# PA Chainsaw Massacre **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 2, 2015, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582 "2015-04-02T02:32:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2015, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/21 "2015-04-02T17:10:02Z")
> [@storyteller0910](#): > > I cannot imagine what sort of frame of reference would lead to killing yourself with a chainsaw. Chainsaws do not have a frame of reference. If you want that, use a wood chipper. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2015, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/22 "2015-04-02T17:19:23Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Take note: this is what anti-gun legislation will inevitably lead to. I can see it now **ATF** becomes **ATF&C**. ---
**Author:** ![MrSquishy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9e5f3/32.png) [@MrSquishy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrSquishy)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2015, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/23 "2015-04-02T21:35:06Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Take note: this is what anti-gun legislation will inevitably lead to. It’s sad that I feel like I need to know what your political views are to be able to tell if this is a joke or not. ---
**Author:** ![Ike\_Witt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ike_witt/32/283_2.png) [@Ike\_Witt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ike_Witt)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2015, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/24 "2015-04-02T21:56:55Z")
> [@El\_Kabong](#): > > Take note: this is what anti-gun legislation will inevitably lead to. Yet it happened in a world full of easily accessible handguns. ---
**Author:** ![Penfeather](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/penfeather/32/384_2.png) [@Penfeather](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Penfeather)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2015, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/25 "2015-04-02T23:02:07Z")
> [@storyteller0910](#): > > I cannot imagine what sort of frame of reference would lead to killing yourself with a chainsaw. You’d have to completely lose your head. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [April 2, 2015, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/26 "2015-04-02T23:45:53Z")
> [@Boyo\_Jim](#): > > Chainsaws do not have a frame of reference. If you want that, use a wood chipper. Chainsaw and wood chipper - [Connecticut divorce](http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=connecticut%20divorce)… ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/27 "2015-04-03T03:09:23Z")
> [@MrSquishy](#): > > It’s sad that I feel like I need to know what your political views are to be able to tell if this is a joke or not. I’m a person who feels, like my namesake, that a properly-wielded guitar is sufficient armament for most situations I’m likely to end up in. [Quote=Ike Witt] Yet it happened in a world full of easily accessible handguns. [/Quote] No reason why anyone would be aware of this, but a few years back, my (then) 18-year-old nephew killed himself with an easily accessible handgun. So yeah, don’t I know it. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 7:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/28 "2015-04-03T07:51:19Z")
> [@Monty](#): > > Yet again, we have people looking for a rational explanation for an irrational act. The dude may not have been responsible for his acts, aka “legally insane”. This Board is full of armchair psychiatrists. I also dont get the “how could he do this to his kids???” Never assume a parent gives a shit about, or loves their kids. I’ve seen plenty of parents driven crazy by them. Its possible he didn’t give two fucks about them nor care if little Johnny saw him and Mommy all over the floor cut up like they ran into a pizza slicer. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/29 "2015-04-03T14:46:17Z")
> [@russian\_heel](#): > > This Board is full of armchair psychiatrists. > > I also dont get the “how could he do this to his kids???” > > Never assume a parent gives a shit about, or loves their kids. I’ve seen plenty of parents driven crazy by them. Its possible he didn’t give two fucks about them nor care if little Johnny saw him and Mommy all over the floor cut up like they ran into a pizza slicer. I just asked Occam, and he said it’s much more likely the guy was a nut roll. But then, he’s only a lawnchair psychiatrist. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/30 "2015-04-03T15:02:28Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > I just asked Occam, and he said it’s much more likely the guy was a nut roll. But then, he’s only a lawnchair psychiatrist. Once again, this idea that anyone who commits a horrific act must be insane, doesn’t help a thing. It’s just a simple excuse to try and fit these horrible acts into safer world view. But the fact is sane and rational people torture, murder, and kill other people much more often than those who are insane. Our jails are full of people who have killed or tortured others, yet were found not to be insane. The long history of human on human atrocities has shown that sane and rational human beings are perfectly capable of committing unthinkable crimes, and hand-waving their actions away as “insane” does nothing. Too many people seem to confuse narcissism, self-absorbation, hatred, and a lack of empathy with insanity. ---
**Author:** ![MysteryFellow63427](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a88e4f/32.png) [@MysteryFellow63427](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MysteryFellow63427)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 3:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/31 "2015-04-03T15:06:20Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Once again, this idea that anyone who commits a horrific act must be insane, doesn’t help a thing. It’s just a simple excuse to try and fit these horrible acts into safer world view. But the fact is sane and rational people torture, murder, and kill other people much more often than those who are insane. Our jails are full of people who have killed or tortured others, yet were found not to be insane. The long history of human on human atrocities has shown that sane and rational human beings are perfectly capable of committing unthinkable crimes, and hand-waving their actions away as “insane” does nothing. Too many people seem to confuse narcissism, self-absorbation, hatred, and a lack of empathy with insanity. Hear hear. There’s a difference between “insane” and “sane, but irrational and filled with vile hatred.” ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 3:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/32 "2015-04-03T15:10:20Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > Once again, this idea that anyone who commits a horrific act must be insane, doesn’t help a thing. It’s just a simple excuse to try and fit these horrible acts into safer world view. But the fact is sane and rational people torture, murder, and kill other people much more often than those who are insane. Our jails are full of people who have killed or tortured others, yet were found not to be insane. The long history of human on human atrocities has shown that sane and rational human beings are perfectly capable of committing unthinkable crimes, and hand-waving their actions away as “insane” does nothing. Too many people seem to confuse narcissism, self-absorbation, hatred, and a lack of empathy with insanity. Are you referring to the legal requirement of knowing right from wrong? If that’s the case I’m sure they were sane. However, their decision making processed short circuited at the time of their crime if, even for an instant, it allowed them to do things normal “sane” people don’t do. Whether it was heat of passion, revenge, or whatever, that person’s thought process was far from normal when he fired up the chain saw. ---
**Author:** ![Hamlet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hamlet/32/2818_2.png) [@Hamlet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hamlet)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/33 "2015-04-03T15:22:26Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Are you referring to the legal requirement of knowing right from wrong? Yes, I am using the definition of insanity to argue about the use of the term insanity. I am not using “not quite “normal”” as the definition of insane. > [@Morgenstern](#): > > If that’s the case I’m sure they were sane. However, their decision making processed short circuited at the time of their crime if, even for an instant, it allowed them to do things normal “sane” people don’t do. Whether it was heat of passion, revenge, or whatever, that person’s thought process was far from normal when he fired up the chain saw. I think we would disagree on the use of the term “normal”. I think things like short-sightedness, struggling with emotions, and not making perfectly rational decisions at any given time are normal for human beings. It’s not like every “normal” person makes the correct, rational decision every time. ---
**Author:** ![Boyo\_Jim](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/87869e/32.png) [@Boyo\_Jim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boyo_Jim)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 3:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/34 "2015-04-03T15:37:09Z")
I dunno. If someone needs killin’. and a chainsaw is the only handy tool, then using it is perfectly rational. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/35 "2015-04-03T16:15:25Z")
> [@Hamlet](#): > > … > > I think we would disagree on the use of the term “normal”. I think things like short-sightedness, struggling with emotions, and not making perfectly rational decisions at any given time are normal for human beings. It’s not like every “normal” person makes the correct, rational decision every time. Certainly, everyone has experienced such struggles at one time or another. But, I doubt very much that a normal response to these issues is to use a chain saw to resolve the problem. In that regard, insanity finds its equal in extreme irrationality. ---
**Author:** ![lieu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c2a13f/32.png) [@lieu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lieu)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/36 "2015-04-03T17:33:57Z")
> [@storyteller0910](#): > > I cannot imagine what sort of frame of reference would lead to killing yourself with a chainsaw. _Hey check it out, my fingers look like prunes._ ---
**Author:** ![you\_with\_the\_face](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)\ **Post date:** [April 3, 2015, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/37 "2015-04-03T17:44:58Z")
Wonder if the guy was prone to impulsiveness. If he was enraged by something she said or did while already holding the chainsaw, he might’ve just decided to attack her with it in a fit of angry stupidity. You don’t have been crazy to be a slave to your reptilian brain. This is definitely the stuff of nightmares. ---
**Author:** ![russian\_heel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/f05b48/32.png) [@russian\_heel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/russian_heel)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2015, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/38 "2015-04-04T20:20:42Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > I just asked Occam, and he said it’s much more likely the guy was a nut roll. But then, he’s only a lawnchair psychiatrist. I prefer the Dollar Shave Club. ---
**Author:** ![TBG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c89c15/32.png) [@TBG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TBG)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/39 "2015-04-06T20:10:39Z")
Are we sure he intended to kill himself? Maybe after chopping up wifey he just started swinging the chainsaw around like Leatherface and lost control and killed himself accidentally. In any event, no sane, normal person would kill themselves, well, by any method really (but that’s a whole nother discussion), but by a chainsaw in particular. And if we do assume the suicide by chainsaw was intentional, the kids are probably lucky (well, relatively lucky) that he went off the deep end when they weren’t home or the whole family would likely be dead now. Yes, it sucks for them (understatement of the year), they will have a hard time ahead, but at least they’ve still got their lives and each other. ---
**Author:** ![Minnie\_Luna](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4bbf92/32.png) [@Minnie\_Luna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Minnie_Luna)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2015, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582/40 "2015-04-06T20:26:53Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Are we sure he intended to kill himself? Maybe after chopping up wifey he just started swinging the chainsaw around like Leatherface and lost control and killed himself accidentally. In any event, no sane, normal person would kill themselves, well, by any method really (but that’s a whole nother discussion), but by a chainsaw in particular. > > And if we do assume the suicide by chainsaw was intentional, the kids are probably lucky (well, relatively lucky) that he went off the deep end when they weren’t home or the whole family would likely be dead now. Yes, it sucks for them (understatement of the year), they will have a hard time ahead, but at least they’ve still got their lives and each other. The thought that entered my head, was how hard it would have to be to kill yourself with a chainsaw. The natural reaction to pain is to withdraw from whatever is causing the pain. I guess you would have to be in a very altered mental state to hold a large, heavy object up to yourself and inflict enough damage to cause death. Don’t most chainsaws have switches that have to be engaged for it to run the blade? Like he couldn’t just place the saw on the ground and jump onto it, he had to be able to hold the “trigger” down and do it. Ugh, the mental picture is very disturbing. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/pa-chainsaw-massacre/716582.md?page=1)