduces ambiguity more often than it creates it, which is why I personally prefer it, even though professionally I’ve most often needed to avoid the Oxford comma. And, yes, AP Style does encourage the use of the Oxford comma in cases where omitting it causes ambiguity. ---
**Author:** ![Raygun99](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/6f9a4e/32.png) [@Raygun99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Raygun99)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2016, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/17 "2016-01-19T03:54:24Z")
The answer is actually secret door number 3: if it’s causing confusion, reword the sentence. ---
**Author:** ![JacobSwan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a6a055/32.png) [@JacobSwan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JacobSwan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2016, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/oxford-comma-question/743438/18 "2016-01-19T13:33:30Z")
Police are still appealing for witnesses to help identify an unknown man who was discovered uncoscious near Cowley. Oops, I misread the title, that’s the Oxford Coma Question.:)🙂